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Thread: Theory about "Southern European" DNA in East Asians and Southeast Asians

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    Theory about "Southern European" DNA in East Asians and Southeast Asians

    As https://www.quora.com/A-lot-of-East-...1-Why-is-this/ says, many East Asians and Southeast Asians get a tiny percentage of Southern European DNA, like 1 percent, in their DNA tests. This may sound strange given the distances between Southern Europe, on one hand, and East Asia and Southeast Asia, on the other hand. In https://www.quora.com/A-lot-of-East-...er/Ygor-Coelho, Ygor Coelho exposes a good theory of what this DNA actually represents. First, DNA companies' regional labels shouldn't be taken too seriously. The "Southern European" DNA could simply be from a population similar to Southern Europeans, not necessarily from the Southern Europeans, themselves. Second, he guesses that this DNA actually is from Anatolian farmers, Caucasus Hunter-Gatherers and Iranian farmers. Those ancient groups colonized both Europe, especially Southern Europe, on one hand, and Central Asia and South Asia, on the other hand. Given the contacts between Central Asia and East Asia and the contacts between South Asia and, both, East Asia and Southeast Asia, for millenia, it doesn't sound implausible for, at least, a tiny percentage of that DNA having reached East Asians and Southeast Asians. In
    addition, Indo-Europeans also colonized both Europe, on one hand, and Central Asia, including western China, and South Asia, on the other hand, which could also explain the "Southern European" DNA in East Asians and Southeast Asians.
    What do you think of this?

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     C J Wyatt III (11-17-2019)

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    In the case of Filipinos it's quite obvious it's derived from Spanish and/or Portuguese colonizers. It's possible that's also the case of other SE Asian folks (see here). If the Southern European component in East Asians is related to Anatolian farmers, I'd expect them to get a few % of the Middle Easterner/North African/West Asian components too, since they're also partially descended from these populations. The Yamnaya component (which is presumably related to Indo-Europeans) is highest in Northern Europe.

    The thing is that, in comparison with Europe, these areas have been poorly studied. We have little aDNA from SE Asia, which means that our knowledge about past migrations in these areas is quite limited.

    In summary, I think the most likely explanation is gene flow mainly from the Spanish and Portuguese during the colonial period.
    Last edited by Milkyway; 11-17-2019 at 03:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkyway View Post
    In the case of Filipinos it's quite obvious it's derived from Spanish and/or Portuguese colonizers. It's possible that's also the case of other SE Asian folks (see here). If the Southern European component in East Asians is related to Anatolian farmers, I'd expect them to get a few % of the Middle Easterner/North African/West Asian components too, since they're also partially descended from these populations. The Yamnaya component (which is presumably related to Indo-Europeans) is highest in Northern Europe.

    The thing is that, in comparison with Europe, these areas have been poorly studied. We have little aDNA from SE Asia, which means that our knowledge about past migrations in these areas is quite limited.

    In summary, I think the most likely explanation is gene flow mainly from the Spanish and Portuguese during the colonial period.
    No offense but, the study that you cite is rather old. While in Filipinos, specifically, that DNA could be Spanish, that's not, really, possible for other Southeast Asians and especially not for East Asians.
    Regardless, many East Asians and Southeast Asians whk get a tiny percentage of Southern European DNA also get a tiny percentage of West Asian DNA. But, regarding those who don't, remember that DNA companies' regional labels shouldn't be taken too seriously.
    Regardless, FWIW, East Asians and Southeast Asians have some South Asian DNA, read https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...apanese-people.
    I'm pretty sure that's where the DNA mislabeled "Southern European" came from.
    As for the steppe component being found more in Northern Europe, I suspected that someone would mention this. Thing is, South Asians, from whom East Asians and Southeast Asians probably got this DNA, share more ancestral components, as a whole, with Southern Europeans than with Northern Europeans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ricardo Canedo View Post
    No offense but, the study that you cite is rather old. While in Filipinos, specifically, that DNA could be Spanish, that's not, really, possible for other Southeast Asians and especially not for East Asians.
    Regardless, many East Asians and Southeast Asians whk get a tiny percentage of Southern European DNA also get a tiny percentage of West Asian DNA. But, regarding those who don't, remember that DNA companies' regional labels shouldn't be taken too seriously.
    Regardless, FWIW, East Asians and Southeast Asians have some South Asian DNA, read https://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...apanese-people.
    I'm pretty sure that's where the DNA mislabeled "Southern European" came from.
    As for the steppe component being found more in Northern Europe, I suspected that someone would mention this. Thing is, South Asians, from whom East Asians and Southeast Asians probably got this DNA, share more ancestral components, as a whole, with Southern Europeans than with Northern Europeans.
    Yes, they likely have some South Asian DNA, but you said in the original post you were curious about their tiny Southern European component (you didn't mention West Asian, that's why I understood it was specifically related to the peoples from Southern Europe).

    Several genetic studies have detected a small % of that component in a minority Filipinos which is likely related to the Spanish colonization of the archipelago. A possibility is that there was a small % of gene flow from these Iberian men to other regions from SE Asia (although I'd need to research it, maybe that's not the case). Regarding Indians, I think most Indians (especially those from Northern India) have a component that's related to the Yamnaya (steppe invaders from Russia) but they also have others related to Neolithic farmers from Iran that are possibly more common among present-day Southern Europeans.

    I said that gene flow from Iberian colonizers was the most likely explanation because to my knowledge there's no close connection other than that between Southern Europe and SE Asia within the last centuries.

    In any case, here you can see 23andme results for some Indians and Pakistanis I randomly picked from Google. There's no Southern or Northern European component in them (some even score higher for East Asian/Native American).

    http://sharadaprasad.com/wp-content/...cestry-Map.png

    https://i.imgur.com/Iw7HWPD.jpg

    https://blog.23andme.com/wp-content/...M-1024x589.png

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DdqkmZUUwAAlVwn.jpg

    https://i.redd.it/ihphy2b06r421.png

    Results for Bangladeshi geneticist Razib Khan:

    https://www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2016/...or-razib-khan/
    Last edited by Milkyway; 11-24-2019 at 11:03 AM.

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