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Thread: Saka, Scythians, Sarmatians & Huns: Overview (G25 Data)

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coldmountains View Post
    Well Cossacks had a culture very much influenced by tatars and steppe people. Their lifestyle, hair style and clothes were to some extents derived by them. Even the term Cossack is of turkic origin and related to the ethnonym "Kazakh". They were of diverse ethnic origin and there were east slavs, poles, tatars, vlachs and other ethnic groups among them. Genetically they are predominately south russian/east ukrainian-like and don't stand out from other East Slavs in the region but some of them show more balkan or recent steppe ancestry.

    The rest of your post i don't understand to be honest. But i would like to say that just because ancient Scythians lived in modern day Ukraine, modern day people in Ukraine have not automatically Scythian ancestry. Sharing the same geography but living in very different times and ecological zones is not really an argument for a genetic connection. Steppe Ukraine, where scythians were native was just recently populated by Slavs and the local population with a scythian substrate (Tatars) was pretty much replaced.
    Many Zaporozhian Cossacks left from northern regions of former Polish Lithuanian commonwealth and settled Ukrainian Steppe, also part of Polish Lithuanian commonwealth. Many were poor peasant stock of Baltic regions, that is their origin and I am descended from them also no shame in that, why you rewrite our history that we are descended from Astrakhan Cossacks or something with a elevated CHG, Mongol admixtures. This not my people, you have some knowledge of my people but then you have holes in theories. There is also Ukrainian Cossacks who have a similar genetic as my Father who is Pole, you mention some info on them.
    nMonte: "Latvia_north-eastern": 62.17,
    "Macedonia_FYROM": 18.5,
    "Pomak": 10,
    "Tajik": 2.83,
    "North_Albania": 2.5,
    "Moroccan_North": 1.83,
    "Komi": 1.33,
    "Tunisian_Berber_Chenini": 0.83,

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alain View Post
    I have 5% and my dad 16%
    European-BA 53.6%
    Beaker Central Europe 28.0%
    Beaker Britain 11.5%
    Czech EBA 6.6%
    Balkans Bronze Age 4.6%
    Beaker Iberia 2.9%

    Steppe-MLBA-West 14.1%
    Sintashta MLBA 9.9%
    Steppe MLBA 4.2%

    Saka/Hun/Sarmatian 13.5%
    Saka TienShan B 5.1%
    Sarmatian 3.1%
    Saka TienShan A 2.4%
    Hun TienShan B 1.6%
    Hun TienShan A 1.3%

    W Asian-BA/Chl 8.1%
    Anatolia MLBA 2.8%
    Iran Chalcolithic 2.2%
    Armenia MLBA 2.1%
    Hajji Firuz Chalcolithic 1.0%

    Steppe-MLBA-East 7.8%
    Maitan MLBA 7.0%
    Krasnoyarsk MLBA 0.8%

    African 2.2%
    Eastern African 2.2%

    Indus Valley Civilization 0.7%
    Saidu Sharif IA 0.7%

    Native American 0.1%
    Karitiana 0.1%
    nMonte: "Latvia_north-eastern": 62.17,
    "Macedonia_FYROM": 18.5,
    "Pomak": 10,
    "Tajik": 2.83,
    "North_Albania": 2.5,
    "Moroccan_North": 1.83,
    "Komi": 1.33,
    "Tunisian_Berber_Chenini": 0.83,

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mykhailo View Post
    Many Zaporozhian Cossacks left from northern regions of former Polish Lithuanian commonwealth and settled Ukrainian Steppe, also part of Polish Lithuanian commonwealth. Many were poor peasant stock of Baltic regions, that is their origin and I am descended from them also no shame in that, why you rewrite our history that we are descended from Astrakhan Cossacks or something with a elevated CHG, Mongol admixtures. This not my people, you have some knowledge of my people but then you have holes in theories. There is also Ukrainian Cossacks who have a similar genetic as my Father who is Pole, you mention some info on them.

    niemand will Sie schlecht machen und keiner soll sich für seine Abstammung stehen und Kipchak tauchen erst im 7 Jahrhundert auf aus dem Kasachischen Raum in die Russichen/ Ukrainischen steppen und Skythen zählen zu den Vorfahren von Krimtataren das darf man nicht leugnen damit verletzt man die Leute , ja die Kipchak zahlen auch dazu aber wozu der streit , die Tataren sind Scythian und Ukrainer sind Slawen beides Menschen. Tataren haben auch eine Slawische Beimischung aber auch Slawen haben eine leichte Skythische beimischung je nach Region , ich glaube die Rumänen haben sogar etwas mehr von der Steppe. lasst alle erstmal abwarten und Tee trinken auf neue DNA studien
    no one wants to make you bad and no one should stand for his descent and Kipchak appear only in the 7th century from the Kazakh region in the Russian / Ukrainian steppes and Scythians are among the ancestors of Crimean Tatars that one can not deny it hurt people, yes, the Kipchaks pay too, but why the one argues, the Tartars are Scythians and Ukrainians are Slavs both men. Tartars also have a Slavic admixture but also Slavs have a slight Scythian mix depending on the region, I think the Romanians even have a bit more of the steppe. Let everyone wait and drink tea on new DNA studies
    Alain Dad
    Y-DNA R1a-Y33 Eastern Corderd Ware Culture Baltoslavic/ old Pruzzen
    H76 czech Republic/England (Celtic tribes ?) W3a1d Yamnaya Culture, Samara /Pontic steppe
    Scytho-sarmatian.

    My FTDNA autosomal

    East Europe 82%
    Southeast Europe 14%
    Finland 2%
    West and Central Europe 1%

  4. #54
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    sorry my phone is spinning and broken fingers mistyped
    Alain Dad
    Y-DNA R1a-Y33 Eastern Corderd Ware Culture Baltoslavic/ old Pruzzen
    H76 czech Republic/England (Celtic tribes ?) W3a1d Yamnaya Culture, Samara /Pontic steppe
    Scytho-sarmatian.

    My FTDNA autosomal

    East Europe 82%
    Southeast Europe 14%
    Finland 2%
    West and Central Europe 1%

  5. #55
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    It may be that Scythian Ukraine sample seems so Mediterranean because these Scythian mingled with Greek settlers (contact zone / Black Sea coast)
    Alain Dad
    Y-DNA R1a-Y33 Eastern Corderd Ware Culture Baltoslavic/ old Pruzzen
    H76 czech Republic/England (Celtic tribes ?) W3a1d Yamnaya Culture, Samara /Pontic steppe
    Scytho-sarmatian.

    My FTDNA autosomal

    East Europe 82%
    Southeast Europe 14%
    Finland 2%
    West and Central Europe 1%

  6. #56
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    Actually Scythian Ukraine was more Baltic than Scythian Hungary when I checked with monte 2 pops.
    Hungary
    Ukraine - 100%
    Baltic BA - 0%

    Ukraine
    Hungary - 75%
    Baltic BA - 25%

    Something like that. Now too lazy to re-rum.

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  8. #57
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    There is so much genetic variation among the Scythians, it seems that you didn't have to be born a Scyth to be a part of their community," says Anders Götherström, Professor at the Department of Archaeology and Classical Studies, Stockholm University.

    This is likely the strategy needed for the group to have been able to grow as fast, expand as vast and to remain established for as long as they did. The findings emphasize the importance of assimilation to maintain Scythian dominance around the Black Sea region.

    "It also sheds light on their attitude towards conquered people. Scythians are often thought of as an extremely aggressive group, but their gradual genetic expansion show us that they were also a group prepared to interact with and take in new people. For example, in one burial ground we found individuals of different genetic background buried according to Scythian tradition. This tells us that Scythians seem to have incorporated people from other groups into their families and their community," says Maja Krzewińska, researcher at the Department of Archaeology and Classical Studies, Stockholm
    Alain Dad
    Y-DNA R1a-Y33 Eastern Corderd Ware Culture Baltoslavic/ old Pruzzen
    H76 czech Republic/England (Celtic tribes ?) W3a1d Yamnaya Culture, Samara /Pontic steppe
    Scytho-sarmatian.

    My FTDNA autosomal

    East Europe 82%
    Southeast Europe 14%
    Finland 2%
    West and Central Europe 1%

  9. #58
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    Alain, I can think of two tribes which assimilated or were mixed with "Scythians". Notably the Tauri in Crimea, who were later absorbed by the Goths and Alans and the Agathyrsi in ancient Dacia, they were a mixture of Scythians and Dacians.

    I should add that Scythian was a very broad term, especially when used by Romans and Greeks. We see some Gothic people referred to as "Scythians" this was more of a way of describing where they came from, similar to how people once referred to all Western Europeans as Franks.
    Last edited by spruithean; 05-17-2019 at 04:28 PM.

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  11. #59
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    "Agathyrsi (Greek: Ἀγάθυρσοι) were a people of Scythian, or mixed Dacian-Scythian origin, who in the time of Herodotus occupied the plain of the Maris (Mures), in the mountainous part of ancient Dacia now known as Transylvania, Romania. Their ruling class seems to have been of Scythian origin."

    The Scythian arrival to the Carpathian area is dated to 700 BC. The Agathyrsi existence is archaeologically attested by the Ciumbrud inhumation type, in the upper Mureş area of the Transylvanian plateau. In contrast with the surrounding peoples who practiced incineration, the Ciumbrud people buried their dead. These tombs, containing Scythian artistic and armament metallurgy (e.g. acinaces), have moreover been dated to 550-450 BC — roughly the timeframe of Herodotus' writing. Archaeologists use the term "Thraco-Agathyrsian" to designate these characteristics, owing to the evident Thracian (or, more strictly speaking, Dacian) elements. At the time of Herodotus they were already absorbed by the native Dacians.

    Herodotus, writing after 450 BC, localizes the Agathyrsi (Ἀγάθυρσοι) to Transylvania and the outer parts of Scythia, to the proximity of the Neuri."

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agat...rld_map-en.svg
    nMonte: "Latvia_north-eastern": 62.17,
    "Macedonia_FYROM": 18.5,
    "Pomak": 10,
    "Tajik": 2.83,
    "North_Albania": 2.5,
    "Moroccan_North": 1.83,
    "Komi": 1.33,
    "Tunisian_Berber_Chenini": 0.83,

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  13. #60
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    [QUOTE=spruithean;568893]Alain, I can think of two tribes which assimilated or were mixed with "Scythians". Notably the Tauri in Crimea, who were later absorbed by the Goths and Alans and the Agathyrsi in ancient Dacia, they were a mixture of Scythians and Dacians.

    I should add that Scythian was a very broad term, especially when used by Romans and Greeks. We see some Gothic people referred to as "Scythians" this was more of a way of describing where they came from, similar to how people
    Since I give them right for the Romans were all barbarians equal, they made only a rough division of the rivers, for example, Rhine west and east Gauls and Germanics for example, from the Greeks, we have better reports. The Scythian with Dacians and East Germanic tribes, I think, but also celts for example Hallstatt Bylany and Scythian Hungary that is why we have different Scythianclusters some northern European other Southeast European, ... the early Slavs have also absorbed remnants so it dilutes over time but as I said the direct descendants of Scythian are Tatars and many Volga Finnish people. Unfortunately, there is not much information about the Taurii have already read two books about the Crimea
    Alain Dad
    Y-DNA R1a-Y33 Eastern Corderd Ware Culture Baltoslavic/ old Pruzzen
    H76 czech Republic/England (Celtic tribes ?) W3a1d Yamnaya Culture, Samara /Pontic steppe
    Scytho-sarmatian.

    My FTDNA autosomal

    East Europe 82%
    Southeast Europe 14%
    Finland 2%
    West and Central Europe 1%

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