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Thread: Looking for information on the Gaulish language and the languages of modern France

  1. #11
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    Just an update on what I've found on this topic:

    I posted in the linguistics section to try and get information on the Langues d'oc and related languages, but I've got no real information from anyone there yet.
    I found two wikipedia pages, one in French and one in Occitan that state that Occitan has both less Celtic and less Germanic influence than French.

    So far, all in all, it looks like:
    French and the oil languages definitely have some notable Gaulish influence, but the degree or significance is debated
    Occitan and the oc languages only have very little if any Gaulish influence
    Breton may have some Gaulish influence but it also might not have any.
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English (possibly containing some Welsh ancestry) 31.25%, Eastern European and Eastern German (Galicia, Poland) 25%, Scottish 17.96%, Scotch-Irish 12.5%, French 8.2%, Native American 1.95%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be determined with complete certainty: there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English. The rest could include Spanish, Norwegian, German, and French, but these percentages would be minuscule.

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  3. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Just an update on what I've found on this topic:

    I posted in the linguistics section to try and get information on the Langues d'oc and related languages, but I've got no real information from anyone there yet.
    I found two wikipedia pages, one in French and one in Occitan that state that Occitan has both less Celtic and less Germanic influence than French.

    So far, all in all, it looks like:
    French and the oil languages definitely have some notable Gaulish influence, but the degree or significance is debated
    Occitan and the oc languages only have very little if any Gaulish influence
    Breton may have some Gaulish influence but it also might not have any.
    I read on a Swedish forum that one of the few clear and noticeable morphological influences that Gaulish has had on French is their weird way of counting with exempli gratia soixante-onze (eng. sixty-eleven):

    https://translate.google.se/translat...50%23p67407950
    Quote Originally Posted by Hamilkar
    Mnjä. En comes from the Latin inde, which means from there in Classical Latin, but already in the late imperial Late Latin the meaning of it, both according to Baumgartner and Menard's French etymological dictionary and according to Salenius' Latin-Swedish dictionary, so already the Late Latin had a word with the same scope of significance as the modern French en. Y comes from Latin ibi, meaning there, which has undergone a similar development to there.

    However, Hubert expresses no consensus with those views, especially no contemporary (the French-language original of the book you apostrophes were written more than a hundred years ago, during a period when it was generally modern to make as much essence as possible of nos ancêtres les Gaulois) and he was also not a Romanist by the union, but primarily archaeologist and secondly sociologist. A modern and popular book on the history of the French language such as Mireille Huchon's, usually indicates the number count (soixante-onze etc) as the only clear example of grammatical/morphological influence on today's French from the Gallic substrate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nino90 View Post
    Interesting thread. I always wonder how much impact Latin and Romans had on French and Iberian languages.
    Since Italic and Celtic prop derived from the same origin. Same thing with the genetics. Did the romans impact French to be more "med" than before?
    The structure of French is completely Romance/Vulgar Latin. Before the Romans they spoke other languages such as inter alia Gaulish.

    https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1005202922794356738
    Quote Originally Posted by Nassim Nicholas Taleb
    Point is; if you're not Med, you'll never understand the Mediterranean. You can spend 31 y in Oxford reading "classics", all that sh*t, & still understand nothing about the Mediterranean. Now, if you're not Med, the closest you'll ever get is via squid ink & Moustaki. Salve.

    3) The French have tried to become Meds for 2000 years. They can't: except for spots, Germanics speaking a Latin language.

    4) For instance to be Med you need to both disrespect hard work and respect success, exactly the opposite of the "work ethics" & the worship of labor in the non-necessarily Prostestant North.

    5) Another reason there large entities don't work in the Med, causing a scale problem: you cannot be alpha if you are not free & self-employed (or the boss), an employee of Goldman Sachs is of a lower status than a local doctor.

    6) To understand the Romans, essential Meds, who shunned doing things themselves but praised builders:

    "Caesar pontem fecit" means Ceasar *had a bridge built* (by others), not "built a bridge" as usually translated.

    Tr. into French would be "a fait bâtir un pont" not "a bâti".
    https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/860517970296090624
    Quote Originally Posted by Nassim Nicholas Taleb
    There is very little that is Mediterranean about the "French" (north of Avignon), except, of course, their language.
    Last edited by NixYO; 04-28-2019 at 06:18 PM.
    “And, furthermore, that some people have a sex life and others don’t just because some are more attractive than others. I wanted to acknowledge that if people don’t have a sex life, it’s not for some moral reason, it’s just because they’re ugly. Once you’ve said it, it sounds obvious, but I wanted to say it.” — Michel Houellebecq

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  5. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nino90 View Post
    Interesting thread. I always wonder how much impact Latin and Romans had on French and Iberian languages.
    Since Italic and Celtic prop derived from the same origin. Same thing with the genetics. Did the romans impact French to be more "med" than before?
    Genetically speaking, only in the very south of Gaul (Provincia)
    Eurogenes G25 (ancient): 38% Corded_Ware_Baltic_Early+38% Scotland_N+24% Anatolia_EBA

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  7. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Camulogène Rix View Post
    Genetically speaking, only in the very south of Gaul (Provincia)
    Some relevant maps:



    ^^ This map above misses most of Liguria for some reason!













    Last edited by NixYO; 04-28-2019 at 02:00 PM.
    “And, furthermore, that some people have a sex life and others don’t just because some are more attractive than others. I wanted to acknowledge that if people don’t have a sex life, it’s not for some moral reason, it’s just because they’re ugly. Once you’ve said it, it sounds obvious, but I wanted to say it.” — Michel Houellebecq

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     Camulogène Rix (04-28-2019),  Helen (07-04-2019),  sktibo (04-29-2019)

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