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Thread: Gene Flow Between Southern and South-eastern Asia

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    Gene Flow Between Southern and South-eastern Asia

    Of course, not counting the Andamanese tribes like Onge, Jarawa who are isolated from any outside influence or the Tibeto Burmans of NE India and Nepal who are obviously not indigenous South Asian genetically.

    Asking this because I read somewhere that they found very high levels of AASI ancestry among Austroasiatics of Eastern India especially the Juang who are a mix between Nicobarese-like+AASI+ASI (which is basically 75% AASI with 25% Iranian farmer type admix): http://www.brownpundits.com/2018/09/...e-cultivators/

    Quoting Shaikorth in Eurogenes:
    Originally Posted by Shaikorth from Eurogenes
    High Proportions of AASI Ancestry in Present-Day Austroasiatic Speakers. The Juang are an Austroasiatic speaking group in India which our PCA analyses in Data S4 show have a low proportion of West Eurasian ancestry. We were unable to model Juang as a mix of ASI and a source that was a clade with Nicobarese (isolated Austroasiatic speakers from the Nicobar Islands). However qpGraph obtains an excellent fit by adding a substantial component of AASI ancestry to Juang (Figure 3C). In other words, the Juang have too much AASI- related ancestry relative to ancient Iranian agriculturalists to be a
    simple two-way mixture of a Nicobarese-related population and ASI. These results suggest that Austroasiatic speaking groups were in peninsular India at a time when there were still populations that had little if any Iranian
    agriculturalist-related admixture
    The Juang has been modelled as 60% Nicobarese-like and 40% ASI (which is around 25% Iranian Farmer). This would make the Juang only 10% West Eurasian (of Iran Farmer and maybe some ANE admix) with them being predominantly AASI and East Asian then?



    So the question is: would Austroasiatic tribes like Juang, Bonda have very minor West Eurasian admix compared to most South Asians and how much in percentage? Also would they hae the lowest West Eurasian in South Asia outside of Andamanese and Tibeto Burmans?

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    Yeah, tribes like Juang and Bonda have very low West Eurasian mixture due to isolation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulin View Post
    Yeah, tribes like Juang and Bonda have very low West Eurasian mixture due to isolation.
    How much do you think they have? I think some Gonds might also have very minor West Eurasian.

    Saw your previous comment on Nagas, Mizos. Yeah they do not really have West Eurasian admix despite living in the region. Geographic isolation perhaps?

    I think the Burmese, Thai, Cambodian and Malay who live in close proximity to rhe subcontinent could have some West Eurasian admix from their South Asian ancestry though. What do you think?
    Last edited by Tsakhur; 04-22-2019 at 03:42 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsakhur View Post
    How much do you think they have?

    Saw your previous comment on Nagas, Mizos. Yeah they do not really have West Eurasian admix.

    I think the Burmese and Thai who live in nearby regions could have minor West Eurasian admix from their South Asian ancestry though. What do you think?
    Both Burmese and Thai along with Khmer/Malay/Cham and a lot of Indonesian groups have up to 5-10% South Asian mixture on average, as well as y-dna lineages like R1, J and H due to Indian migration there. Bamar are the most South Asian shifted among populations tested, but I'd wager the Rakhine would be the most South Asian shifted group from Burma. I'll try to model the available populations on Poi's G25 runner once my exams are over.

    related content: https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2018/...theast-asians/

    An image taken from Razib's blog:

    Last edited by Kulin; 04-22-2019 at 03:50 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulin View Post
    Both Burmese and Thai along with Khmer/Malay/Cham and a lot of Indonesian groups have up to 5-10% South Asian mixture on average, as well as y-dna lineages like R1, J and H due to Indian migration there. Bamar are the most South Asian shifted among populations tested, but I'd wager the Rakhine would be the most South Asian shifted group from Burma. I'll try to model the available populations on Poi's G25 runner once my exams are over.

    related content: https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2018/...theast-asians/

    An image taken from Razib's blog:

    That is all true. Yep Burmese and Rakhine are indeed the most South Asian shifted genetically. They can be up to 20% or more South Asian. I think they could have some West Eurasian admix as well.

    I will try to run the SE Asian samples on nmonte as well.

    Btw how much West Eurasian do the Juang and Bonda and some Gonds have? Like 10% and less?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsakhur View Post
    That is all true. Yep Burmese and Rakhine are indeed the most South Asian shifted genetically. They can be up to 20% or more South Asian. I think they could have some West Eurasian admix as well.

    I will try to run the SE Asian samples on nmonte as well.

    Btw how much West Eurasian do the Juang and Bonda and some Gonds have? Like 10% and less?
    Not sure about Bonda, but Juang have around 12-14% West Eurasian, while Gonds are significantly more West Eurasian at 30-34%. Gonds are Dravidian speaking from Central India, and not Austroasiatic like the former two.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulin View Post
    Both Burmese and Thai along with Khmer/Malay/Cham and a lot of Indonesian groups have up to 5-10% South Asian mixture on average, as well as y-dna lineages like R1, J and H due to Indian migration there. Bamar are the most South Asian shifted among populations tested, but I'd wager the Rakhine would be the most South Asian shifted group from Burma. I'll try to model the available populations on Poi's G25 runner once my exams are over.

    related content: https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2018/...theast-asians/

    An image taken from Razib's blog:

    "sample": "Burmese:Average",
    "fit": 2.4202,
    "Tibetan_Averaged": 44.17,
    "Dai_Averaged": 43.33,
    "Velamas_Averaged": 9.17,
    "Uttar_Pradesh_Averaged": 3.33,
    "closestDistances": [
    "Tibetan_Averaged:Averaged: 8.960879",
    "Dai_Averaged:Averaged: 12.145803",
    "Uttar_Pradesh_Averaged:Averaged: 37.091457",
    "Velamas_Averaged:Averaged: 38.482451"

    Here's a quick model for the Burmese. Not sure how much sense it makes but it's giving around 12.5% South Asian.

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    Alright before I go to sleep, I checked the distances between me and four major SEA populations. Note that I am around 12% East Asian myself (both Austroasiatic and Tibeto-Burman). Ignore the modelling.

    [
    {
    "sample": "Bengali_Bangladesh:Kulin_AGUser",
    "fit": 30.5741,
    "Thai": 85,
    "Burmese": 15,
    "Cambodian": 0,
    "Malay": 0,
    "closestDistances": [
    "Thai: DCH002: 30.59000",
    "Burmese:bumaBR50: 31.09185",
    "Thai: DCH008: 31.26932",
    "Thai: DCH010: 31.29460",
    "Burmese:bumaBR54: 31.81738",
    "Thai: DCH006: 31.84778",
    "Thai: DCH011: 31.96885",
    "Malay:SGVP00120: 32.46168",
    "Thai: DCH012: 33.09082",
    "Thai:CHI007: 33.87451",
    "Burmese:bumaBR55: 34.98634",
    "Thai: DCH009: 35.20890",
    "Cambodian:HGDP00713: 35.63151",
    "Malay:SGVP00091: 36.05587",
    "Cambodian:HGDP00711: 36.42300",
    "Malay:SGVP00089: 36.60319",
    "Thai: DCH007: 37.72392",
    "Malay:SGVP00026: 39.02790",
    "Thai:CHI034: 40.33823",
    "Cambodian:HGDP00712: 40.37542"
    ]
    }
    ]

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    Quote Originally Posted by FrostAssassin0701 View Post
    "sample": "Burmese:Average",
    "fit": 2.4202,
    "Tibetan_Averaged": 44.17,
    "Dai_Averaged": 43.33,
    "Velamas_Averaged": 9.17,
    "Uttar_Pradesh_Averaged": 3.33,
    "closestDistances": [
    "Tibetan_Averaged:Averaged: 8.960879",
    "Dai_Averaged:Averaged: 12.145803",
    "Uttar_Pradesh_Averaged:Averaged: 37.091457",
    "Velamas_Averaged:Averaged: 38.482451"

    Here's a quick model for the Burmese. Not sure how much sense it makes but it's giving around 12.5% South Asian.
    What modelling did you use for that? Is it Nmonte?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsakhur View Post
    What modelling did you use for that? Is it Nmonte?
    Yeah, it's Poi's tool

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