Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 39

Thread: Moroccan (muslim & jewish) results (ftdna)

  1. #1
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Moroccan (muslim & jewish) results (ftdna)

    Hello everyone,

    I wanted to share with you few Moroccan results from ftdna, just to give you an idea about regional differences.

    Northern Moroccans (Djebala Arabophones + Riffians) usually score elevated NA + Euro, and almost no middle eastern or subsaharan.

    Arabophone from NW Morocco:
     




    Berber from Rif:
     




    The region of Fès has basically 3 groups, the Berber (mainly Middle Atlassians), the Arabophones (mainly Berbers with minor arabic influence) and the urban native of Fès (Fassi), this city was the largest Moroccan/ Maghrebi city until it was surpassed by Casablanca in the 20th century, Fès was originally populated by Andalusians from Sevilla, and due to its history it received continuous flows from Iberia, also this city had a large jewish population, the biggest "mellah" (jewish neighborhood) in the Arab world was in Fès.
    Out of the 3 groups, the urban Fassis are the most atypical for Morocco:


    Arabophones from the region north of Fès :
     







    Middle Atlassians from the region south of Fès:
     








    Urban Fassis :
     











    Moriscos:
    These originally spread all over the country especially the north, but the latest moriscos (post 1600), migrated mainly to Fès, Rabat, Tetouan and Chefchaouen, the first was a big city and they didn't had a strong impact in its demographics, the case of Rabat are different, Rabat was basically a large fort, near the city of Salé, who was inhabited by urban Moroccans, and once arrived to Morocco some Moriscos asked to settle in Rabat, where they mixed with people from Salé, but they kept a clear "Morisco" identity, Spanish was spoken as first language until the 19 century.
    Tetouan is kinda similar, the only difference is that Tetuan don't have a large city, and therefore the Moroccan indigenous part of Tetouani people comes from the countryside (similar to Arabophone from NW Morocco).

    Here 2 Tetouanis with Morisco heritage :
     






    Rbati with Morisco heritage:
     




    People here are mainly Berber with some Arab ancestry (usually less than 5% but can reach 13% in some rare cases).

    Arabophone from Western Morocco:
     




    Last edited by Amhas; 11-24-2019 at 01:54 AM.

  2. The Following 24 Users Say Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     Angoliga (11-24-2019),  BMG (12-03-2019),  Cascio (02-06-2020),  drobbah (11-24-2019),  emc (03-19-2020),  Empecinado (12-05-2019),  E_M81_I3A (03-20-2020),  hartaisarlag (03-20-2020),  Itrane2000 (07-15-2020),  Johnny ola (04-25-2020),  jonahst (11-24-2019),  Kulin (11-24-2019),  Massam (03-21-2020),  Onur Dincer (09-23-2020),  passenger (11-24-2019),  Pedro Ruben (09-28-2020),  pgbk87 (03-19-2020),  Piquerobi (04-25-2020),  Principe (11-24-2019),  RCO (11-25-2019),  Reza (03-21-2020),  Seabass (11-24-2019),  Targum (03-23-2020),  TonyScaletta (03-19-2020)

  3. #2
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Moroccan Jews:

    Like the Moriscos and Fassi, they are clearly outlier, these are mainly of Sephardi heritage:
     













    Southwestern Berbers:
    These score the highest % of North African in Ftdna, I post once, since a dozen have 100% NA, some Sahrawis can reach 100% NA in FTDNA, and some Mauritanian beidhane too.

     




    ( NB: all of them gave the autorisation to publish their results.)

  4. The Following 16 Users Say Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     AbdoNumen (11-24-2019),  BMG (12-03-2019),  Cascio (02-06-2020),  chelle (11-24-2019),  Erikl86 (07-15-2020),  jonahst (11-24-2019),  Onur Dincer (09-23-2020),  passenger (11-24-2019),  pgbk87 (03-19-2020),  Piquerobi (04-25-2020),  Principe (11-24-2019),  RCO (11-24-2019),  Reza (03-21-2020),  Seabass (11-24-2019),  Targum (11-24-2019),  TonyScaletta (03-19-2020)

  5. #3
    Moderator
    Posts
    1,203
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    NW Europe+Ash/Seph Jewish

    England Star of David Netherlands Turkey Denmark Germany
    Quote Originally Posted by Amhas View Post
    Moroccan Jews:

    Like the Moriscos and Fassi, they are clearly outlier, these are mainly of Sephardi heritage:
     













    Southwestern Berbers:
    These score the highest % of North African in Ftdna, I post once, since a dozen have 100% NA, some Sahrawis can reach 100% NA in FTDNA, and some Mauritanian beidhane too.

     




    ( NB: all of them gave the autorisation to publish their results.)
    Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.

    I haven't seen a whole lot of FTDNA results for Sephardic Jews, or North Africans in general, for that matter. I'm wondering how representative these results are for Moroccan Jews. The Sephardic percentages seem low in comparison to MyHeritage, but that could easily be because the MH reference populations are specifically North African, whereas FTDNA seemingly uses Eastern Sephardim.

    It's particularly interesting that the Urban Fassis seem to have such mixed backgrounds in comparison with others from the same region.

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to passenger For This Useful Post:

     Erikl86 (07-15-2020),  jonahst (11-24-2019),  Principe (11-24-2019),  Seabass (11-24-2019)

  7. #4
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Quote Originally Posted by passenger View Post
    Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.

    I haven't seen a whole lot of FTDNA results for Sephardic Jews, or North Africans in general, for that matter. I'm wondering how representative these results are for Moroccan Jews. The Sephardic percentages seem low in comparison to MyHeritage, but that could easily be because the MH reference populations are specifically North African, whereas FTDNA seemingly uses Eastern Sephardim.

    It's particularly interesting that the Urban Fassis seem to have such mixed backgrounds in comparison with others from the same region.

    I would say that they are quite representative, these people have 4 Moroccan born g-parents, I saw one with up to 20% North African but I can't post it.

    Myheritage doesn't look very accurate for North Africans, almost everyone scores +15% Iberian, and their jewish database is very large, and that make every non jewish score some kind of jewish.

    I was very surprised by Urban Fassis too, I knew that according to historical events they have recent Iberian and jewish ancestry (middle ages) but I was thinking that it was exaggerated by authors and yet their results confirm this, there are even some fassi families named Cohen lol.

  8. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     Cascio (02-06-2020),  passenger (11-24-2019),  Rinema (03-28-2020),  Seabass (11-24-2019)

  9. #5
    Moderator
    Posts
    1,203
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    NW Europe+Ash/Seph Jewish

    England Star of David Netherlands Turkey Denmark Germany
    Quote Originally Posted by Amhas View Post
    I would say that they are quite representative, these people have 4 Moroccan born g-parents, I saw one with up to 20% North African but I can't post it.

    Myheritage doesn't look very accurate for North Africans, almost everyone scores +15% Iberian, and their jewish database is very large, and that make every non jewish score some kind of jewish.

    I was very surprised by Urban Fassis too, I knew that according to historical events they have recent Iberian and jewish ancestry (middle ages) but I was thinking that it was exaggerated by authors and yet their results confirm this, there are even some fassi families named Cohen lol.
    Are these all examples from your DNA matches?

  10. #6
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Quote Originally Posted by passenger View Post
    Are these all examples from your DNA matches?
    Some are my matches, and some are my friends matches.

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     Cascio (02-06-2020)

  12. #7
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Unpublished groups:

    Eastern Moroccans:

    Arabophones score a slightly higher Arabian influence than the other groups.

    Berbers score similar to Middle Atlas Berbers and the Beni Snous Berbers from Algeria.


    Southern eastern Morocco:

    Berberophones:

    2 groups speak Berber, one is pred. Berber and score high North African, similar to Southwestern Berbers.
    and the second is SSA shifted, overall this group shows SSA varying from 30% to 60%, with some rare cases reaching 70%.

    Arabophones:

    Basically the same as Berberophones, one group is SSA shifted, and the second is Berber with an arabian influence, this varies from a group to another, some groups can score high High north african, and some tribes can reach up to 30% Arabian and are outlier to Morocco, and usually look shifted towards the algero-tunisian-libyan arabs.

  13. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     Cascio (02-06-2020),  Onur Dincer (09-23-2020)

  14. #8
    Registered Users
    Posts
    918
    Sex
    Location
    UK
    Ethnicity
    Tuscan Italian
    Nationality
    British
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1b-U152+Z36+
    mtDNA (M)
    U6a7a

    United Kingdom Italy
    Great work, Amhas, but how do we account for the Southeast European reading in the Rif and Middle Atlas samples?

  15. The Following User Says Thank You to Cascio For This Useful Post:

     Amhas (02-08-2020)

  16. #9
    Registered Users
    Posts
    59
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M78

    Quote Originally Posted by Cascio View Post
    Great work, Amhas, but how do we account for the Southeast European reading in the Rif and Middle Atlas samples?
    Neolithic I guess, KEB (Moroccan Late neolithic) related .

  17. The Following User Says Thank You to Amhas For This Useful Post:

     Cascio (02-08-2020)

  18. #10
    Junior Member
    Posts
    2
    Sex

    Very interesting , I wonder what are the haplogroup of Moriscos and Fassi's

  19. The Following User Says Thank You to alves971997 For This Useful Post:

     Cascio (03-19-2020)

Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 07-16-2020, 01:48 PM
  2. Gujarati Muslim Results
    By Reza in forum Southern
    Replies: 54
    Last Post: 03-24-2020, 01:19 PM
  3. Northern Syrian/Moroccan results
    By Eli00 in forum MyHeritage
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-05-2019, 03:23 PM
  4. Kashmiri Muslim Gedmatch Results
    By Sapporo in forum Southern
    Replies: 69
    Last Post: 06-07-2018, 04:34 PM
  5. Replies: 91
    Last Post: 11-24-2017, 06:43 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •