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Thread: Why would a British person get low Great Britain ?

  1. #1
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    Why would a British person get low Great Britain ?

    In my case 15% Great Britain. I get 38% Irish. My known ancestry English 50% Scottish 31% Irish 19%
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    Quote Originally Posted by firemonkey View Post
    In my case 15% Great Britain. I get 38% Irish. My known ancestry English 50% Scottish 31% Irish 19%
    This is my opinion: Ancestry.com poorly chose a very Anglo-Saxon influenced part of England to be the 'Great Britain' reference population, which makes the less Anglo-Saxon parts of England come up more Irish, as well as the Scottish and Welsh scoring higher Ireland. The Irish component is likely the more indigenous one in the British isles, and it would have been more meaningful to have "Great Britain" be centered on a more indigenous part of the UK, which would reduce the amount of Irish that the British are scoring.

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    Likely something to do with the overall similarities between the people of Ireland and Britain along with the similarities to people in the rest of Europe. I feel ethnic estimations are not an exact science.

    EDIT:

    Also Sikeliot has a valid point that I had not yet thought about!

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    Also the fact that the British score more Irish than the reverse implies that the Irish is the "original" British Isles component and the British descend from Irish-like people, rather than the reverse, though I do believe with all of Ireland sampled, you would find some Irish scoring substantial British, especially around Dublin and along the southeastern coast (Cork, Waterford, Wexford) and likely some in the more Norman-influenced parts of Connacht.

    However, due to the fact that all of these Northwest Europeans are primarily Bell Beaker descendants, on GEDmatch it is difficult to tell recent from ancient ancestry and the Irish, English, Scots, and Welsh are nearly indistinguishable on there.

    If I had to guess, I would assume the "Great Britain" component is centered around Kent, East Anglia, or Essex.

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    Their GB reference population seems to be strongly Southern (Southeast I think) English, which we know now to be a highly mixed population for the English - and the people I've seen who get extraordinarily high GB percentages have been Southern English or people from mixed backgrounds. There's a thread I started somewhere exploring how the GB category splits into Scandinavia, EW, and Ireland when the same person tests twice, while many other European populations remain the same on the second test.

    What did you get for Europe West? a lot of people with English ancestry seem to land closer to Europe West than they do to Ancestry's "Great Britain"

    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    This is my opinion: Ancestry.com poorly chose a very Anglo-Saxon influenced part of England to be the 'Great Britain' reference population, which makes the less Anglo-Saxon parts of England come up more Irish, as well as the Scottish and Welsh scoring higher Ireland. The Irish component is likely the more indigenous one in the British isles, and it would have been more meaningful to have "Great Britain" be centered on a more indigenous part of the UK, which would reduce the amount of Irish that the British are scoring.
    I think so, although interestingly there's a YouTube video of a Welsh individual talking about his and his father's Ancestry DNA results: His dad, although being North Welsh from time immemorial, got a pretty high GB percentage. IIRC it was about 60% GB 30% Ireland. The individual who made the video was also Welsh but got about an even split between Ireland and Great Britain... 50 50 ish IIRC. I've ranted about this elsewhere but I'll say it again here, I'd love to see Ancestry's test without the GB component, those results would be a lot more useful.
    Last edited by sktibo; 09-06-2017 at 01:06 AM.
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English (possibly containing some Welsh ancestry) 31.25%, Scottish 17.96%, Scotch-Irish 12.5%, Eastern German 12.5%, Eastern European (Likely Polish possibly including Romanian) 12.5%, French 7.81%, Native American (Saulteaux and Assiniboine) 2.34%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be traced with certainty. With certainty, there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Their GB reference population seems to be strongly Southern (Southeast I think) English, which we know now to be a highly mixed population for the English - and the people I've seen who get extraordinarily high GB percentages have been Southern English or people from mixed backgrounds.
    Based on the spreadsheet made by a user here who compiled results, West Midlands, northern England, and even some parts of the east that are not the far southeast scored more of the Irish component than any other. Southeast England and East Anglia are the ones scoring (and likely comprising) the Great Britain component.

    As for the Irish, the Great Britain component seems highest (2-3%, which is almost nothing) in the south of Ireland, Munster province, but a few people from Connacht scored 1-2%. These people, otherwise, score nearly full Irish. One person from Northern Ireland scored 88% Irish, 5% Europe West, but no British.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Their GB reference population seems to be strongly Southern (Southeast I think) English, which we know now to be a highly mixed population for the English - and the people I've seen who get extraordinarily high GB percentages have been Southern English or people from mixed backgrounds. There's a thread I started somewhere exploring how the GB category splits into Scandinavia, EW, and Ireland when the same person tests twice, while many other European populations remain the same on the second test.

    What did you get for Europe West? a lot of people with English ancestry seem to land closer to Europe West than they do to Ancestry's "Great Britain"
    My full breakdown: Irish 38% Scandinavian 23% Europe West 22% Great Britain 15% Europe East <1% Italy/Greece <1%
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    Quote Originally Posted by firemonkey View Post
    My full breakdown: Irish 38% Scandinavian 23% Europe West 22% Great Britain 15% Europe East <1% Italy/Greece <1%
    Thought that would be the case. I think it is a good indication of a problematic reference population when your Europe West population is a closer match than Great Britain for people with significant English ancestry

    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    Based on the spreadsheet made by a user here who compiled results, West Midlands, northern England, and even some parts of the east that are not the far southeast scored more of the Irish component than any other. Southeast England and East Anglia are the ones scoring (and likely comprising) the Great Britain component.

    As for the Irish, the Great Britain component seems highest (2-3%, which is almost nothing) in the south of Ireland, Munster province, but a few people from Connacht scored 1-2%. These people, otherwise, score nearly full Irish. One person from Northern Ireland scored 88% Irish, 5% Europe West, but no British.
    Thank goodness for Don Felipe collecting those results, going off of what Ancestry DNA publishes could drive a beginning DNA tester crazy with confusion. I think it's JDay on here who is a mixture of Irish, German, and English, and he got over 90% Great Britain IIRC, while belonging to an Irish genetic community. His results are a great example of how a mixed Northern European will appear to Ancestry as almost entirely Great Britain, and we do know that the Southeastern English are the most mixed of the English genetic groups so I think this is why this sort of thing happens. I'm 73% Great Britain myself on Ancestry DNA and you can see in my signature that I'm quite mixed.

    Edit: http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...152#post240152
    Jday's results. Post #157. 91% Great Britain, only 3% Ireland despite significant Irish ancestry, looks to be mostly German.
    Last edited by sktibo; 09-06-2017 at 03:31 AM.
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English (possibly containing some Welsh ancestry) 31.25%, Scottish 17.96%, Scotch-Irish 12.5%, Eastern German 12.5%, Eastern European (Likely Polish possibly including Romanian) 12.5%, French 7.81%, Native American (Saulteaux and Assiniboine) 2.34%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be traced with certainty. With certainty, there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English.

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    Ancestry seem to have a very limited understanding of British origins. They seem to think British and Anglo Saxon are the same thing. I wouldn't test with them to be honest not for British ancestry anyway. John

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    I got 61% Europe West and <1% GB with Ancestry. Mum got roughly 30/40 split between Europe West and GB without looking.

    Edit: added our results

    Edit: We are also predominantly Southern English, with my dad having a grandmother from Cork.

    L-R Me, dad, mum
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    Last edited by L1983; 09-06-2017 at 04:35 PM.
    Known ancestry: English (mostly S/SE England) + Irish (Cork)

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