Poll: What should the type of Bell Beaker with R1b-M269 and steppe dna be called?

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Thread: What should the R1b-M269/steppe dna-type of Bell Beaker be called?

  1. #1
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    Question What should the R1b-M269/steppe dna-type of Bell Beaker be called?

    I am posting this in the P312 subforum because thus far most ancient non-Iberian Bell Beaker has been R1b-P312 of one variety or another, with steppe autosomal dna.

    Anyway, if you have not yet read the recent paper by Martin Furholt, Re-integrating Archaeology: A Contribution to aDNA Studies and the Migration Discourse on the 3rd Millennium BC in Europe, you should do so before voting in this poll.

    The issue is what to call non-Iberian Beaker and post-2500 BC Iberian Beaker to differentiate the type of Beaker with R1b-M269, steppe dna, the basic Yamnaya package, and Corded Ware-like burial rites (yes, I know about the differences) from earlier Iberian Bell Beaker, which was very Neolithic farmer-like, non-R1b-M269, and had no steppe dna.

    Clearly the two types need different names in order to avoid confusing the two and creating erroneous impressions about their different origins.

    Furholt's paper makes calling the R1b-M269/steppe dna brand of Beaker "SGBR Beaker" a reasonable thing to do, but the other alternatives are also reasonable.

    If you are not familiar with Marija Gimbutas' Kurgan Hypothesis, it is the source for the idea of the appellation Kurgan Bell Beaker. Her idea of an overarching Kurgan Culture has fallen out of fashion, but it included Furholt's Single Grave Burial Ritual and Harrison and Heyd's Yamnaya Package well before either of those things was introduced by its authors.

    This is from page 352 of Gimbutas' book, The Civilization of the Goddess:

    Quote Originally Posted by Marija Gimbutas
    The Proto- or Early Indo-Europeans, whom I have labeled "Kurgan" people, arrived from the east, from southern Russia, on horseback . . .

    The Kurgan tradition represents a stark contrast to the civilization of Old Europe, which was, in the main, peaceful, sedentary, matrifocal, matrilineal, and sex egalitarian. The Kurgans were a warlike, patriarchal, and hierarchical culture with distinctive burial rites that included pit graves with tent- or hutlike structures of wood or stone, covered by a low cairn or earthen mound. Their economy was essentially pastoral with a rudimentary agriculture and seasonal, transient settlements of semi-subterranean houses . . .

    The livelihood and mobility of the Kurgan people depended on the domesticated horse, in sharp contrast to the Old European agriculturalists to whom the horse was unknown. Pastoral economy, growing herds of large animals, horse riding, and the need for male strength to control the animals must have contributed to the transition from matrism to armored patrism in southern Russia and beyond at the latest around 5000 B.C.
    Here is what Furholt says about his SGBR Complex, on pages 3-4 of the paper linked above:

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Furholt
    Instead of seeing the 3rd millennium BC in Europe through the lens of monothetic, distinct archaeological cultures, each with their own specific set of burial ritual, the polythetic perspective reveals a wider complex of new elements of burial ritual transcending the borders of these entities. This is a complex of burials that highlights individual interments, gender differentiation, male warriors, and mostly strict rules of orientation of the dead (Fig. 1), as opposed to the mainly collective burials of the preceding periods and neighbouring regions. I would like to name it the ‘Late Neolithic and Early Bronze Age Single Grave Burial Ritual Complex’ (SGBR). SGBR appears in Central Europe and southern Scandinavia around 2900 BC, arrives on the British Isles a few hundred years later, and prevails until cremation burials take over, somewhen after 1400 BC.
    On page 3 he makes it clear that he isn't talking merely about lumping Corded Ware and Bell Beaker together:

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Furholt
    In addition, many Early Bronze Age ‘cultures’ directly following Corded Ware and Bell Beakers, such as the Únětice, Mierzanowice, or Nitra in Central Europe, the Nordic ‘Late Neolithic’ and Early Bronze Age in southern Scandinavia, or Wessex have also very similar burial rituals. All the burials connected to these different ‘archaeological cultures’ are basically variations over a common theme: highlighting the gendered individual; the association of weapons with males; the burial in a flexed position on their side; in or under kurgan-like burial mounds; and distinct rules of orientation and body placement.
    Anyway, you decide.

    This old thread may help, especially the OP, since it lists the various models of Bell Beaker origins.
    Last edited by rms2; 06-28-2019 at 01:25 PM.
     


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  3. #2
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    Well, I voted for SGBR Beaker, but don't let that influence you, positively or negatively (some here like me, but some here really hate me). I also like Kurgan Bell Beaker, which, up until I read and liked Furholt's paper, I had been using.

    I do think it's useful to have something to distinguish between the two main types of Bell Beaker, something not too long and windy.
     


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    I know there are not many Bell Beaker Z-2103-2109. I voted Steppe as in L51+ Steppe Bell Beaker compared to Z-2203 + Steppe Bell Beaker both found in Hungary.

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    I like Kurgan best, but I will use Steppe if posting with people who are anti-steppe. Just to push some buttons.

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    Personally, Steppe Bell Beaker gets my vote.
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webb View Post
    I like Kurgan best, but I will use Steppe if posting with people who are anti-steppe. Just to push some buttons.
    I like Kurgan, too, although I voted for SGBR.

    I think Kurgan catches the whole package, actually better than SGBR does, and I'm a big fan of Marija Gimbutas, having actually read much of what she wrote (unlike some who are overly critical of her without really knowing what she had to say).

    But SGBR is nice and short and can easily come to represent the whole steppe pastoralist enchilada.
     


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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    Personally, Steppe Bell Beaker gets my vote.
    The problem I have with Steppe Bell Beaker is that it is geographic/topographic and makes it sound like BB came directly from the steppe.

    But I could live with that name.
     


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    rs4988235 AA (13910 TT)
    rs182549 TT (22018 AA)

    Red Hair Carrier:
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    Dad's mtDNA: K1a1

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    I voted for Kurgan Bell Beaker. Mostly because I think it’s a catchier label and it covers all of the bases. SGBR is too cumbersome in my opinion and requires more unpacking for those who don’t follow the subject. Steppe is also good but Kurgan Bell Beaker has a ring to it, that none of the others have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    The problem I have with Steppe Bell Beaker is that it is geographic/topographic and makes it sound like BB came directly from the steppe.

    But I could live with that name.
    Well, "Steppe" here as I understand it is useful if we are to distinguish the subset(s) of the Bell Beaker horizon responsible for the initial dissemination of steppe ancestry in Western Europe from the EF-type Iberian population where BB emerged. So it really is an important distinction and ultimately a reference to a genetic component more than anything else, though I can understand the reticence, as you said it does make it sound as if the Bell Beaker culture came all the way from the steppe.
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    Well, "Steppe" here as I understand it is useful if we are to distinguish the subset(s) of the Bell Beaker horizon responsible for the initial dissemination of steppe ancestry in Western Europe from the EF-type Iberian population where BB emerged. So it really is an important distinction and ultimately a reference to a genetic component more than anything else, though I can understand the reticence, as you said it does make it sound as if the Bell Beaker culture came all the way from the steppe.
    That is definitely reasonable, and, as I said, I could very easily live with the name Steppe Bell Beaker.

    It could handily serve as a stand-in for SGBR, Kurgan, Yamnaya Package, etc.

    It wouldn't hurt my feelings at all.
     


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