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Thread: Genetic history of the population of Crete Drineas et al. 2019

  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by patrizio22 View Post
    Sharecropping was a practice typical of central Italy since the middle ages (Marche, Umbria, Tuscany and Emilia Romagna). There was very little sharecropping outside central Italy and Emilia Romagna, and most of this area was into the Papal state. This contract was very appealing to good farmers from elsewhere who didn't own land. In my region, the Marche, most of the these farmers came from northern Italy since the late 15th century, especially Lombardy. That's why many people in the province of Ancona have a surname from Lombardy. I don't know about Umbria and Tuscany, but it may be similar.

    I don't know why they didn't come also from the Kingdom of Naples, from the south, to central Italy. I haven't found surnames from Sicily in my region during the 19th and early 20th century. There were the Sicilian Jews who were expelled from the kingdom of Naples, some of these came to central Italy, but these may not have had a surname at first.

    In theory, whether from the south or the north, they would have needed a passport or some paper to come to the Papal state, but perhaps it wasn't very difficult to cross the border.

    In Latium, also Papal state, the immigration wasn't perhaps necessarily linked to agriculture. I think it is more likely that your ancestor came from Sicily to Rome because in Rome all sort of trades were needed.
    sharecropping was in the Veneto up until 1946
    a farmer was engaged from March to end of November and half his crop would go to the land owner ( basically the farmers rent ) , the other half , the farmer would sell and make his money or not.......at the end of November , the owner would re-engage or not the farmer for the following year.

    Father's Mtdna .........T2b17
    Grandfather's Mtdna .......T1a1e
    Sons Mtdna .......K1a4o
    Maternal Grandfather paternal......I1d1-P109
    Maternal side Grandfather .......R1b-S8172
    Wife's Ydna .....R1a-Z282

    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, Y70078+ )

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  3. #132
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    It's good they mention Goths because Theophanes writes:

    Τούτῳ τῷ ἔτει οἱ Γότθοι πάλιν ἑνωθέντες ἐξῆλθον εἰς τὴν γῆν τῶν Ῥωμαίων καὶ ἠρήμωσαν πολλὰς ἐπαρχίας, Σκυθίαν, Μυσίαν, Θρᾴκην, Μακεδονίαν, καὶ Ἀχαΐαν, καὶ πᾶσαν τὴν Ἑλλάδα, περὶ τὰς εἴκοσιν ἐπαρχίας.

    He litterally says Goths 'deserted' Scythia, Mysia, Thrace, Macedonia, Achaea and the whole Hellas.

    The date this thing supposedly happened was when Valens was the Roman emperor, so at the second half of the 4th century.

    That doesn't mean that the northern ancestry is 'Gothic' but we need samples from the timeframe between the 4th and the 7th century too and also earlier possibly.

    ***

    And basically a hundred years later, when Anastasius I was the emperor, Bulgars raid Illyricum and Thrace. (Now I personally believe original Bulgars were more like Balkars without the Kipchak admixture but I guess some people believe they were Chuvash like)

    Τῷ δ' αὐτῷ ἔτει καὶ οἱ καλούμενοι Βούλγαροι τῷ Ἰλλυρικῷ καὶ Θρᾴκῃ ἐπιτρέχουσι καὶ ἐπανατρέχουσι πρὶν γνωσθῆναι αὐτούς.
    Last edited by Kanenas; 07-06-2019 at 08:37 PM.

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  5. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kanenas View Post
    It's good they mention Goths because Theophanes writes:

    Τούτῳ τῷ ἔτει οἱ Γότθοι πάλιν ἑνωθέντες ἐξῆλθον εἰς τὴν γῆν τῶν Ῥωμαίων καὶ ἠρήμωσαν πολλὰς ἐπαρχίας, Σκυθίαν, Μυσίαν, Θρᾴκην, Μακεδονίαν, καὶ Ἀχαΐαν, καὶ πᾶσαν τὴν Ἑλλάδα, περὶ τὰς εἴκοσιν ἐπαρχίας.

    He litterally says Goths 'deserted' Scythia, Mysia, Thrace, Macedonia, Achaea and the whole Hellas.

    The date this thing supposedly happened was when Valens was the Roman emperor, so at the second half of the 4th century.

    That doesn't mean that the northern ancestry is 'Gothic' but we need samples from the timeframe between the 4th and the 7th century too and also earlier possibly.

    ***

    And basically a hundred years later, when Anastasius I was the emperor, Bulgars raid Illyricum and Thrace. (Now I personally believe original Bulgars were more like Balkars without the Kipchak admixture but I guess some people believe they were Chuvash like)

    Τῷ δ' αὐτῷ ἔτει καὶ οἱ καλούμενοι Βούλγαροι τῷ Ἰλλυρικῷ καὶ Θρᾴκῃ ἐπιτρέχουσι καὶ ἐπανατρέχουσι πρὶν γνωσθῆναι αὐτούς.
    Maybe , Goths 'deserted' Scythia, Mysia, Thrace, Macedonia, Achaea and the whole Hellas but it was not during the reign of the Roman emperor Valens because Valens was defeated and killed by the Goths at the Andrianople battle in Thrace, not far from the capital Constantinople

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Adrianople

  6. #134
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    Can someone please explain the following to me:

    If Cretans plot overlapping/identical to all Sicilians in the study except the Trapanese how can they be between 17-28% Slavic? The two seem contradictory. Also how much Slavic input must mainland Greeks have?

    I'd say Crete is on the lower end for Aegean islands' Slavic also, so if we're looking at up to 28% in Crete, then most Aegean islands must have even more.

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