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Thread: I-P37, what does it mean?

  1. #41
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    Project joined. Here is what they had to say.

    The STR pattern in your STR result points to the I-CTS10228 haplogroup. This haplogroup is nicknamed as "Dinaric group" because its high frequency in the Dinaric Alps region. It is sometimes misleading name, it does not mean that origins of this group are from that region. This haplogroup is well represented in central and eastern Europe as well. It is very abundant and very young group. Most members have 37 etc. markers very similar to each other. According to some STR values, I-CTS10228 group is divided in two clusters: Dinaric North and Dinaric South. Please note: it is a STR based division and we use it when there are no relevant SNP tests results. You do not have any SNP result.


    People with STR values DYS448=20 (and higher) and DYS 449=31 (and higher) belong to the Dinaric North group, which is usually found in Central and Eastern Europe (Poland, Baltic countries, Czech Republic, Hungary, Slovakia, Ukraine, Belarus, Russia etc.).
    People with STR values DYS448=19 (and lower) and DYS 449=31 (and lower) belong to the Dinaric South group, which is usually found in SE Europe (Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Serbia, Montenegro etc.).If people ask us what the boundary between the group is, we say the Danube river, but there is much overlap; for example Dinarics in Germany often match the values for Din-S and most of Greek and Bulgarian Dinarics are in the Dinaric North cluster. You have DYS448=20 and DYS449=32 results, I put your STR results in the Dinaric North cluster section.


    Two of your STR matches belong to the I-Y4460 haplogroup (XXXX and XXX). It does not mean that you belong to that haplogroup. You have DYS389I/II=14,33 values which are characteristic for some lines in the I-Z17855 haplogroup. You could also be in the I-Y18331 haplogroup. One of your matches is XXXXXX from Greece. He has only 12 STR markers tested. As said, STR values are not reliable for haplogroup prediction in the I-CTS10228, you could be in other haplogroup below I-CTS10228.

    SNP markers ar those which determine haplogroups. I recommend SNP testing. You will learn which haplogroup you belong to. When you know your haplogroup you can compare your STR results with persons inside that haplogroup and disregard eventual matches from other haplogroups.

    You have several SNP test options:

    1) you can order the I2-P37 SNP pack test which covers mentioned I-CTS10228 SNPs and their subbranches, this test should roughly define your position inside the I-CTS10228 haplogroup.

    2) more detailed I2a-M423 SNP panel test can be ordered in another laboratory YSeq.net for $88 ( http://www.yseq.net/product_info.php...ducts_id=11788 ). You will need to give a new cheek scrape DNA sample and there is also a one time $5 handling fee for the kit. If you take YSeq's I2a-M423 panel test or any other SNP test, please let us know your results because they will not be transferred to your FTDNA page and we have no way to know about them.

    3) you can order the expensive Big Y-700 test. It includes all SNPs in the haplotree, sequence 10 million+ base pairs of your chromosome and find many new SNPs unique to you and your closest male relative. 700 STR markers test is included in this test. It also offers an opportunity to find your other, more downstream haplogroups in the future. This test is on sale untill August 31st, it costs $399 for those who have Y-DNA67 STR test done.


    I am very happy with this response. It is more detailed and will allow me to share specific information with my cousin and the rest of the family. Learning more without having to pay for "Big Y" is a relief too. We'll see if the family is good for another $100 or so for the SNP testing.
    Last edited by Greekscholar; 08-08-2019 at 03:51 PM.

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  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greekscholar View Post
    Project joined. Here is what they had to say.

    The STR pattern in your STR result points to the I-CTS10228 haplogroup. This haplogroup is nicknamed as "Dinaric group" because its high frequency in the Dinaric Alps region. It is sometimes misleading name, it does not mean that origins of this group are from that region. This haplogroup is well represented in central and eastern Europe as well. It is very abundant and very young group. Most members have 37 etc. markers very similar to each other. According to some STR values, I-CTS10228 group is divided in two clusters: Dinaric North and Dinaric South. Please note: it is a STR based division and we use it when there are no relevant SNP tests results. You do not have any SNP result.


    People with STR values DYS448=20 (and higher) and DYS 449=31 (and higher) belong to the Dinaric North group, which is usually found in Central and Eastern Europe (Poland, Baltic countries, Czech Republic, Hungary, Slovakia, Ukraine, Belarus, Russia etc.).
    People with STR values DYS448=19 (and lower) and DYS 449=31 (and lower) belong to the Dinaric South group, which is usually found in SE Europe (Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Serbia, Montenegro etc.).If people ask us what the boundary between the group is, we say the Danube river, but there is much overlap; for example Dinarics in Germany often match the values for Din-S and most of Greek and Bulgarian Dinarics are in the Dinaric North cluster. You have DYS448=20 and DYS449=32 results, I put your STR results in the Dinaric North cluster section.


    Two of your STR matches belong to the I-Y4460 haplogroup (XXXX and XXX). It does not mean that you belong to that haplogroup. You have DYS389I/II=14,33 values which are characteristic for some lines in the I-Z17855 haplogroup. You could also be in the I-Y18331 haplogroup. One of your matches is XXXXXX from Greece. He has only 12 STR markers tested. As said, STR values are not reliable for haplogroup prediction in the I-CTS10228, you could be in other haplogroup below I-CTS10228.

    SNP markers ar those which determine haplogroups. I recommend SNP testing. You will learn which haplogroup you belong to. When you know your haplogroup you can compare your STR results with persons inside that haplogroup and disregard eventual matches from other haplogroups.

    You have several SNP test options:

    1) you can order the I2-P37 SNP pack test which covers mentioned I-CTS10228 SNPs and their subbranches, this test should roughly define your position inside the I-CTS10228 haplogroup.

    2) more detailed I2a-M423 SNP panel test can be ordered in another laboratory YSeq.net for $88 ( http://www.yseq.net/product_info.php...ducts_id=11788 ). You will need to give a new cheek scrape DNA sample and there is also a one time $5 handling fee for the kit. If you take YSeq's I2a-M423 panel test or any other SNP test, please let us know your results because they will not be transferred to your FTDNA page and we have no way to know about them.

    3) you can order the expensive Big Y-700 test. It includes all SNPs in the haplotree, sequence 10 million+ base pairs of your chromosome and find many new SNPs unique to you and your closest male relative. 700 STR markers test is included in this test. It also offers an opportunity to find your other, more downstream haplogroups in the future. This test is on sale untill August 31st, it costs $399 for those who have Y-DNA67 STR test done.


    I am very happy with this response. It is more detailed and will allow me to share specific information with my cousin and the rest of the family. Learning more without having to pay for "Big Y" is a relief too. We'll see if the family is good for another $100 or so for the SNP testing.
    That is a good start. I still recommend BigY eventually, considering the unknowns, which means you could form a unique branch under CTS10228 or under one of the clades you could belong to as well.
    Known Ancestry: Albanian
    23andme results: 94% Balkan, 0.9% Italian, 0.8% Middle Eastern, 2.2% broadly southern European, 0.3 British & Irish, 0.3% Japanese, 0.5% unassigned
    MyOrigins2.0: 100% Southeast European
    MyAncientOrigins: 62% Farmer, 24% Hunter Gatherer, 14% Metal Age Invader
    MyHeritage: 76% Greek, 16% Balkan, 8% Italian
    WeGene: 99.5% Balkan, 0.5% unassigned
    GenePlaza: 92.7% East Mediterranean, 5.2% Southwestern European, 1.5% Ambiguous
    DNA.LAND: 95% Balkan, 5% Sardinian

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  5. #43
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    SNP pack for I-P37 has been ordered. Hopefully they don't need another cheek swap from my cousin and can just test his existing submission. Either way, he is excited and I am too. Any clue what the normal wait time is when no new sample is needed? Thanks!

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  7. #44
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    I agree with Dibran in the recommendation of Big Y, eventually if you are interested. In my opinion, Big Y was expensive, but it was sort of a catch all test that didn't require me ordering SNP packs and buying things piece by piece. Not saying you should buy it now (especially if it is out of the question).

    I don't know if it has changed recently, but I remember the initial FTDNA kit had more than one vial for the swab and they kept your samples frozen for a fair amount of time. I doubt they'll need another sample, unless the remaining material doesn't pass quality standards.

    Your SNP pack will probably take several weeks, your results will be visible on the haplotree section, if I remember correctly.

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  9. #45
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    SNP pack back already (that felt fast.) My cousin is now classified as I-A2512, which appears downstream of the "Greek" I-18331 marker. This test feels very helpful. He is now put into a category with another Greek islander...........but it seems he could also be a very close match to the downstream A10959 cluster, whose male lines are from the Peloponnese.

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  11. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greekscholar View Post
    SNP pack back already (that felt fast.) My cousin is now classified as I-A2512, which appears downstream of the "Greek" I-18331 marker. This test feels very helpful. He is now put into a category with another Greek islander...........but it seems he could also be a very close match to the downstream A10959 cluster, whose male lines are from the Peloponnese.
    Awesome. So your cousin does fall in the Greek I2-A2512 cluster. It wasn't even that long ago it was discovered and it is already growing and splitting into clades on Yfull.

    My Albanian L1029 cluster is growing too, just no one else has done bigY unfortunately(mainly YSEQ).
    Known Ancestry: Albanian
    23andme results: 94% Balkan, 0.9% Italian, 0.8% Middle Eastern, 2.2% broadly southern European, 0.3 British & Irish, 0.3% Japanese, 0.5% unassigned
    MyOrigins2.0: 100% Southeast European
    MyAncientOrigins: 62% Farmer, 24% Hunter Gatherer, 14% Metal Age Invader
    MyHeritage: 76% Greek, 16% Balkan, 8% Italian
    WeGene: 99.5% Balkan, 0.5% unassigned
    GenePlaza: 92.7% East Mediterranean, 5.2% Southwestern European, 1.5% Ambiguous
    DNA.LAND: 95% Balkan, 5% Sardinian

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  13. #47
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    Yes, it was a surprise, apparently, based on his STR markers. As mentioned, the possible connection to the A10959 Peloponnese cluster is very exciting from a genealogy standpoint. My cousin is completely on board after we had a chance to discuss all the results in person, so more testing is probably on the way here soon.

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