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Thread: [split] The Aryans: Autonym & Genetic Profile

  1. #1
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    [split] The Aryans: Autonym & Genetic Profile

    Quote Originally Posted by AlexRus View Post
    Aryan result
    53.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    27.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    17.6 WHG
    1.6 S_Devils_Gate_Cave_N
    Aryan in the ethno-linguistical sense is used for a person speaking an Indo-Iranian language no matter how he genetically clusters. Not sure which ancient or modern day Indo-Iranian has such a genetic profile and rather this result look like that of a modern day East European speaking a Balto-Slavic language.

    Aryans/Indo-Iranians clustered on a global level with East Europeans but there doesn't seem to be direct continuity between Proto-Aryan tribes in East Europe and modern day East Europeans in terms of language and y-dna. Proto-Indo-Iranian R1a lineages died almost fully out in East Europe except among Tatars, Jews and some Volga people. There is more Indo-Iranian/Aryan-related R1a-Z93 today among Arabs, Jews and Mongols than among any modern day Europeans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coldmountains View Post
    Aryan in the ethno-linguistical sense is used for a person speaking an Indo-Iranian language no matter how he genetically clusters. Not sure which ancient or modern day Indo-Iranian has such a genetic profile and rather this result look like that of a modern day East European speaking a Balto-Slavic language.

    Aryans/Indo-Iranians clustered on a global level with East Europeans but there doesn't seem to be direct continuity between Proto-Aryan tribes in East Europe and modern day East Europeans in terms of language and y-dna. Proto-Indo-Iranian R1a lineages died almost fully out in East Europe except among Tatars, Jews and some Volga people. There is more Indo-Iranian/Aryan-related R1a-Z93 today among Arabs, Jews and Mongols than among any modern day Europeans.
    Sintashta_MLBA for comparison

    Target: RUS_Sintashta_MLBA
    Distance: 2.7142% / 0.02714240
    68.6 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    21.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    9.8 WHG

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexRus View Post
    Aryan result
    53.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    27.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    17.6 WHG
    1.6 S_Devils_Gate_Cave_N
    That result has too low Yamnaya and too high WHG and Barcin N to be Aryan (I have early Indo-Iranians in mind here as they called themselves Aryan originally and their Indo-Iranian-speaking descendants, and only them, acquired that label from them). Here are typical Aryan (early Aryan) results:

    2020-07-10 01_21_17-VahaduoJS 19.11.2 - Comodo Dragon.png
    Last edited by Onur Dincer; 07-09-2020 at 10:32 PM.
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    Own Y-DNA: R1b>P312>U152>L2>Z41150>DF90>FGC14641>FGC32042>FGC 32049; Nigde, Turkey
    Own mtDNA: X2e2a3; Drama, Greece
    Maternal Y-DNA: R1a>Y40>YP294>BY90442; Razgrad, Bulgaria
    Father's mtDNA: T2b; Nigde, Turkey
    Paternal grandfather's mtDNA: H2a1; Nigde, Turkey
    Maternal grandfather's mtDNA: H5o; Razgrad, Bulgaria
    Father's maternal Y-DNA: R1b>P312>U152>L2>Z41150>DF90>FGC14641>FGC32042; Nigde, Turkey

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    Quote Originally Posted by Onur Dincer View Post
    That result has too low Yamnaya and too high WHG and Barcin N to be Aryan (I have early Indo-Iranians in mind here as they called themselves Aryan originally and their Indo-Iranian-speaking descendants, and only them, acquired that label from them). Here are typical Aryan (early Aryan) results:

    2020-07-10 01_21_17-VahaduoJS 19.11.2 - Comodo Dragon.png
    This East Asian among them is coming from eastern iranic nomadic tribes?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny ola View Post
    This East Asian among them is coming from eastern iranic nomadic tribes?
    These population averages have no or very low East Eurasian admixture. Most of the steppe Indo-Iranians had no or very low East Eurasian admixture before the Iron Age. The situation would change dramatically in the Iron Age. The invention of horseback riding during the transition to the Iron Age and a much more nomadic lifestyle it would trigger must have facilitated fast long-distance migrations that would spread East Eurasian ancestry to all parts of the Eurasian steppe.
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    Father's mtDNA: T2b; Nigde, Turkey
    Paternal grandfather's mtDNA: H2a1; Nigde, Turkey
    Maternal grandfather's mtDNA: H5o; Razgrad, Bulgaria
    Father's maternal Y-DNA: R1b>P312>U152>L2>Z41150>DF90>FGC14641>FGC32042; Nigde, Turkey

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlexRus View Post
    Aryan result
    53.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    27.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    17.6 WHG
    1.6 S_Devils_Gate_Cave_N
    LOL if that is the yard stick we can call Eneolithic Steppe types "Aryan" too . This term has become so cliched , but to be objective it is only used by Indo Iranian groups emerging out of the BMAC contact zones in the Bronze Age, Avestan Iranics used Arya Vaejanem for a region encompassing Eastern Iran and Central Asia, Ariana for Afghanistan, Aryavarta was the term for the region of NW India/Eastern Pakistan used by Indo Aryans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Onur Dincer View Post
    These population averages have no or very low East Eurasian admixture. Most of the steppe Indo-Iranians had no or very low East Eurasian admixture before the Iron Age. The situation would change dramatically in the Iron Age. The invention of horseback riding during the transition to the Iron Age and a much more nomadic lifestyle it would trigger must have facilitated fast long-distance migrations that would spread East Eurasian ancestry to all parts of the Eurasian steppe.
    The later Scythians, Sarmatians, Cimmerian etc?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny ola View Post
    The later Scythians, Sarmatians, Cimmerian etc?
    Yes, also the Sakas, Massagetae, etc.
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    Father's mtDNA: T2b; Nigde, Turkey
    Paternal grandfather's mtDNA: H2a1; Nigde, Turkey
    Maternal grandfather's mtDNA: H5o; Razgrad, Bulgaria
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    LOL if that is the yard stick we can call Eneolithic Steppe types "Aryan" too . This term has become so cliched , but to be objective it is only used by Indo Iranian groups emerging out of the BMAC contact zones in the Bronze Age, Avestan Iranics used Arya Vaejanem for a region encompassing Eastern Iran and Central Asia, Ariana for Afghanistan, Aryavarta was the term for the region of NW India/Eastern Pakistan used by Indo Aryans.
    No, the steppe Indo-Iranians called themselves Aryan too. See for instance the Iron subgroup of the Ossetians (the word "Iron" is a variant of the word "Aryan"), a people descended from the Sarmatians.
    Last edited by Onur Dincer; 07-09-2020 at 11:16 PM.
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    Father's mtDNA: T2b; Nigde, Turkey
    Paternal grandfather's mtDNA: H2a1; Nigde, Turkey
    Maternal grandfather's mtDNA: H5o; Razgrad, Bulgaria
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    Quote Originally Posted by Onur Dincer View Post
    No, the steppe Indo-Iranians called themselves Aryan too. See for instance the Iron subgroup of the Ossetians (the word "Iron" is a variant of the word "Aryan"), a people descended from the Sarmatians.
    Proto Ossetians and Samartians are back migrated East Iranics from those contact zones in Central Asia and they emerge much later than those which spread into South Eurasia.

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