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Thread: An Ancient Harappan Genome Lacks Ancestry from Steppe Pastoralists or Iranian Farmers

  1. #101
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    J-Z482>Y15222
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    R-Z36>Y156527

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    I2337;3641-3519 calBCE (478030 BP, PSUAMS-1919); Tepe_Hissar_C; Tepe Hissar, Iran; https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40171/

    At this point it is safe to say that F3133 is quintessentially Central Asian/Iranian and likely moved to the area some time after the split with the Z438 and PF4888 branch.

    I11028;3331-2972 calBCE (444525 BP, PSUAMS-4780);Bustan_EN; Bustan, Uzbekistan; https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y15604/

    It is related to the I11527 branch that was seen in Aigyrzhal BA in Kyrgyzstan.

    I am looking at the other Bustan samples to see if I can get further snp calls
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Other Y lines: 3x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 5x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: E-V13> A7135, 6x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J1-Z2331>L829

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  3. #102
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    if IVC people was related to Iranian HGs who did not have an addition of a Caucasian HGs(plus AASI), can homeland of a hypothetical pure Iranian HG be located east of Iran (BMAC areal and so on)?
    Last edited by Ral; 09-07-2019 at 07:11 PM.

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  5. #103
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    I3262 & I799; 976-832 calBCE (276025 BP, PSUAMS-2157); SPGT_father.or.son.I1799_1d.rel.I1992; Swat Valley, Udegram, Pakistan; https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-PF4428/

    Is negative for all downstreams
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Other Y lines: 3x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 5x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: E-V13> A7135, 6x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J1-Z2331>L829

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  7. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Principe View Post
    I3262 & I799; 976-832 calBCE (276025 BP, PSUAMS-2157); SPGT_father.or.son.I1799_1d.rel.I1992; Swat Valley, Udegram, Pakistan; https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-PF4428/

    Is negative for all downstreams
    Interesting, still under E-Y31991 though. Could it be due to sample quality?
    YDNA E-Y31991>PF4428>Y134097>Y134104>Y168273>FT17866 (TMRCA ~1100AD) - Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1690 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal - Stonemason, miller.
    mtDNA H20 - Monica Vieira, b. circa 1700 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Hidden Content
    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content

    [1] "distance%=1.6023"

    Ruderico

    Iberia_IA+Hallstatt,82.2
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  9. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    Interesting, still under E-Y31991 though. Could it be due to sample quality?
    Maybe it can be, in all likelihood Y31991 ventured out to the area sometime during the Neolithic.
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Other Y lines: 3x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 5x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: E-V13> A7135, 6x Great Grandfather on Maternal side: J1-Z2331>L829

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  11. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ral View Post
    if IVC people was related to Iranian HGs who did not have an addition of a Caucasian HGs(plus AASI), can homeland of a hypothetical pure Iranian HG be located east of Iran (BMAC areal and so on)?
    We need some Mesolithic samples from Central Asia and the northern parts of South Asia. That might help to see if there was any Iranian like HG populations is those areas at that time.

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  13. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pribislav
    R1b-PH155 in BMAC!

    I4315; 1609-1465 BC; Dzharkutan; Uzbekistan; BMAC; pre-R1b-PH155 (5 derived, 9 ancestral)
    PH155 was found in one of the Shirenzigou nomads and also one of the Hunnic samples. I would imagine the Shirenzigou and Hun samples had both "West" and "East" (SHamanka) Siberian ancestry; however Dzarkutan probably only had West Siberian ancestry. Pretty good odds PH155 was a WSHG lineage? David basically predicted this, and said Kelteminar should turn up more PH155.

    Quote Originally Posted by J Man View Post
    We need some Mesolithic samples from Central Asia and the northern parts of South Asia. That might help to see if there was any Iranian like HG populations is those areas at that time.
    Yeah, lots of J1 and Iran_N-like ancestry in these Bronze Age Central Asians. The majority of these BMAC/Central Asian samples however seem to cluster around the southern end of "Turan".

    Of course the earlier Botai samples had basically no Iran_N and were almost entirely West Siberian HG. Was Iran_N-like ancestry present in southern Turan since Mesolithic/Paleolithic times, or did it only arrive between the Neolithic and BA?

    Shinde's early split time between Iran_N and Indus_N (for lack of better term) only strengthens my contention that that this ancestry has been present in Iran, Turan, and even the Indus Valley for a long, long time. I believe "Iran_N/Indus_N" are largely the descendants of some "Basal Crown Eurasian" population which split from Basal Eurasians 60-50kya. This would account for Iran_N's "intermediate" position between four population cohorts which are otherwise fairly distal from one another: ANE, WHG, East Asians, and Natufians.
    Last edited by K33; 09-07-2019 at 11:14 PM.

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  15. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ral View Post
    if IVC people was related to Iranian HGs who did not have an addition of a Caucasian HGs(plus AASI), can homeland of a hypothetical pure Iranian HG be located east of Iran (BMAC areal and so on)?
    Iran N type of ancestry seems to have come from near central asia.. most probable area for how they acquired their ANE ancestry.

    Chg is iran n-like yet replaced dzudzuana the original anatolia n-like population, in the Caucasus. Since iran n like ancestry seems relatively homogeneous in terms of ancestral composition (ane, basal levels, etc.), most probable it spread from where it picked up ane (in/near central asia) and successful populated other regions from there. like how anatolia n originating in anatolia and successfully populated other regions like all of europe (for the most part) in the neolithic. this may be how it played out.

    cheers.
    Last edited by Ellerbe; 09-07-2019 at 11:40 PM.

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  17. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellerbe View Post
    Iran N type of ancestry seems to have come from near central asia.. most probable area for how they acquired their ANE ancestry.

    Chg is iran n-like yet replaced dzudzuana the original anatolia n-like population, in the Caucasus. Since iran n like ancestry seems relatively homogeneous in terms of ancestral composition (ane, basal levels, etc.), most probable it spread from where it picked up ane (in/near central asia) and successful populated other regions from there. like how anatolia n originating in anatolia and successfully populated other regions like all of europe (for the most part) in the neolithic. this may be how it played out.

    cheers.
    It didn't replace it exactly. It formed from it in large part.

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  19. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Principe View Post
    Maybe it can be, in all likelihood Y31991 ventured out to the area sometime during the Neolithic.
    Not sure, we also see my subclade in the early first millenium BC in NE Kazakhstan so I'm guessing these could have been brought to Swat Valley by folks from the north not before 2000-1500BC. Of course it could be a clade that diverged long ago too, in which case God knows when it got there
    YDNA E-Y31991>PF4428>Y134097>Y134104>Y168273>FT17866 (TMRCA ~1100AD) - Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1690 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal - Stonemason, miller.
    mtDNA H20 - Monica Vieira, b. circa 1700 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Hidden Content
    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content

    [1] "distance%=1.6023"

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