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Thread: Any genetic results from any Somali bantu?

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    Any genetic results from any Somali bantu?

    I have seen both benadiri and barawani genetic results in a Awale blogpost

    They pretty much confirm what most of us already know, They are a mix of, ethnic somali. middle eastern and south indian plus bantu ancestry

    But what about Somali bantu? Any dna test done on them, Its seems most are just pure niger-congo. But i have seen some with a semi somali look who claim jareerweyne, Many actually not even a few

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    Quote Originally Posted by Advokaten19 View Post
    I have seen both benadiri and barawani genetic results in a Awale blogpost

    They pretty much confirm what most of us already know, They are a mix of, ethnic somali. middle eastern and south indian plus bantu ancestry

    But what about Somali bantu? Any dna test done on them, Its seems most are just pure niger-congo. But i have seen some with a semi somali look who claim jareerweyne, Many actually not even a few
    Banadiris or Barawanis with Bantu haplogroups are mostly freed slaves from arabia, who came back to East Africa. After generations, they can look like ethnic somali or arab!. We have seen some of them for example in the social media.

    "The Somali Bantus are the descendants of many Bantu ethnic groups found in East Africa including areas of Tanzania, Mozambique and Malawi. These groups were brought to Somalia in the 19th century by Arab slave traders from the tribes of Majindo, Makua, Manyasa, Yao, Zalama, and Zigua"

    https://somalibantumaine.org/somali-bantu-background/


    Tillmar et al. (2009) typed 147 males from Somalia for 12 Y-STR loci.

    E-V32 110/147 (74.8%)
    T-M70 11/147 (7.5%)
    E-Z827 11/147 (7.5%) of which 9/11 (82.0%) are E-M81
    J-M267 4/147 (2.7%)
    J-M172 2/147 (1.4%)
    E-V38 2/147 (1.4%) It can be E-M329. Related to Mota.
    E-V22 1/147 (0.7%)
    L-M20 1/147 (0.7%)
    E-M35*(xM78) 1/147 (0.7%)

    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....Y-STR-to-Y-DNA

    Juan J Sanchez et al. (2005)

    E3a (xE3a4) 3/201(1,5%) It can be E-M329, so, it is not Bantu. E3a4=U209, is Bantu.

    "The time of the eastbound Bantu expansion was estimated to be 3400±1100 years ago.Bantu populations have high frequencies of E3a haplogroups. We have observed only a few individuals with the E3a haplogroup in our Somali population, thus, supporting the view that the Bantu migration did not reach Somalia."
    https://www.nature.com/articles/5201390

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    BUMP.

    Can someone point me to the peer reviewed study that had Somali Bantu samples?
    Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beyoku View Post
    BUMP.

    Can someone point me to the peer reviewed study that had Somali Bantu samples?
    Thanks.
    Wow I never knew mushunguli were ever included in any sort of genetic study. I'd like to see them, too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beyoku View Post
    BUMP.

    Can someone point me to the peer reviewed study that had Somali Bantu samples?
    Thanks.
    Not sure but there have been some Bantus from South Somalia who have taken commercial tests. They surprisingly range from low to substantial Cushitic ancestry.I'm not sure if they have actual Somali (Af-Maxaa) ancestry considering the nomadic descended Somalis (Hawiyes & Daroods) don't intermarry with them and this is strictly enforced.I think minority Af-Maay groups intermingled with them as there is an autosomal completely Cushitic Raxanweyn (Af-Maay speakers) male who carries Niger-Congo E-V38 and there's also a very small minority of Af-Maxaa Southern Somalis who have Bantu maternal lineages.

    I assume those with low to non-existent Cushitic ancestry are recent transplants from SE Africa while those with higher Somali perhaps are descendants of medieval slave ancestors but I could be wrong as I'm not well read on southern hisotry.There's also the Bajunis but they are basically ethnic Swahilis probably with substantial medieval West Eurasian & South Asian ancestry.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beyoku View Post
    BUMP.

    Can someone point me to the peer reviewed study that had Somali Bantu samples?
    Thanks.
    Here you go:

    Population history and genetic adaptation of the Fulani nomads: inferences from genome-wide data and the lactase persistence trait

    It's a study where they got a sampling of both north and south Somalis. At first people thought the southerners were Bantu admixed based on the ADMIXTURE results but that's only because they collated together what clearly seem to be Somali Bantus and ethnic Somalis for that result. You can see in the PCA that most of the southern Somalis cluster identically to the northerners but then there are a handful of southerners who cluster with Kikuyus. Probably Somali Bantus who have minor Somali admixture hence the overlap with Cushitic admixed Kikuyus:

    فار عارابإ آ واجإب اه

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    Quote Originally Posted by Awale View Post
    Here you go:

    Population history and genetic adaptation of the Fulani nomads: inferences from genome-wide data and the lactase persistence trait

    It's a study where they got a sampling of both north and south Somalis. At first people thought the southerners were Bantu admixed based on the ADMIXTURE results but that's only because they collated together what clearly seem to be Somali Bantus and ethnic Somalis for that result. You can see in the PCA that most of the southern Somalis cluster identically to the northerners but then there are a handful of southerners who cluster with Kikuyus. Probably Somali Bantus who have minor Somali admixture hence the overlap with Cushitic admixed Kikuyus:

    Off topic but dayim, the Qatari cluster is huge. More spread out than Europe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Omaar View Post
    Banadiris or Barawanis with Bantu haplogroups are mostly freed slaves from arabia, who came back to East Africa. After generations, they can look like ethnic somali or arab!. We have seen some of them for example in the social media.

    "The Somali Bantus are the descendants of many Bantu ethnic groups found in East Africa including areas of Tanzania, Mozambique and Malawi. These groups were brought to Somalia in the 19th century by Arab slave traders from the tribes of Majindo, Makua, Manyasa, Yao, Zalama, and Zigua"

    https://somalibantumaine.org/somali-bantu-background/


    Tillmar et al. (2009) typed 147 males from Somalia for 12 Y-STR loci.

    E-V32 110/147 (74.8%)
    T-M70 11/147 (7.5%)
    E-Z827 11/147 (7.5%) of which 9/11 (82.0%) are E-M81
    J-M267 4/147 (2.7%)
    J-M172 2/147 (1.4%)
    E-V38 2/147 (1.4%) It can be E-M329. Related to Mota.
    E-V22 1/147 (0.7%)
    L-M20 1/147 (0.7%)
    E-M35*(xM78) 1/147 (0.7%)

    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....Y-STR-to-Y-DNA

    Juan J Sanchez et al. (2005)

    E3a (xE3a4) 3/201(1,5%) It can be E-M329, so, it is not Bantu. E3a4=U209, is Bantu.

    "The time of the eastbound Bantu expansion was estimated to be 3400±1100 years ago.Bantu populations have high frequencies of E3a haplogroups. We have observed only a few individuals with the E3a haplogroup in our Somali population, thus, supporting the view that the Bantu migration did not reach Somalia."
    https://www.nature.com/articles/5201390
    It’s lazy to always assume black and Bantu haplogroups are caused by slavery. Muqdisho was a cosmopolitan and Islamic known city so it could have attracted Swahili Muslims from further down the coast. The Bajunis are an example of a Bantu-like who weren’t an enslaved group. The fact that bravenese is a a dialect of Swahili also highlights the presence of non enslaved Bantu groups amongst the coastal populations. If we can find Somali clerics from Zeyla as far as Egypt and the Midde east and their works making up substantial works in Hanafi books of jurisprudence books, you shouldn’t rule out non enslaved Bantus marrying into Benadiri coastal society.

    It is also important to point that there are many groups of black Africans in the Middle East are folks who stayed behind after going there to a study or to Perform pilgrimage. The saudi Nigerian descendants are a good example of this.
    Last edited by Moos; 07-28-2021 at 10:51 AM.

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    I remember reading a study (???) that included samples from coastal Bantu speaking groups, including the Mushunguli, from Tanzania that we know were historically targeted and trafficked to Southern Somalia, and those people already have some minor Cushitic ancestry related to groups like the Mbugu (which is a mixed Bantu-Cushitic language). This suggests that some of the Cushitic ancestry in Somali Bantus isn’t directly related to Somalis and related group.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gihanga.rwanda View Post
    I remember reading a study (???) that included samples from coastal Bantu speaking groups, including the Mushunguli, from Tanzania that we know were historically targeted and trafficked to Southern Somalia, and those people already have some minor Cushitic ancestry related to groups like the Mbugu (which is a mixed Bantu-Cushitic language). This suggests that some of the Cushitic ancestry in Somali Bantus isn’t directly related to Somalis and related group.
    It looks like the Mushunguli speakers probably got their Cushitic ancestry from a Masai-like group

    Target: Tanzania_MZIGUA:per119
    Distance: 3.6784% / 0.03678354
    46.2 Yoruba
    34.0 Bantu_S.E.
    15.6 SUDANESE7
    4.2 Levant_PPNB

    Target: Tanzania_MZIGUA:per131
    Distance: 4.5125% / 0.04512526
    82.0 ZAF_400BP
    12.8 Dinka
    5.2 KEN_Pastoral_N


     

    Last edited by drobbah; 07-28-2021 at 08:26 PM.

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