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Thread: How can I interpret this?

  1. #1
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    Republic of Venice Italy Tuscany Italy Two Sicilies Portugal Brazilian Empire

    How can I interpret this?

    Somebody approached me on Facebook to ask about my Euclidean distances map from the K36 Ancestry Report. She and I seem to have similar ancestry - regular Brazilian heritage:

    She - Italian, Portuguese, some French, about 15% Amerindian and 5% SSA.
    I - Italian, Portuguese (with some 12-15% Moorish), no known French ancestry so far, about 7% Amerindian, and 3% SSA.

    Although it has some differences, both of us have around 80% European, but our Euclidean distances maps look VERY different: hers has much closer distances, while mine is pretty vague. Could my higher Middle-Eastern heritage be the cause? Does anyone have any other ideas why this could be happening? Here are the maps:

    Hers:

    78129690_10220883842988310_9067052089321979904_n.jpg

    Mine:

    K36 Ancestry Report.PNG
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  2. #2
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    K36 is not great, but there's plenty of variation even within the same country, so you can imagine how things can get with people of mixed background
    YDNA E-Y31991>PF4428>Y134097>Y134104>Y168273>FT17866 (TMRCA ~1000AD) - Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1690 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal - Stonemason, miller.
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    [1] "distance%=1.6053"

    Ruderico

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  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Ruderico For This Useful Post:

     tatals (11-27-2019)

  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    K36 is not great, but there's plenty of variation even within the same country, so you can imagine how things can get with people of mixed background
    Yes, that's true. What seemed odd to us was the fact that our K36 percentages on GEDMatch are not even that different (I'll post them below). But you're right, it makes sense that we are probably making the calculators go a little wild.

    __

    (I need to improve my skills on posting here in order to avoid making such long posts, but there it goes: )


    Her GEDmatch K36 percentages:

    Amerindian 13.25 Pct
    Arabian -
    Armenian 0.49 Pct
    Basque 1.31 Pct
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro 2.97 Pct
    East_African 0.44 Pct
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 1.79 Pct
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro 1.58 Pct
    East_Med 0.44 Pct
    Eastern_Euro 3.25 Pct
    Fennoscandian 2.53 Pct
    French 3.48 Pct
    Iberian 19.82 Pct
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 19.62 Pct
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern 0.80 Pct
    North_African 2.61 Pct
    North_Atlantic 3.37 Pct
    North_Caucasian 3.03 Pct
    North_Sea 8.63 Pct
    Northeast_African 0.85 Pct
    Oceanian -
    Omotic 0.86 Pct
    Pygmy 0.66 Pct
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African 2.96 Pct
    West_Caucasian 0.91 Pct
    West_Med 4.34 Pct


    ________________________
    Mine:

    Amerindian 5.80 Pct
    Arabian 1.02 Pct
    Armenian 0.28 Pct
    Basque 2.30 Pct
    Central_African 1.36 Pct
    Central_Euro 5.54 Pct
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 4.15 Pct
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro -
    East_Med 0.90 Pct
    Eastern_Euro 5.40 Pct
    Fennoscandian -
    French 3.10 Pct
    Iberian 16.51 Pct
    Indo-Chinese 1.15 Pct
    Italian 16.06 Pct
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern 7.45 Pct
    North_African 2.47 Pct
    North_Atlantic 6.96 Pct
    North_Caucasian 2.77 Pct
    North_Sea 8.95 Pct
    Northeast_African 1.47 Pct
    Oceanian -
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African -
    West_Caucasian 1.22 Pct
    West_Med 5.12 Pct
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  5. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatals View Post
    Mine
    Population
    Amerindian -
    Arabian -
    Armenian -
    Basque 6.92 Pct
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro -
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan -
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro 2.30 Pct
    East_Med 0.86 Pct
    Eastern_Euro -
    Fennoscandian -
    French 6.90 Pct
    Iberian 29.94 Pct
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 23.06 Pct
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern -
    North_African 5.40 Pct
    North_Atlantic 4.72 Pct
    North_Caucasian -
    North_Sea 4.61 Pct
    Northeast_African -
    Oceanian 0.28 Pct
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian 2.07 Pct
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural 1.13 Pct
    West_African 1.35 Pct
    West_Caucasian -
    West_Med 10.45 Pct

    You got less Italian percentage than me, so you will realize the validity of the this test.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to JJJ For This Useful Post:

     tatals (11-27-2019)

  7. #5
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    Wow! 7% less! It makes no sense at all!
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  8. #6
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    But another weird thing I've noticed is that, despite all the weirdness regarding K36, my map is not that different from the ones that ph2ter made:

    Attachment 34975

    Attachment 34976

    Attachment 34977
    Last edited by tatals; 11-28-2019 at 03:30 AM.
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  9. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatals View Post
    But another weird thing I've noticed is that, despite all the weirdness regarding K36, my map is not that different from the ones that ph2ter made:

    Attachment 34975

    Attachment 34976

    Attachment 34977
    Reposting pictures.

    Old map:

    3gW0xGU.png


    Updated map:

    Xg8qQV7.png


    Blue map:

    zITP3EN.png
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  10. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatals View Post
    Reposting pictures.

    Old map:

    3gW0xGU.png


    Updated map:

    Xg8qQV7.png


    Blue map:

    zITP3EN.png
    How does one go about getting an Euclidean distances map?
    “Man cannot live without a permanent trust in something indestructible in himself, and at the same time that indestructible something as well as his trust in it may remain permanently concealed from him.”

    ― Franz Kafka

  11. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archetype0ne View Post
    How does one go about getting an Euclidean distances map?
    Apparently, I can't post links, so I'll try messaging you.
    mtDNA: X2c2 - MDKA: Justina Maria, b. ca. 1770 in Viseu, Portugal

    maternal Y-DNA: R-CTS4065 - MDKA:Domenico Lombardo, b. ca. 1730 in Caserta, Italy

    paternal mtDNA: HV0a - MDKA: Paola Cobalchin, b. ca. 1795 in Vicenza, Italy

    paternal Y-DNA: confirmed R-M269, predicted U152-Z36 - MDKA: Pietro Scavazzini, b. ca. 1795 in Rovigo, Italy

  12. #10
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    You probably don't have 12-15% ''true'' Moorish and 3% SSA. Part of your Middle Eastern is probably Italian and other part of it plus the 3% SSA in GEDmatch comes from the Iberian North African. I have very confusing results too in different calculators, but knowing my ancestry make me realize that it would be impossible for me to have real 10% Middle Eastern/West Asian as MyHeritage gives me. Southern Italians and even Northern Italians have more West Asian/eastern med components when compared to Iberians.
    I was supposed to be mainly Iberian + Northern Italian with some South Italian, SSA and Amerindian and some calcs model me as being 25% some West Asian/Caucasus population (Turkish, Azerbaijani, Balkar, Kumyk etc) or 50% some Eastern Med population (Sicilian, Albanian, Serbian, Greek, Montenegrin, Ashkenazi/Sephardi etc). Or it came from the Italians or some of my Iberian ancestors were actually Jews, West Asian is almost absent in Iberians.

    Here in Brazil we are used to think in Italians as being semi-nordics but the reality is that they have more eastern components than Iberians apart from North African that is much higher in Iberians.

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