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Thread: East African genes in India? or vice versa?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by drobbah View Post
    Apparently Malik Ambar was a Cushitic Oromo slave that was probably captured by neighboring Somali clans and sold off to Horner Islamic Sultanates and after a long journey and living in the Middle East arrived in India afterwards climbing his way to power in the Deccan region.His case wasn't the norm as not many pagan Horners were shipped abroad but were used domestically in cities or among nomadic clans.The vast majority of modern siddis or the equivalent in Pakistan are of Bantu origins unlike Malik Ambar
    The Bengal Sultanate employed "Habshi" military-slaves/palace guards, after the practice of Turkic slave-soldiers ended. In the year of 1487, one of them managed to usurp the throne, and ultimately 4 different Habshi-origin Shahs ruled the kingdom until 1494.

    The kingdom did have connections to the wider Muslim world, and are said to have been gifted exotic animals such as giraffes by principalities there. These giraffes were interestingly later gifted to China during Zheng He's treasure fleet visit to Bengal.
     
    It isn't really certain if these people were Habesha/Horner, especially if we assume that these men were brought from the swahili coast (as the giraffes probably were). Cushitic/Ethio-semitic people(s) were not traditionally enslaved and Bantus provided the bulk of medieval-era slaves from Africa to the Islamic world.

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  3. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulin View Post
    The Bengal Sultanate employed "Habshi" military-slaves/palace guards, after the practice of Turkic slave-soldiers ended. In the year of 1487, one of them managed to usurp the throne, and ultimately 4 different Habshi-origin Shahs ruled the kingdom until 1494.

    The kingdom did have connections to the wider Muslim world, and are said to have been gifted exotic animals such as giraffes by principalities there. These giraffes were interestingly later gifted to China during Zheng He's treasure fleet visit to Bengal.
     
    It isn't really certain if these people were Habesha/Horner, especially if we assume that these men were brought from the swahili coast (as the giraffes probably were). Cushitic/Ethio-semitic people(s) were not traditionally enslaved and Bantus provided the bulk of medieval-era slaves from Africa to the Islamic world.
    The Africans who ruled India, were their armies made up local Indians or a mix of Indians and Africans? In the case of Malik Ambar, definitely Indians must have been in his army, since they were fighting the Mughals, Western and Central parts of India always despised Mughals, so locals must have joined Malik Ambar's army against Mughals

  4. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kulin View Post
    The Bengal Sultanate employed "Habshi" military-slaves/palace guards, after the practice of Turkic slave-soldiers ended. In the year of 1487, one of them managed to usurp the throne, and ultimately 4 different Habshi-origin Shahs ruled the kingdom until 1494.

    The kingdom did have connections to the wider Muslim world, and are said to have been gifted exotic animals such as giraffes by principalities there. These giraffes were interestingly later gifted to China during Zheng He's treasure fleet visit to Bengal.
     
    It isn't really certain if these people were Habesha/Horner, especially if we assume that these men were brought from the swahili coast (as the giraffes probably were). Cushitic/Ethio-semitic people(s) were not traditionally enslaved and Bantus provided the bulk of medieval-era slaves from Africa to the Islamic world.
    The Ottomans also had East African eunuchs who wielded great power (although never becoming Sultan like in the Bengal) and they also called these eunuchs Habeşi.From what I read they tended to be non-Cushitic/Semitic slaves from the Horn and the Sudan but I wouldn't be surprised if a few actual Habesha slaves made it to Turkey or modern day Bangladesh.The connections between the Horn and sub-continent for example is very real,the only reason why a monumental work like the Futuh Al Habasha by the Yemeni chronicler who followed Imam Ahmed in his Jihad, survived was because it found it's way to Gujurat.The amount of Cushitic/Semitic slaves being exported probably decreased after the 16th century due to both muslim and Orthodox powers weakened from infighting and by the grear migrations of the Pagan (traditional Cushitic religion) militaristic Oromos from the south.SE Africa was a much more favourable area for the Arabs,Somalis and their local allies to continue to supply the Islamic world with slaves.You can find many of their modern descendants in Saudi Arabia,Yemen,and other Persian Gulf nations.

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  6. #14
    Habshi was a generic term used to lazily describe ALL Africans (including somali's) at this time.
    In the context of India, it was used interchangeably with the specific term "Siddi" to describe the Bantu and local indian derived coastal populations.

    Just to clear up any misconceptions:

    Recent advances in genetic analyses have helped shed some light on the ethnogenesis of the Siddi. Genetic genealogy, although a novel tool that uses the genes of modern populations to trace their ethnic and geographic origins, has also helped clarify the possible background of the modern Siddi.

    Y DNA

    A Y-chromosome study by Shah et al. (2011) tested Siddi individuals in India for paternal lineages. The authors observed the E1b1a1-M2 haplogroup, which is frequent among Bantu peoples, in about 42% and 34% of Siddis from Karnataka and Gujarat, respectively. Around 14% of Siddis from Karnataka and 35% of Siddis from Gujarat also belonged to the Sub-Saharan B-M60. The remaining Siddis had Indian associated or Near Eastern-linked clades, including haplogroups P, H, R1a-M17, J2 and L-M20.

    Thangaraj (2009) observed similar, mainly Bantu-linked paternal affinities amongst the Siddi.

    Qamar et al. (2002) analysed Makrani Siddis in Pakistan and found that they instead predominantly carried Indian-associated or Near Eastern-linked haplogroups. R1a1a-M17 (30.30%), J2 (18.18%) and R2 (18.18%) were their most common male lineages. Only around 12% carried Africa-derived clades, which mainly consisted of the archaic haplogroup B-M60, of which they bore the highest frequency of any Pakistani population Underhill et al. (2009) likewise detected a relatively high frequency of R1a1a-M17 (25%) subclade among Makrani Siddis.

    mtDNA

    According to an mtDNA study by Shah et al. (2011), the maternal ancestry of the Siddi consists of a mixture of Bantu-associated haplogroups and Indian-associated haplogroups, reflecting substantial female gene flow from neighbouring Indian populations. About 53% of the Siddis from Gujarat and 24% of the Siddis from Karnataka belonged to various Bantu-derived macro-haplogroup L subclades. The latter mainly consisted of L0 and L2a sublineages associated with Bantu women. The remainder possessed Indian-specific subclades of the Eurasian haplogroups M and N, which points to recent admixture with autochthonous Indian groups.

    Autosomal DNA

    Narang et al. (2011) examined the autosomal DNA of Siddis in India. According to the researchers, about 58% of the Siddis' ancestry is derived from Bantu peoples. The remainder is associated with local Indo-European-speaking North and Northwest Indian populations, due to recent admixture events.

    Similarly, Shah et al. (2011) observed that Siddis in Gujarat derive 66.90%70.50% of their ancestry from Bantu forebears, while the Siddis in Karnataka possess 64.80%74.40% such Southeast African ancestry. The remaining autosomal DNA components in the studied Siddi were mainly associated with local South Asian populations. According to the authors, gene flow between the Siddis' Bantu ancestors and local Indian populations was also largely unidirectional. They estimate this admixture episode's time of occurrence at within the past 200 years or eight generations.
    Last edited by Fishermansfriend; 06-30-2020 at 11:01 AM.

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