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Thread: Genomic Insights into the Demographic History of Southern Chinese

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by KillaBoy View Post
    Sorry for the ignorant comment but what is Andaman_HG?
    Modern-day (or close to modern-day) hunter-gatherers from the Andaman Islands


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    Quote Originally Posted by okarinaofsteiner View Post
    The screenshot you linked is of a tree chart of major East Eurasian branches. Tanshishan_N and Mekong_N probably did not have Indian or West Eurasian ancestry. I doubt they shared significant genetic drift with AASI either, but can't say for sure unless I see the screenshot.

    I don't quite understand what the 3.5% on average European admixture into the island Southeast Asian branch is and when it could have arrived there (0.5 kya meaning last 500 years?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by ybmpark View Post
    That is pretty large relatively speaking, especially when you exclude one sample that falls right in the middle of Han Chinese in another graph from a different paper using the same data.
    It is about 6-9 percent easily exceeding the difference between Devil's Gate and Koreans.
    It seems that the Andaman_HG introgression into East Asians happened relatively late according to these papers except the coastal East Asians and Jomon.
    I have not seen actual figures but I suspect that Liao Valley Late Neolithic people that affected Koreans more than Japanese by a significant margin were southern shifted without having a significant Andaman component.
    Japanese also may have influx from Russian Far East through Hokkaido and that will give them an additional northern shift.
    Sorry still struggling somewhat to understand this. I don't think these papers were very clear on this event, and for Han specifically I can only think of Yangtze-related lineages contributing Andamanese_HG (Andamanese_HG-like more likely) more than Koreans. Though introgression of pure Andamanese_HG into East Asians has to be earlier, perhaps during the early Neolithic? 10kya or so?

    I agree with you on the Liao LN people. But I thought that the southern pull in East Asians comes from Andaman-like componenent.


    Another alternative scenario, could northern East Asians having ANE admixture decrease the Andamanese_HG component? Some papers have suggested some low ANE presense in northern East Asia but I personally don't think much of this ancestry is present in Koreans and Han, perhaps very low. Interested in your thoughts though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Max_H View Post
    I don't quite understand what the 3.5% on average European admixture into the island Southeast Asian branch is and when it could have arrived there (0.5 kya meaning last 500 years?)
    I don't know why it's there either. (The "European admixture" is into the Mainland Southeast Asian branch, not the Island/Maritime Southeast Asian branch.)

    I have the PDF preprint of the original paper, and it doesn't explain which source populations are part of the "Mainland Southeast Asian" branch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by okarinaofsteiner View Post
    I don't know why it's there either. (The "European admixture" is into the Mainland Southeast Asian branch, not the Island/Maritime Southeast Asian branch.)

    I have the PDF preprint of the original paper, and it doesn't explain which source populations are part of the "Mainland Southeast Asian" branch.
    Are they referring to older or modern populations? Given the date, it seems to be recent, in the last 500 years (?)

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    There are some new Han South G25 coordinates in David Bush's "651 new samples" thread in the Autosomal forum. These guys cluster with Dong and Mulam, and I would guess they're from Guangxi or Guizhou. I say this because we have Guangdong samples, some of whom are close to these very Dai-like Han but still more northern shifted overall. They might be from Yunnan, Hunan, or Hainan also-- I'm not sure since we don't have Han from those provinces represented.
    Ελευθερία ή θάνατος.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michalis Moriopoulos View Post
    There are some new Han South G25 coordinates in David Bush's "651 new samples" thread in the Autosomal forum. These guys cluster with Dong and Mulam, and I would guess they're from Guangxi or Guizhou. I say this because we have Guangdong samples, some of whom are close to these very Dai-like Han but still more northern shifted overall. They might be from Yunnan, Hunan, or Hainan also-- I'm not sure since we don't have Han from those provinces represented.
    Possibly from Hainan or Yunnan, not Hunan, they are more nothern shifted. In fact Guangxi and Hainan are the most southern shifted Han that I've come across.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michalis Moriopoulos View Post
    There are some new Han South G25 coordinates in David Bush's "651 new samples" thread in the Autosomal forum. These guys cluster with Dong and Mulam, and I would guess they're from Guangxi or Guizhou. I say this because we have Guangdong samples, some of whom are close to these very Dai-like Han but still more northern shifted overall. They might be from Yunnan, Hunan, or Hainan also-- I'm not sure since we don't have Han from those provinces represented.
    I would have to guess Guangxi. Hainan Han are also very SEA-shifted, but maybe not to the same extent as Yue and Pinghua-speaking Han from Guangxi. Yunnan Han are fairly northern-shifted - noticeably more so than Sichuan Han and Guizhou Han at least.

    https://imgur.com/a/CLStqMo

    "ranhaer.com map of autosomal similarity to ___ among Han Chinese of various provinces"
    Last edited by okarinaofsteiner; 01-22-2021 at 02:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by okarinaofsteiner View Post
    I would have to guess Guangxi. Hainan Han are also very SEA-shifted, but maybe not to the same extent as Yue and Pinghua-speaking Han from Guangxi. Yunnan Han are fairly northern-shifted - noticeably more so than Sichuan Han and Guizhou Han at least.

    https://imgur.com/a/CLStqMo

    "ranhaer.com map of autosomal similarity to ___ among Han Chinese of various provinces"
    That paper was kind of odd though, particularly their Indian affinity it was very oddly distributed. Also shouldn't CHB share more alleles with Henan than coastal southern China?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Max_H View Post
    That paper was kind of odd though, particularly their Indian affinity it was very oddly distributed. Also shouldn't CHB share more alleles with Henan than coastal southern China?
    CHB is a sample of university students at a top-ranking Beijing university (so high gaokao scorers), not of Beijing residents or Beijing natives. The differences between blue and red aren't very significant.




    The Indian-Telugu PA sharing among random Han samples makes a lot of sense to me. Red is twice the level of blue, but still very low (~0.1%)


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