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Thread: South Asians with Turkish/Turkic/Mongol descent thread

  1. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by pakistani View Post
    I too, have Chishti Sufis in my family tree

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shah...lah_Jahanabadi
    Awesome! I just had a look at my shijrah and found Shah Kalimullah Sahib in there too

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     pakistani (11-24-2020)

  3. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed Ali View Post
    Awesome. I'd be very interested to see the results of your maternal family members.

    From what my grandfather tells me, the Chishtis tended to be from the 'Islamic honorific lineages' until the 18th century. But then, with the disintegration of the Mughal empire, the leadership became diffused and locals tribes increasingly embraced the Chishti khanqashs in places like Punjab. Hence, for example, many of the most prominent Chishti saints in Pakistan have 'local' caste identities e.g. Pathan (Taunsa Sharif), Awan (Hafiz Jamal Multani; Sial Sharif as well), Rajput (Chishtian Sharif) and Koreja (KotMithan, Chachran Sharif etc). Whereas many of the older shrines in India (Ajmer, Dehli etc) revolve around Syed saints.

    In terms of admixture, I expected my grandfather to show some MENA or Central Asian admixture given his family traditions but it's very limited. Instead, he has a good dollop of EEF which could be attributable to an Anatolian or Mediterranean ancestor (thanks to users who have helped point me in this direction) as well as a disproportionate number of Afghan matches. My hunch is he had a Nader Shah or Durrani era Qizilbash Turkic ancestor who may have been admixed with something more western and somehow, bizarrely, this west med element managed to survive to this day..
    Just found out I'm positive for J2-MF10475. According to SNP tracker, this SNP has a formation date of circa 1500 BCE, which is a lot better than the previous estimated TMRCA! Apparently MF10475 is found in 2 Armenians, 1 Iranian, 1 Bayat and a Punjabi so far (the Iranian chalcolithic and Sappali Tepe samples were MF10475-) and has also been present in the Armenia region since ancient times (Molgen). So I guess the Qizilbash/caucasus theory might be tenable..

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  5. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahmed Ali View Post
    Just found out I'm positive for J2-MF10475. According to SNP tracker, this SNP has a formation date of circa 1500 BCE, which is a lot better than the previous estimated TMRCA! Apparently MF10475 is found in 2 Armenians, 1 Iranian, 1 Bayat and a Punjabi so far (the Iranian chalcolithic and Sappali Tepe samples were MF10475-) and has also been present in the Armenia region since ancient times (Molgen). So I guess the Qizilbash/caucasus theory might be tenable..
    What test did you take? It is not possible to tell your relationship with others on the YTree unless you and all others have tested at the same level with WGS or Big Y or Y Elite etc. test.

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  7. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jatt1 View Post
    What test did you take? It is not possible to tell your relationship with others on the YTree unless you and all others have tested at the same level with WGS or Big Y or Y Elite etc. test.
    So far, I've used only y-seq. I first came back as J-Y182882 with a TMRCA of 16,000 BP. That clade has since split into J-Y182882* (containing a Pakistani Punjabi) and J-FT184963 (a Russian Tatar and Bahraini) with a TMRCA of 9100 BP. I then stumbled upon MF10475 which is downstream of the former and has been documented by FTDNA and discussed briefly on SNP tracker, Molgen etc. I found that the Punjabi PJL sample and also a modern Iranian (and some of the others I mentioned) were positive for this clade which has a formation date of (apparently) 1500 BC. So I asked y-seq to develop the primer for me and test me; they did, and just last week I came back positive.

    Essentially, what I am trying to work out is whether my grandfather's own gr-gr grandfather was a foreigner or local. So far, I have a strong hunch he was foreign, but I thought the y-DNA might give me some further insight into it (I never probed the J2a prediction 23andme gave me any further). As mentioned, I am increasingly beginning to believe he had an Afsharid/Durranid era ancestor whose paternal lineage was probably originally from the Caucasus region.. I think I may invest in a more comprehensive Y-dna test at some point to see how I fit in relation to others on the y-tree (the only difficulty is Mf10475 is not yet recognised by y-full)..

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  9. #145
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    Hyderabad State Mughal Empire
    Bihari Muslim results

    https://www.reddit.com/r/23andme/com..._both_parents/



    So, we're North Indian Muslims with known ancestry from Bihar for at least 3 generations from both sides, with some known people from the Delhi, UP belt as well. Also included results for my Dad and crap it should say Maternal Uncle.

    Haplogroups

    - Maternal: M5b2

    - Paternal: R-Y7

    ...

    Takeaways

    - Similar Northern Indian and Pakistani, and similar Bengali and Northeast Indian from both mom's and dad's sides – makes sense given location of Bihar

    - Central Asian seems to be almost entirely from Dad's side. They have a family tree going back at least 400 years which indicated the Central Asian part. But North Indian Muslims tend to have a tiny bit Central Asian, so, not surprised

    - Southern South Asian, and Southern Indian seems to be mostly from Mom's side. This makes sense as well. Looks like the mom's side is more Indian, and dad's side has some components that migrated to India later.
    V5.9, phased with both parents (before & after update)





    Even though Bihar is NE India and some components can overlap, they look like ingredients to some old Turkic admixture. Overall he has gotten Central Asian, Iranian, Anatolion, Cypriot, Chinese, and Mongol traces. As for the gedmatch results, there seems to be a decent Med Islander pull.

    kit:MR1142219

    harappaworld

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 S-Indian 39.4
    2 Baloch 32.26
    3 NE-Euro 8.94
    4 Caucasian 8.8
    5 Mediterranean 3.29
    6 SE-Asian 2.04
    7 American 1.3
    8 Beringian 1.23
    9 NE-Asian 1.19
    10 Papuan 1.05
    11 Siberian 0.32
    12 SW-Asian 0.18

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 bengali-brahmin (harappa) 4.88
    2 bihari-muslim (harappa) 5.28
    3 up-muslim (harappa) 5.6
    4 up-brahmin (harappa) 6.3
    5 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 6.57
    6 vaish (reich) 7.31
    7 karnataka-brahmin (harappa) 8.16
    8 up-kshatriya (metspalu) 8.27
    9 maharashtrian (harappa) 8.57
    10 meghawal (reich) 9.04
    11 gujarati-b (hapmap) 9.15
    12 nepalese-a (xing) 9.3
    13 punjabi (harappa) 9.43
    14 cochin-jew (behar) 9.57
    15 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 9.62
    16 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 9.69
    17 gujarati (harappa) 9.73
    18 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 9.86
    19 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 9.95
    20 brahmin-tamil-nadu (metspalu) 9.97

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 93.8% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.2% georgian (behar) @ 1.97
    2 92.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.1% armenian (behar) @ 1.99
    3 93.7% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.3% abhkasian (yunusbayev) @ 2.02
    4 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% azerbaijan-jew (behar) @ 2.25
    5 92.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.6% turk (behar) @ 2.32
    6 92.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.1% assyrian (harappa) @ 2.32
    7 91.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.1% azeri (harappa) @ 2.34
    8 92.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.6% turk-kayseri (hodoglugil) @ 2.34
    9 91.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.1% turkish (harappa) @ 2.34
    10 92.3% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.7% turk-istanbul (hodoglugil) @ 2.35
    11 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% adygei (hgdp) @ 2.35
    12 93.3% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.7% cypriot (behar) @ 2.36
    13 93.1% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.9% north-ossetian (yunusbayev) @ 2.38
    14 92% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8% kurd (yunusbayev) @ 2.39
    15 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% balkar (yunusbayev) @ 2.39
    16 93.1% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.9% georgia-jew (behar) @ 2.4
    17 87.1% maharashtrian (harappa) + 12.9% bulgarian (yunusbayev) @ 2.43
    18 93.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.1% druze (hgdp) @ 2.45
    19 91.6% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.4% kurd (harappa) @ 2.48
    20 91.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.6% iranian (harappa) @ 2.48

    Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Asian 54.23
    2 West_Asian 18.91
    3 North_Sea 7.3
    4 Eastern_Euro 6.51
    5 West_Med 4.66
    6 Siberian 2.4
    7 Southeast_Asian 1.72
    8 Baltic 1.62
    9 Amerindian 1.18
    10 East_Med 0.71
    11 Oceanian 0.4
    12 Atlantic 0.36

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Brahmin_UP 7.9
    2 Gujarati 8.15
    3 Kshatriya 9.36
    4 Punjabi_Jat 11.8
    5 Sindhi 12.22
    6 Bangladeshi 12.92
    7 Dharkar 15.82
    8 Pathan 16.12
    9 Kanjar 17.36
    10 Burusho 18.53
    11 Uttar_Pradesh 19.55
    12 Velamas 19.98
    13 Kol 20.49
    14 Kurumba 20.58
    15 Dusadh 21.81
    16 Kalash 21.87
    17 North_Kannadi 22.24
    18 Chenchu 22.51
    19 Piramalai 24.9
    20 Chamar 27.15

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 71.4% Kol + 28.6% Tabassaran @ 4.77
    2 72.4% Kol + 27.6% Chechen @ 5
    3 88.7% Gujarati + 11.3% Nogay @ 5.12
    4 67.3% Punjabi_Jat + 32.7% Chenchu @ 5.13
    5 58.6% Kol + 41.4% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.15
    6 91.6% Gujarati + 8.4% Sardinian @ 5.19
    7 72.8% Kol + 27.2% Balkar @ 5.19
    8 72% Kol + 28% Lezgin @ 5.27
    9 84.6% Gujarati + 15.4% Afghan_Tadjik @ 5.3
    10 73.1% Kol + 26.9% Ossetian @ 5.31
    11 72.7% Kol + 27.3% Kabardin @ 5.31
    12 90.5% Gujarati + 9.5% Spanish_Galicia @ 5.31
    13 89.9% Gujarati + 10.1% Greek_Thessaly @ 5.36
    14 90.4% Gujarati + 9.6% North_Italian @ 5.38
    15 72.5% Uttar_Pradesh + 27.5% Tabassaran @ 5.4
    16 90.6% Gujarati + 9.4% Portuguese @ 5.41
    17 87.8% Gujarati + 12.2% Afghan_Hazara @ 5.41
    18 65.3% Punjabi_Jat + 34.7% Kol @ 5.43
    19 88.8% Gujarati + 11.2% Afghan_Turkmen @ 5.43
    20 90.4% Gujarati + 9.6% Tuscan @ 5.44

    MDLP K23b

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Indian 38.72
    2 South_Central_Asian 29.5
    3 Caucasian 9.23
    4 European_Hunters_Gatherers 8.38
    5 South_East_Asian 3.67
    6 Ancestral_Altaic 3.12
    7 Melano_Polynesian 2.44
    8 Australoid 1.35
    9 European_Early_Farmers 1.24
    10 Amerindian 1.13
    11 Paleo_Siberian 1.03
    12 Archaic_African 0.18

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Jatt_Muslim ( ) 6.63
    2 Tiwari ( ) 8.56
    3 Pakistani ( ) 9.65
    4 Jatt_Haryana ( ) 9.91
    5 Hindi ( ) 10.35
    6 GujaratiA_GIH ( ) 10.96
    7 Jatt_Pahari ( ) 11.22
    8 GujaratiB_GIH ( ) 11.42
    9 Marathi ( ) 12.39
    10 Brahmin_Tamil ( ) 12.96
    11 Vaish ( ) 13.03
    12 Cochin_Jew ( ) 14.09
    13 Kshatriya ( ) 14.38
    14 Punjabi_Gujjar ( ) 14.87
    15 Brahmins_UP ( ) 15.04
    16 TN_Brahmin ( ) 15.95
    17 Mumbai_Jew ( ) 17.29
    18 Burusho ( ) 17.72
    19 Sindhi ( ) 17.98
    20 Tamil_Singapore ( ) 18.26

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 54.3% Bengali_Bangladesh_BEB ( ) + 45.7% Pashtun_Afghani ( ) @ 4.07
    2 63% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 37% Tamil_Singapore ( ) @ 4.16
    3 82.4% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 17.6% Kharia ( ) @ 4.21
    4 54.2% Pathan ( ) + 45.8% Dhaka_mixed_popul ( ) @ 4.25
    5 67.9% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 32.1% Dhaka_mixed_popul ( ) @ 4.32
    6 73.3% Pathan ( ) + 26.7% Bhunjia ( ) @ 4.34
    7 87.9% Hindi ( ) + 12.1% Dargin_Urkarah ( ) @ 4.35
    8 88% Hindi ( ) + 12% Lak ( ) @ 4.38
    9 65.9% Bengali ( ) + 34.1% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.38
    10 70.7% Hindi ( ) + 29.3% Pakistani_Pushtun ( ) @ 4.39
    11 52.8% Scheduled_Caste_Tamil_Nadu ( ) + 47.2% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.39
    12 88.1% Hindi ( ) + 11.9% Tabassaran ( ) @ 4.39
    13 73.4% Pathan ( ) + 26.6% Dhurwa ( ) @ 4.39
    14 88.3% Hindi ( ) + 11.7% Avar ( ) @ 4.43
    15 87.8% Hindi ( ) + 12.2% Stalskoe_Kumyk ( ) @ 4.44
    16 74.2% Pathan ( ) + 25.8% Santhal ( ) @ 4.45
    17 50.8% Pashtun_Afghani ( ) + 49.2% Bhili ( ) @ 4.45
    18 88.4% Hindi ( ) + 11.6% Lezgin ( ) @ 4.46
    19 72.4% Pathan ( ) + 27.6% Kharia ( ) @ 4.47
    20 66.8% Telugu_Kannada ( ) + 33.2% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.49

    Dodecad k12b

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Asian 40.83
    2 Gedrosia 31.28
    3 North_European 9.33
    4 Caucasus 6.82
    5 Atlantic_Med 4.73
    6 Southeast_Asian 3.91
    7 Siberian 1.22
    8 East_Asian 1.02
    9 Southwest_Asian 0.87

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh (Metspalu) 8.94
    2 Cochin_Jews (Behar) 10.06
    3 Kshatriya (Metspalu) 11
    4 Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) 12.27
    5 Indian (Dodecad) 13.37
    6 Iyer (Dodecad) 14.41
    7 Iyengar (Dodecad) 15.3
    8 Tharus (Metspalu) 16.32
    9 Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) 17.28
    10 Dharkars (Metspalu) 17.71
    11 Jatt (Dodecad) 17.89
    12 GIH30 (Dodecad) 17.92
    13 INS30 (SGVP) 18.06
    14 Muslim (Metspalu) 18.12
    15 Kanjars (Metspalu) 18.65
    16 Sindhi (HGDP) 21.07
    17 Burusho (HGDP) 21.36
    18 Velamas (Metspalu) 21.47
    19 Pathan (HGDP) 21.98
    20 Tamil_Nadu_Scheduled_Caste (Metspalu) 22.9

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 83.8% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.2% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.03
    2 83.4% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.6% Romanians (Behar) @ 4.06
    3 65% Pathan (HGDP) + 35% Nihali (Metspalu) @ 4.07
    4 83.5% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.5% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 4.1
    5 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) @ 4.31
    6 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) @ 4.32
    7 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 4.38
    8 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 4.41
    9 85.6% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.4% Greek (Dodecad) @ 4.46
    10 67.3% Pathan (HGDP) + 32.7% ASUR (Chaubey) @ 4.56
    11 85.5% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.5% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) @ 4.58
    12 85.5% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.5% C_Italian (Dodecad) @ 4.58
    13 82.7% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.3% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.65
    14 61.7% Pathan (HGDP) + 38.3% Gond (Metspalu) @ 4.66
    15 84.6% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 15.4% Hungarians (Behar) @ 4.71
    16 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Morocco_Jews (Behar) @ 4.72
    17 82.3% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.7% Romanians (Behar) @ 4.72
    18 82.4% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.6% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 4.74
    19 85.8% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.2% Tuscan (HGDP) @ 4.75
    20 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% O_Italian (Dodecad) @ 4.81
    Last edited by misanthropy; 12-16-2020 at 05:22 AM.

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  11. #146
    Registered Users
    Posts
    704
    Sex
    Location
    London, UK
    Ethnicity
    Bihari, UPite and Bengali
    Nationality
    British
    Y-DNA (P)
    O2a1c-JST002611
    mtDNA (M)
    M6a1a
    Y-DNA (M)
    R1a1a-Z93, R-M560

    India Pakistan United Kingdom
    Quote Originally Posted by misanthropy View Post
    Bihari Muslim results

    https://www.reddit.com/r/23andme/com..._both_parents/





    V5.9, phased with both parents (before & after update)





    Even though Bihar is NE India and some components can overlap, they look like ingredients to some old Turkic admixture. Overall he has gotten Central Asian, Iranian, Anatolion, Cypriot, Chinese, and Mongol traces. As for the gedmatch results, there seems to be a decent Med Islander pull.

    kit:MR1142219

    harappaworld

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 S-Indian 39.4
    2 Baloch 32.26
    3 NE-Euro 8.94
    4 Caucasian 8.8
    5 Mediterranean 3.29
    6 SE-Asian 2.04
    7 American 1.3
    8 Beringian 1.23
    9 NE-Asian 1.19
    10 Papuan 1.05
    11 Siberian 0.32
    12 SW-Asian 0.18

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 bengali-brahmin (harappa) 4.88
    2 bihari-muslim (harappa) 5.28
    3 up-muslim (harappa) 5.6
    4 up-brahmin (harappa) 6.3
    5 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 6.57
    6 vaish (reich) 7.31
    7 karnataka-brahmin (harappa) 8.16
    8 up-kshatriya (metspalu) 8.27
    9 maharashtrian (harappa) 8.57
    10 meghawal (reich) 9.04
    11 gujarati-b (hapmap) 9.15
    12 nepalese-a (xing) 9.3
    13 punjabi (harappa) 9.43
    14 cochin-jew (behar) 9.57
    15 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 9.62
    16 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 9.69
    17 gujarati (harappa) 9.73
    18 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 9.86
    19 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 9.95
    20 brahmin-tamil-nadu (metspalu) 9.97

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 93.8% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.2% georgian (behar) @ 1.97
    2 92.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.1% armenian (behar) @ 1.99
    3 93.7% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.3% abhkasian (yunusbayev) @ 2.02
    4 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% azerbaijan-jew (behar) @ 2.25
    5 92.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.6% turk (behar) @ 2.32
    6 92.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.1% assyrian (harappa) @ 2.32
    7 91.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.1% azeri (harappa) @ 2.34
    8 92.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.6% turk-kayseri (hodoglugil) @ 2.34
    9 91.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.1% turkish (harappa) @ 2.34
    10 92.3% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7.7% turk-istanbul (hodoglugil) @ 2.35
    11 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% adygei (hgdp) @ 2.35
    12 93.3% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.7% cypriot (behar) @ 2.36
    13 93.1% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.9% north-ossetian (yunusbayev) @ 2.38
    14 92% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8% kurd (yunusbayev) @ 2.39
    15 93% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 7% balkar (yunusbayev) @ 2.39
    16 93.1% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.9% georgia-jew (behar) @ 2.4
    17 87.1% maharashtrian (harappa) + 12.9% bulgarian (yunusbayev) @ 2.43
    18 93.9% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 6.1% druze (hgdp) @ 2.45
    19 91.6% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.4% kurd (harappa) @ 2.48
    20 91.4% bengali-brahmin (harappa) + 8.6% iranian (harappa) @ 2.48

    Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Asian 54.23
    2 West_Asian 18.91
    3 North_Sea 7.3
    4 Eastern_Euro 6.51
    5 West_Med 4.66
    6 Siberian 2.4
    7 Southeast_Asian 1.72
    8 Baltic 1.62
    9 Amerindian 1.18
    10 East_Med 0.71
    11 Oceanian 0.4
    12 Atlantic 0.36

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Brahmin_UP 7.9
    2 Gujarati 8.15
    3 Kshatriya 9.36
    4 Punjabi_Jat 11.8
    5 Sindhi 12.22
    6 Bangladeshi 12.92
    7 Dharkar 15.82
    8 Pathan 16.12
    9 Kanjar 17.36
    10 Burusho 18.53
    11 Uttar_Pradesh 19.55
    12 Velamas 19.98
    13 Kol 20.49
    14 Kurumba 20.58
    15 Dusadh 21.81
    16 Kalash 21.87
    17 North_Kannadi 22.24
    18 Chenchu 22.51
    19 Piramalai 24.9
    20 Chamar 27.15

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 71.4% Kol + 28.6% Tabassaran @ 4.77
    2 72.4% Kol + 27.6% Chechen @ 5
    3 88.7% Gujarati + 11.3% Nogay @ 5.12
    4 67.3% Punjabi_Jat + 32.7% Chenchu @ 5.13
    5 58.6% Kol + 41.4% Afghan_Pashtun @ 5.15
    6 91.6% Gujarati + 8.4% Sardinian @ 5.19
    7 72.8% Kol + 27.2% Balkar @ 5.19
    8 72% Kol + 28% Lezgin @ 5.27
    9 84.6% Gujarati + 15.4% Afghan_Tadjik @ 5.3
    10 73.1% Kol + 26.9% Ossetian @ 5.31
    11 72.7% Kol + 27.3% Kabardin @ 5.31
    12 90.5% Gujarati + 9.5% Spanish_Galicia @ 5.31
    13 89.9% Gujarati + 10.1% Greek_Thessaly @ 5.36
    14 90.4% Gujarati + 9.6% North_Italian @ 5.38
    15 72.5% Uttar_Pradesh + 27.5% Tabassaran @ 5.4
    16 90.6% Gujarati + 9.4% Portuguese @ 5.41
    17 87.8% Gujarati + 12.2% Afghan_Hazara @ 5.41
    18 65.3% Punjabi_Jat + 34.7% Kol @ 5.43
    19 88.8% Gujarati + 11.2% Afghan_Turkmen @ 5.43
    20 90.4% Gujarati + 9.6% Tuscan @ 5.44

    MDLP K23b

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Indian 38.72
    2 South_Central_Asian 29.5
    3 Caucasian 9.23
    4 European_Hunters_Gatherers 8.38
    5 South_East_Asian 3.67
    6 Ancestral_Altaic 3.12
    7 Melano_Polynesian 2.44
    8 Australoid 1.35
    9 European_Early_Farmers 1.24
    10 Amerindian 1.13
    11 Paleo_Siberian 1.03
    12 Archaic_African 0.18

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Jatt_Muslim ( ) 6.63
    2 Tiwari ( ) 8.56
    3 Pakistani ( ) 9.65
    4 Jatt_Haryana ( ) 9.91
    5 Hindi ( ) 10.35
    6 GujaratiA_GIH ( ) 10.96
    7 Jatt_Pahari ( ) 11.22
    8 GujaratiB_GIH ( ) 11.42
    9 Marathi ( ) 12.39
    10 Brahmin_Tamil ( ) 12.96
    11 Vaish ( ) 13.03
    12 Cochin_Jew ( ) 14.09
    13 Kshatriya ( ) 14.38
    14 Punjabi_Gujjar ( ) 14.87
    15 Brahmins_UP ( ) 15.04
    16 TN_Brahmin ( ) 15.95
    17 Mumbai_Jew ( ) 17.29
    18 Burusho ( ) 17.72
    19 Sindhi ( ) 17.98
    20 Tamil_Singapore ( ) 18.26

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 54.3% Bengali_Bangladesh_BEB ( ) + 45.7% Pashtun_Afghani ( ) @ 4.07
    2 63% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 37% Tamil_Singapore ( ) @ 4.16
    3 82.4% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 17.6% Kharia ( ) @ 4.21
    4 54.2% Pathan ( ) + 45.8% Dhaka_mixed_popul ( ) @ 4.25
    5 67.9% Jatt_Pahari ( ) + 32.1% Dhaka_mixed_popul ( ) @ 4.32
    6 73.3% Pathan ( ) + 26.7% Bhunjia ( ) @ 4.34
    7 87.9% Hindi ( ) + 12.1% Dargin_Urkarah ( ) @ 4.35
    8 88% Hindi ( ) + 12% Lak ( ) @ 4.38
    9 65.9% Bengali ( ) + 34.1% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.38
    10 70.7% Hindi ( ) + 29.3% Pakistani_Pushtun ( ) @ 4.39
    11 52.8% Scheduled_Caste_Tamil_Nadu ( ) + 47.2% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.39
    12 88.1% Hindi ( ) + 11.9% Tabassaran ( ) @ 4.39
    13 73.4% Pathan ( ) + 26.6% Dhurwa ( ) @ 4.39
    14 88.3% Hindi ( ) + 11.7% Avar ( ) @ 4.43
    15 87.8% Hindi ( ) + 12.2% Stalskoe_Kumyk ( ) @ 4.44
    16 74.2% Pathan ( ) + 25.8% Santhal ( ) @ 4.45
    17 50.8% Pashtun_Afghani ( ) + 49.2% Bhili ( ) @ 4.45
    18 88.4% Hindi ( ) + 11.6% Lezgin ( ) @ 4.46
    19 72.4% Pathan ( ) + 27.6% Kharia ( ) @ 4.47
    20 66.8% Telugu_Kannada ( ) + 33.2% Tajik_Pomiri_Rushan ( ) @ 4.49

    Dodecad k12b

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 South_Asian 40.83
    2 Gedrosia 31.28
    3 North_European 9.33
    4 Caucasus 6.82
    5 Atlantic_Med 4.73
    6 Southeast_Asian 3.91
    7 Siberian 1.22
    8 East_Asian 1.02
    9 Southwest_Asian 0.87

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh (Metspalu) 8.94
    2 Cochin_Jews (Behar) 10.06
    3 Kshatriya (Metspalu) 11
    4 Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) 12.27
    5 Indian (Dodecad) 13.37
    6 Iyer (Dodecad) 14.41
    7 Iyengar (Dodecad) 15.3
    8 Tharus (Metspalu) 16.32
    9 Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) 17.28
    10 Dharkars (Metspalu) 17.71
    11 Jatt (Dodecad) 17.89
    12 GIH30 (Dodecad) 17.92
    13 INS30 (SGVP) 18.06
    14 Muslim (Metspalu) 18.12
    15 Kanjars (Metspalu) 18.65
    16 Sindhi (HGDP) 21.07
    17 Burusho (HGDP) 21.36
    18 Velamas (Metspalu) 21.47
    19 Pathan (HGDP) 21.98
    20 Tamil_Nadu_Scheduled_Caste (Metspalu) 22.9

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 83.8% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.2% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.03
    2 83.4% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.6% Romanians (Behar) @ 4.06
    3 65% Pathan (HGDP) + 35% Nihali (Metspalu) @ 4.07
    4 83.5% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 16.5% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 4.1
    5 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) @ 4.31
    6 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Ashkenazi (Dodecad) @ 4.32
    7 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 4.38
    8 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 4.41
    9 85.6% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.4% Greek (Dodecad) @ 4.46
    10 67.3% Pathan (HGDP) + 32.7% ASUR (Chaubey) @ 4.56
    11 85.5% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.5% Sephardic_Jews (Behar) @ 4.58
    12 85.5% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.5% C_Italian (Dodecad) @ 4.58
    13 82.7% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.3% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 4.65
    14 61.7% Pathan (HGDP) + 38.3% Gond (Metspalu) @ 4.66
    15 84.6% Brahmins_from_Tamil_Nadu (Metspalu) + 15.4% Hungarians (Behar) @ 4.71
    16 85.4% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.6% Morocco_Jews (Behar) @ 4.72
    17 82.3% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.7% Romanians (Behar) @ 4.72
    18 82.4% Indian (Dodecad) + 17.6% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 4.74
    19 85.8% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.2% Tuscan (HGDP) @ 4.75
    20 85.3% Kshatriya (Metspalu) + 14.7% O_Italian (Dodecad) @ 4.81
    I wonder where in Bihar is his family from?

    Pathans are known to have settled in the region but I am less sure about Turks.

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  13. #147
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    Hyderabad State Mughal Empire
    Quote Originally Posted by tipirneni View Post
    Any turcoman origin still left in Hyderabad? I doubt if there are any left. The newer Uzbek groups took over most of those earlier Bahmani era ones through force after Aurangzeb victory.
    Let's continue this discussion here. I doubt it, I haven't heard of any Qutb Shahi descendants. I would guess if they exist, along with other Delhi Sultanate migrants, their foreign ancestry would be severely diluted in the 1-3% range at best. If anything, whatever Turkic mixtures that would be present today in the Deccan would probably be associated with Mughal conquests (like you said) or later migrations from North India already admixed individuals.

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  15. #148
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    Hyderabad State Mughal Empire
    Just to follow up on this. It looks very, very unlikely there are any male descendants (male heirs) of the Qutb Shahi dynasty left. There might be females descendants though.

    The last sultan Abdul Hasan Qutb Shah:

    He was married to his predecessor Abdullah Qutb Shah's third daughter, who became known as Badshah Bibi after his ascension.[5] He had five children:[6]

    eldest daughter: stayed unmarried and remained her father's constant companion until his death.
    second daughter: married Sikandar Adil Shah, the ruler of Bijapur.
    third daughter: married 'Inayat Khan, son of Jumdatu'l-Mulk Asad Khan.
    fourth daughter: married Shaikh Muhammad Sarhindi.
    Khuda Banda or Banda-i Sultan: the only son; was born during his father's captivity and was taken to an unknown location following the latter's death, after which nothing further is known.
    2nd to last sultan Abdullah Qutb Shah

    Abdullah had three daughters.[3][4]

    eldest daughter: married the Mughal prince Muhammad Sultan.
    second daughter: married Sayyid Nizamuddin Ahmad, a maternal nephew of Abbas I of Persia.
    Badshah Bibi: married Abul Hasan Qutb Shah.

  16. #149
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    India Pakistan United Kingdom
    Quote Originally Posted by misanthropy View Post
    Just to follow up on this. It looks very, very unlikely there are any male descendants (male heirs) of the Qutb Shahi dynasty left. There might be females descendants though.

    The last sultan Abdul Hasan Qutb Shah:



    2nd to last sultan Abdullah Qutb Shah
    The Qutub Shahis were of Qara Qoyunlu descent who may have had some possible Byzantine ancestry through their intermarriages with the Komnenos dynasty in Trebizond.

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  18. #150
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    Pakistan United Kingdom
    My dad's mother's side who are from UP claim a mixed "Afghan" and UP Rajput origin. I would have just considered them to be local Rajput converts but they were Shias not too long ago, and their last names are ".... Ali Khan". My 23andme and Harrappa results don't really show anything out of the ordinary. Is there anyway it's possible to confirm if they are were part of the Turkic/Persian etc waves that settled in to UP? They are from a village near Lucknow and use to have a lot of land etc there pre-partition.

    EDIT: Let me know if this is off topic for this thread and I'll delete it.
    Last edited by AlluGobi; 12-26-2020 at 10:22 AM.

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