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Thread: A theory about the origin of E-V13

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    About the huge fortified settlement of Corneşti-Iarcuri, which was a more Southern fortification of the Channelled Ware people similar to Teleac. Interestingly there is no local continuity proven yet, it seems to have been build completely new, by newly incoming settlers. Before that were probably minor local settlements, but nothing comparable. This was therefore a true colonisation event on a grande scale:

    A complete bowl recovered at the exterior foot of the phase B rampart can be dated to
    the Cruceni-Belegis¸ IIA phase (equivalent to Hallstatt A1) (Figure 8). The Cruceni-Belegis¸
    culture is part of the south-east European Urnfield culture, with a distribution similar to
    the preceding Vatina group in Oltenia, Banat and eastern Hungary. In terms of relative
    chronology, it is situated between the Middle Bronze Age Vatina culture and the Early
    Iron Age Gornea-Kalakaˇca culture. The absolute chronology places the group between the
    fifteenth and eleventh centuries BC (Szentmiklosi 2009).
    Three samples for radiocarbon dating were taken from burnt beams belonging to the
    later construction. The results provide a clear indication of construction between 1450 and
    1200 cal BC (Table 1 and Figure 9) combined to give a construction date of 1393–1314 (at
    68.2% probability), and 1411–1270 (at 95.4%) (Figure 10).
    The timing is exactly like Teleac and fits the main dispersion of the main E-V13 clades. If they will ever find human remains from that settlement which can be tested, its quite likely the males will be packed with E-V13.

    About the buildings inside of the settlement:
    The magnetogram shows concentrations of pits, and large rectangular houses (about 20 or
    25×30m) possibly forming an urban scheme with lanes orientated along rampart II. It is
    difficult to identify clear outlines of houses in the magnetogram. However, it is possible
    that closer to the burnt rampart II some burnt houses exist, which may give a more precise
    ‘city plan’ once further survey is undertaken. There is also a remarkable number of circular
    structures with diameters of 8–12m, looking like flattened barrows (ring-ditches) or huts.
    The increase in production and population with the formation of the town and colonisation through Channelled Ware people:

    Analysis of the Bronze Age sherds shows that Early Bronze Age (Mak´o) finds are
    uncommon. The sherds become more frequent towards the Middle Bronze Age (Vatina).
    It is only in the Late Bronze Age (Cruceni-Belegis¸) that sherds are found in all areas in
    relatively high numbers
    .
    ...the evidence strongly suggests that the main settlement phase belongs to the
    Late Bronze Age.
    What is still not well understood is how such an enormous construction project
    could have been undertaken, either on this particular site or on others of the same date —
    bearing in mind that so far the size of Cornes¸ti-Iarcuri is unparalleled at this period either
    locally (the Romanian Banat), within the wider area (theHungarian Plain and Transylvania),
    or internationally.
    The new elites of Channelled Ware people concentrated populations, specialists and warriors, in huge fortified settlements, with well-organised structures to support them economically and armies to defend their interests. The sudden appearance can just mean that whole subsets of these people, like also suggested by the even spread of the main clades in that time, colonised, as a whole tribe or even proto-state, large regions collectively. It might be compared with Greek colonies, though their impact on the local populations seems to have been far bigger.
    The ultimate origin is the Gava centre in the Northern Carpathians:

    At the moment little is known about the development of fortified sites in the Banat, though further south in the
    Vojvodina some analyses have been conducted on the Titel plateau (Falkenstein 1998). A site
    with many similarities to Cornes¸ti-Iarcuri in terms of topographic situation and structure
    is Sˆantana near Arad (known in the older Hungarian literature as Szentanna), about 45km
    away, and recently under excavation by a team from Cluj under the direction of Dr Florin
    Gogˆaltan. Earlier excavations on the site found a rampart sequence not dissimilar to that
    at Iarcuri with pottery from Eneolithic to Hallstatt B; the largest part fell in the periods
    Bronze D to Hallstatt A1, the pottery being mainly of Gava style (Rusu et al. 1999). This
    is close in time to what is present at Iarcuri, and Rusu et al. considered Iarcuri the closest
    analogy to Sˆantana even though Sˆantana, at ‘only’ 1km in diameter, is considerably smaller.
    As excavations progress at both sites, it will become possible to specify these links more
    closely.
    The cultural ties are obvious, now we need genetic evidence - E-V13 will be the main marker - to prove it to be a demic-ethnic diffusion. Going back in time, in search of this Gava colonisation, we come to:

    In northern Hungary and Slovakia
    too, sites of both the Middle Bronze Age Piliny and the succeeding Kyjatice cultures saw
    a number of fortifications erected and used
    (Furm´anek et al. 1982; Kemenczei 1982). A
    marked increase in defended settlements can be noticed during the Urnfield culture in many
    parts of Europe (Harding 2000: 296). This ‘stronghold horizon’ probably begins inHallstatt
    A2 (Rind 1999: 13) and stops in Hallstatt B3 (Jockenh¨ovel 1990: 219). A similar situation
    may be discerned in Slovakia (Furm´anek et al. 1982) and Transylvania (Soroceanu 1982). (Furm´anek et al. 1982; Kemenczei 1982).
    These were not simple warbands on the move:
    A purely agrarian socio-economic
    framework for the society that built Iarcuri seems unlikely; the social and economic structures
    present must have included a range of craft specialisms and personal identities, probably
    including leadership and warriorhood.
    On the other hand, the site cannot have been purely
    urban in character across its full extent; the population would have been enormous.
    The colonisation happened exactly in the time frame of the main E-V13 spread:
    We are
    therefore talking about large numbers of people, from a sizeable area around Cornes¸ti, who
    would have taken part in the site’s construction. This brings with it the need to consider
    motivation, not to speak of logistics.
    The three radiocarbon dates, along with the suggested pottery dating in the Late Bronze
    Age, indicate construction and use of the rampart of Enclosure I in the centuries around
    3000 BP. Unfortunately the calibration curve is relatively flat at this period, which means
    that there is a sizeable potential spread of calendar dates, from 1400 to 1000 cal BC or even
    wider.
    Suciu de Sus and Lapus represent elite burials, of kings or at least princes form the Gava/Channelled Ware people in the wider region, probably of transregional importance:
    It is noticeable how many archaeological phenomena have produced radiocarbon dates
    at just this period. This was, for instance, the time when the dates for the great tumuli of
    the Suciu de Sus culture at L˘apus¸ in the Maramures¸ fall (Metzner-Nebelsick et al. 2010;
    C. Metzner-Nebelsick pers. comm.), and many other phenomena across Europe have been
    radiocarbon dated close to 3000 BP. Wolfgang Kimmig suggested many years ago that the
    start of theUrnfield period could be connected with far-reaching movements of people across
    the whole of Southern and Central Europe (Kimmig 1964), a theory that has never been
    refuted and continues to be attractive in many ways
    . Although it would be too simplistic
    to see a straight correlation between the new burial rite of cremation, and the rise of major
    fortifications, there are certainly attractive possibilities to explore in this general field.
    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...Romanian_Banat
    Last edited by Riverman; 10-17-2021 at 03:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    Not sure if this was posted last year. No surprise to anyone... U152 is most frequent in all sampled Swiss populations with a peak of 53% in Ticino.

    The Y-chromosomal haplotype and haplogroup distribution of modern Switzerland still reflects the alpine divide as a geographical barrier for human migration
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...301186#tbl0005

    Abstract
    A sample of 606 Swiss individuals has been characterized for 27 Y-STR and 34 Y-SNPs, defining major European haplogroups. For the first time, a subsample from the southernmost part of Switzerland, the Italian speaking canton Ticino, has been included. The data reveals significant intra-national differences in the distribution of haplogroups R1b-U106, R1b-U152, I1 and J2a north and south of the alpine divide, with R1b-U152 being the most frequent haplogroup among all Swiss subpopulations, reaching 26 % in average and 53 % in the Ticino sample. In addition, a high percentage of haplogroup E1b1b-M35 in Eastern Switzerland corresponds well with data reported from Western Austria. In general, we detected a low level of differentiation between the subgroups north of the alpine divide. The dataset also revealed a variety of microvariants. Some of them were previously known to be associated with particular haplogroups. However, we discovered one microvariant in DYS533 that seems to be closely associated with haplogroup I2-P215 (xM223). This association had not yet been reported to date. The concordance study with two STR-kits suggests that the DYS533 microvariant is due to an InDel in the flanking regions of the marker. One individual carried a large deletion, frequently detected in people of East Asian ancestry, encompassing the amelogenin locus. To our knowledge, this is the first time that such a deletion has been observed within European haplogroup R1b-U152. This is the first comprehensive Y chromosomal dataset for Switzerland, demonstrating significant population substructure due to an intra-national geographical barrier.
    The highest proportion of E1b1b appears in St. Gallen:
    We could also observe an uneven distribution of haplogroup E1b1b-M35 (Fig. 4e). However, this one does not follow a gradient from north to south but manifests as an enrichment of haplogroup E1b1b-M35 in the eastern part of the country, close to Austria. This pattern fits quite well with data from Tyrol, a region in Western Austria [61], showing an important fraction of 16.9 % haplogroup E in this area, mostly attributed to E-M78, a subclade of E1b1b-M35.
    With very Western Switzerland and Tyrol having a higher proportion of E-V13 than the one in the rest of the German speaking lands being noticeable. Allemannic groups in general have a higher proportion than Bavarians, but not as high as in this case. Western Switzerland has 9 % and Eastern (canton St. Gallen) 13 %. The Italian part has a much lower percentage of just 6 %, the Central and North Western part even lower. So generally speaking, a portion of the increased E1b1b could have come from Alpine Romance speakers I'd say. Most likely they had, just like the provincial Hallstatt-derived population in Austria, a higher portion of E-V13. Parts of St. Gallen were Raetoromanic speaking up to recently. The Rhaetians however are rather less likely to have harboured a higher proportion of E-V13, but more likely are Alpine Celts, Pannonians and Thraco-Cimmerians. The Ligurian percentage too speaks for itself, with some subclades coming from the large Sardinian sample seemingly being representative for those.
    Because the Cagliari E-V13 samples most likely come from Genuese settlers:
    Carloforte was founded in the 18th century by around 30 families of coral fishers, originally from the Ligurian town of Pegli, near Genoa. They had left their hometown in 1541, and had settled in the island of Tabarka, off the coast of Tunisia, to fish for coral. After centuries, the coral in that area was exhausted[3] and the families, while setting off back to Italy, found there was plenty of coral in the sea off the Sardinian west coast. They asked the King of Piedmont-Sardinia Charles Emmanuel III for permission to settle down on the once uninhabited San Pietro Island instead. When he granted them permission, the island was colonized (1739); the name Carloforte ("Charles the Strong", but also the "Carlo's Fort") was given to the town they then proceeded to found, in the Piedmontese king's honour. To this day, Carloforte maintains strong cultural ties with the mainland towns of Pegli and Genoa: the population still speaks a variety of Ligurian language called tabarchìn (or tabarchino, in Italian), separate from both Italian and Sardinian, which is used even by most children and taught in the island's schools.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carloforte

    If the Cagliari samples would be representative for the Ligurian-Genuese variation of E-V13, they indeed show relations connecting them with the Basarabi-Hallstatt sphere I'd say and I expect something similar for the Swiss German and Swiss French variation. Sardinian samples from Cagliari, presumably representing for the most part Ligurian variation:

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-PF6784*/

    Possible Greek/Messina overlap, but note the age:
    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-BY6527/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-Y150909*/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-FT79653*/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-PH1173/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-Z21340*/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-FGC11450/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-L241*/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-S2972*/

    https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-S2978*/

    The interesting thing about this Sardinian Cagliari diversity is that some of its subclades might be slightly younger than the initial dispersion, possibly, but none overlap after the Thraco-Cimmerian horizon and the early Hallstatt phase! There is no single younger overlap for all this 10 major subclades of E-V13 present in Sardinia, Cagliari on YFull. They are all local, presumably mostly Ligurian and Alpine Celtic, Early Iron Age branches.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
    The interesting thing about this Sardinian Cagliari diversity is that some of its subclades might be slightly younger than the initial dispersion, possibly, but none overlap after the Thraco-Cimmerian horizon and the early Hallstatt phase! There is no single younger overlap for all this 10 major subclades of E-V13 present in Sardinia, Cagliari on YFull. They are all local, presumably mostly Ligurian and Alpine Celtic, Early Iron Age branches.
    There are a lot of interesting comments to be made about E-V13 in northern Italy and its relations to the northwestern Balkans, but none of it has anything to do with a "Thraco-Cimmerian horizon" from the eastern Balkans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruzmi View Post
    There are a lot of interesting comments to be made about E-V13 in northern Italy and its relations to the northwestern Balkans, but none of it has anything to do with a "Thraco-Cimmerian horizon" from the eastern Balkans.
    The Thraco-Cimmerian horizon was very strong in Pannonia and spread from there, was very influential for Hallstatt in general and some Eastern Hallstatt provinces in particular. You find Thraco-Cimmerian equipment and weaponry in Northern Italy and the connections of Eastern Hallstatt to Alpine Celts and Ligurians are obvious.
    What's your take on the Ligurian and Alpine Celtic E-V13 frequency?

    There might be another case which could be related to Vlachs and Albanians, because in Slovenia the frequency of E-V13 is extremely low, even much lower than in Poland, much lower than in Russians actually. However, in one region its higher than the rest and a paper concluded:
    However, higher frequencies of G2a (5.2%) and especially
    E1b1b (7.3%), which were found in Lower Carniola, could
    represent a historic genetic trace of 15th, 16th and 17th
    century migrations of Balkan peoples known as Uskoks
    , who
    took refuge from the Ottoman invasions of the Balkan region.
    In Slovenia, these migrations were characteristic of Lower
    Carniola, especially the White Carniola sub-region, where
    certain towns and villages have preserved their unique Uskok
    culture to the present day. A future study involving DNA
    sampling specifically targeting the remaining Uskok communities
    could provide a clearer picture of the genetic structure
    of this population
    .
    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...er_populations

    Does anybody know some results from Uskok communities? They were ethnically mixed, Dalmatians, Vlachs, Albanians, regular Croats and so on. Like usual, especially the subclades would be interesting.

    These are the Slovenian regions:


    White Carniola is in the very South, therefore much closer to the Croatian and Serbian territory also. The second highest E1b1b being recorded for Styria, which is in the very North bordering Austria. On the whole this means the West Slovenia has an extremely low percentage of E-V13 (1,8-2,1 %) while the Central-Eastern region has a much higher one (5,8-7,3 %) and it goes down again in Prekmurje (2,4 %). Overall, if this distribution holds up, its a quite complicated pattern for the region. But what sticks out is that E1b : J2 is excluding each other!

    So this pattern might go still back, in part, to the Illyrian : Pannnian-Dacian-Celtic dichotomy in Eastern Hallstatt. The Frög group had strong relations to Basarabi, whereas the Unterkrainer group was very much oriented towards Illyrians. While the other haplogroups show no clear pattern in relation to J2 and E1b, those too do.

    High E1b and high J2 exclude each other:


    Top J2 is Upper Carniola with the lowest of all E1b counts (just 1,8 %)
    Top E1b is Lower Carniola with the lowest J2 count (just 1,8 %)

    Prekmurje is just more Germanic-Slavic shifted, with low counts of both. This mutually exclusive pattern is highly interesting.
    Last edited by Riverman; 10-18-2021 at 12:17 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
    There might be another case which could be related to Vlachs and Albanians, because in Slovenia the frequency of E-V13 is extremely low, even much lower than in Poland, much lower than in Russians actually. However, in one region its higher than the rest and a paper concluded:


    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...er_populations

    Does anybody know some results from Uskok communities? They were ethnically mixed, Dalmatians, Vlachs, Albanians, regular Croats and so on. Like usual, especially the subclades would be interesting.
    If you look into the Šarac et al. 2016 paper you will see that they also tested inhabitants of the Žumberak region settled by Uskoks and adjacent to the Slovenian Uskok region Bela Krajina. Out of 44 samples 8 were E-V13 (18,18%).

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikulic33 View Post
    If you look into the Šarac et al. 2016 paper you will see that they also tested inhabitants of the Žumberak region settled by Uskoks and adjacent to the Slovenian Uskok region Bela Krajina. Out of 44 samples 8 were E-V13 (18,18%).
    Thank you very much.

    Also interesting in the Northern Italy are not just the Rhatoromans, Alpine Celts and Ligurians, but also the Veneti with increased Hallstatt influences. Interestingly there is a decrease of E-V13 probably in both directions from the Veneti core region, both towards Slovenians and other Italians. The most ancient common lineages of Massenzatica have by far the highest frequency with 16 %, followed by the less drifted, probably more representative nearby Mesola population with 7,14 and Grignano with 6,25, while the people from Nonantola go down to 3,6 and those from S. Agata B. have zero. This is quite a decline from the more coastal regions of Massenzatica, Mesola and Grignano.

    This study shows how the co-presence of admixture and drift forms a suitable model for explaining the genetic variability of at least two of the four considered Commons, namely Grignano P. and Massenzatica. At the same time, we observed that the peculiar social-cultural features of Commons—based on patrilineal descent and local residence—influence their Y-chromosomal variability in a way reminiscent of ethnic-linguistic minorities, where phenomena such as isolation and/or admixture are frequently observed. The collected results allowed to reconstruct some aspects of the genetic history of the considered communities. For instance, our estimates suggest that the Commons of Nonantola, S. Agata B., and Grignano P. probably originated in the central Middle Ages from a set of mainly but not exclusively local populations, while the case of Massenzatica seems to suggest a more ancient origin.
    All these cases can be explained based on the effects of genetic drift, according to which the frequency of some haplogroups may have increased (or decreased) by random fluctuations. However, it is possible that some of them—particularly in Eastern Commons—could be the result of an introgression/admixture event around the time in which the Common was formed.
    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/...002/ajpa.24302

    Since its being mentioned in this study, I found a small study on Frisians, which seem to have about 5 % E-V13 in this small sample, the English 3,57 %. But since the other samples being also rather skewed, this needs to be taken with a pinch of salt. Original study for the Frisian number:
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4327154/

    I just mention it because I found very little about Frisian and generally Dutch E-V13.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
    The Thraco-Cimmerian horizon was very strong in Pannonia and spread from there, was very influential for Hallstatt in general and some Eastern Hallstatt provinces in particular. You find Thraco-Cimmerian equipment and weaponry in Northern Italy and the connections of Eastern Hallstatt to Alpine Celts and Ligurians are obvious.
    What's your take on the Ligurian and Alpine Celtic E-V13 frequency?

    There might be another case which could be related to Vlachs and Albanians, because in Slovenia the frequency of E-V13 is extremely low, even much lower than in Poland, much lower than in Russians actually. However, in one region its higher than the rest and a paper concluded:


    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...er_populations

    Does anybody know some results from Uskok communities? They were ethnically mixed, Dalmatians, Vlachs, Albanians, regular Croats and so on. Like usual, especially the subclades would be interesting.

    These are the Slovenian regions:


    White Carniola is in the very South, therefore much closer to the Croatian and Serbian territory also. The second highest E1b1b being recorded for Styria, which is in the very North bordering Austria. On the whole this means the West Slovenia has an extremely low percentage of E-V13 (1,8-2,1 %) while the Central-Eastern region has a much higher one (5,8-7,3 %) and it goes down again in Prekmurje (2,4 %). Overall, if this distribution holds up, its a quite complicated pattern for the region. But what sticks out is that E1b : J2 is excluding each other!

    So this pattern might go still back, in part, to the Illyrian : Pannnian-Dacian-Celtic dichotomy in Eastern Hallstatt. The Frög group had strong relations to Basarabi, whereas the Unterkrainer group was very much oriented towards Illyrians. While the other haplogroups show no clear pattern in relation to J2 and E1b, those too do.

    High E1b and high J2 exclude each other:


    Top J2 is Upper Carniola with the lowest of all E1b counts (just 1,8 %)
    Top E1b is Lower Carniola with the lowest J2 count (just 1,8 %)

    Prekmurje is just more Germanic-Slavic shifted, with low counts of both. This mutually exclusive pattern is highly interesting.
    E1b1b* do you Y-STR this samples

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    Quote Originally Posted by capsian View Post
    E1b1b* do you Y-STR this samples
    No. I also don't know if anybody else did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
    No. I also don't know if anybody else did.
    okay thanks this so sad maybe there samples under https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-V2729/
    there sample from serbia under this branch V1039 he is did WGS400 he is waiting his result exiting
    maybe also under haplgroup https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-PF2431/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post

    There might be another case which could be related to Vlachs and Albanians, because in Slovenia the frequency of E-V13 is extremely low, even much lower than in Poland, much lower than in Russians actually. However, in one region its higher than the rest and a paper concluded:

    However, higher frequencies of G2a (5.2%) and especially
    E1b1b (7.3%), which were found in Lower Carniola, could
    represent a historic genetic trace of 15th, 16th and 17th
    century migrations of Balkan peoples known as Uskoks, who
    took refuge from the Ottoman invasions of the Balkan region.
    In Slovenia, these migrations were characteristic of Lower
    Carniola, especially the White Carniola sub-region, where
    certain towns and villages have preserved their unique Uskok
    culture to the present day. A future study involving DNA
    sampling specifically targeting the remaining Uskok communities
    could provide a clearer picture of the genetic structure
    of this population.
    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...er_populations

    Does anybody know some results from Uskok communities? They were ethnically mixed, Dalmatians, Vlachs, Albanians, regular Croats and so on. Like usual, especially the subclades would be interesting.

    These are the Slovenian regions:
    (I'll write a full post about E-V13 in Italy at some point. I'll reply then to your question.)

    The largest study ever done on Poles (n=2,705) showed that E is 3.84%.

    Y-Chromosome Genetic Analysis of Modern Polish Population
    The most frequent Y-SNP binary haplogroups in all analyzed samples were found to be R (71.02%), I (15.71%), N (4.29%), E (3.84%), J (3.22%), and G (1.22%). The total contribution of the others, viz. Q, C, T, H, and O, totaled less than 1% (0.70%), and each comprised only individual samples (Table 1).

    It's not any different from Poland, nor should we expect Slovenia, an area which has faced many migrations to have any significant E-V13 %. In general, the last migration is the one which has the highest impact. E-V13 carriers were on the receiving end of migration impact in Pannonia (although Slovenia isn't really an area which ever had high E-V13 in my opinion as only a part of it is linked to Pannonia and the northwestern Balkans to the south) and they brought demographic changes when they moved to the north in the early Middle Ages.

    Uskoks in addition to Slavic have Herzegovinian/Dalmatian Aromanian and Albanian ancestry. It would explain their high E-V13, but the Zumberak results also represent founder effects of several related families.


    Quote Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
    High E1b and high J2 exclude each other:
    I don't how such a statement can be inferred, but presence of one haplogroup doesn't necessarily correlate with the non-presence of another haplogroup. It all depends on the historical circumstances. For LBA-EIA migrations from the Balkans to Italy, E-V13+J2b-L283 seem to be positively correlated. And for Roman Timacum Minus, they were pretty much part of the same population:

    I15544 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis E-V13,E-Z1057,E-CTS1273,E-BY3880 HV9
    I15545 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis I1,I-Z58,I-Z59,I-CTS8647,Z60,Z140,Z141 H1
    I15546 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis J2b2a-L283,J-Z622,J-Z600,J-Z585,J-Z615,J-Z597 L2a1+143+16189 (16192)
    I15547 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis J2b2a-L283 H+152
    I15548 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis J2b2a-L283,J-Z585,J-Z615,J-Z597,J-Z638,J-Z1297,J-Z8421,J-Z631,J-Z1043 W+194
    I15551 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis R1b-Z2103,R-Z2105 T1a
    I15552 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis R1b-Z2103,R-M12149,R-Z2106,R-Z2108,R-Z2110,R-CTS7556,R-Y5592,R-CTS1450 H1c
    I15553 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis E-V13,E-Z1057,E-CTS1273 T2b25
    I15554 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis E-V13,E-Z1057,E-CTS1273,E-BY3880 H
    I15555 Timacum Minus, Slog Necropolis G-P303,G-L140,G-PF3346,G-PF3345,G-CTS342,G-FGC12126 [email protected]

    After the Avar-Slavic migrations:

    I15537 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis E-V13,E-Z1057,E-CTS1273,E-BY3880,E-Z5017,E-Z5016,E-Y3762 H13a2a
    I15538 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis R1b-P312,R-D99 H1e1a6
    I15539 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis R1b-P312,R-D99 H1e1a6,H1e1a6
    I15540 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis .. J1b1a1
    I15541 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis I2a1b-L621,I-CTS10936,I-S19848,I-CTS4002,I-CTS10228,I-Y3120 K1a4
    I15542 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis I2a1b-L621,I-CTS10936,I-S19848,I-CTS4002,I-CTS10228,I-Y3120 H9a
    I15543 Timacum Minus, Kuline Necropolis J2-L26,J-Z6064,J-Z6055,J-Z6057,J-Y7013,J-Y7010 H1f+16093
    Last edited by Bruzmi; 10-19-2021 at 01:50 AM.

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Bruzmi For This Useful Post:

     Riverman (10-19-2021),  ShpataEMadhe (10-22-2021)

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