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Thread: Big Y results for I2a-Dinaric

  1. #1
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    Big Y results for I2a-Dinaric

    A member of I2a-Dinaric has received his Big Y results:

    591 Known SNPs (only 61 on FTDNA's old haplotree)
    272 Novel Variants

    I have encouraged him to ask FTDNA for his BAM file so that he can submit it to YFull.

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to lgmayka For This Useful Post:

     Agamemnon (04-04-2014),  Jean M (03-08-2014)

  3. #2
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    Great,Igmayka!

  4. #3
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    I have today received Big Y results for my brother who is I2a-Dinaric.

    545 known SNPs (57 on FTDNA's haplotree)
    219 Novel Variants

    I'll request BAM file for submission to YFull

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to GailA For This Useful Post:

     palamede (04-05-2014)

  6. #4
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    I have been comparing the Novel Variants of the 10 I2a-Dinaric Big Y results in my project.

    I have only one YFull interpretation of a Big Y BAM file--my own. I wish I had more. YFull's interpretation is so much more useful and complete than a simplistic Novel Variants list, or VCF and BED files.

    The solidest correlation I see is that kits 76814, 101827, 109223, 131251, 213694, 255805, and 256403 share three SNPs that are definitely absent from my 56266, and apparently absent also from 133914 and 167859:

    14856842
    15531354 (S17250 or YP204)
    15548676 (YP205)

    The next-most reliable result is that kits 133914 and 167859 share three SNPs that are definitely absent from my 56266, and apparently absent from the other 7 kits too:

    9028830 (YFC010724)
    22310257 (YFC010698, but Thomas Krahn says that the 222-226 region is "problematic")
    23548545 (Y3118)

    Next is that 101827 and 256403 share two SNPs that 56266 definitely does not have, and the other 7 apparently do not have:

    6676628
    8896311

    Next, 109223 and 131251 share three SNPs that 56266 definitely does not have, and the other 7 apparently do not have. However, all of these three SNPs are in the region that Thomas Krahn calls "problematic":

    22278504
    22458415
    22477250

    Ironically, I myself am the "odd man out": My kit 56266 does not reliably share a SNP with any of the other 9 kits (except all of them together).
    Last edited by lgmayka; 04-25-2014 at 12:01 AM.

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     Asimakidis (06-04-2015),  Michał (04-25-2014)

  8. #5
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    Warsaw, Poland
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1280
    mtDNA (M)
    H2a2(b)
    Y-DNA (M)
    R1a-L1029
    mtDNA (P)
    H5a2

    Poland European Union
    Quote Originally Posted by lgmayka View Post
    I have been comparing the Novel Variants of the 10 I2a-Dinaric Big Y results in my project.
    Thank you for sharing this with us! Can you see any STR pattern that would indicate a potential association with any of those two major subclades of I2a-Din (or with any of the two minor subclades within the larger clade)? Also, is this new division within I2a-Din anyhow related to the STR-based N versus S division? Finally, have you previously expected based on your STR results that your own lineage is such an outlier? Has any of your close matches ordered Big Y?

  9. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michał View Post
    Can you see any STR pattern that would indicate a potential association with any of those two major subclades of I2a-Din (or with any of the two minor subclades within the larger clade)? Also, is this new division within I2a-Din anyhow related to the STR-based N versus S division? Finally, have you previously expected based on your STR results that your own lineage is such an outlier? Has any of your close matches ordered Big Y?
    No, no, no, and no.

    I have never seen a reliable STR-based division of I2a-Dinaric. The alleged N vs. S division is at best a statistical correlation, not reliable enough for individual classification. I did not expect myself to be such an outlier, except that my Y-DNA Matches page still lists no 67-marker matches at all--but that is rather common in I2a-Dinaric. Thus, I don't have any "close matches."

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     Michał (04-26-2014)

  11. #7
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    From: "Debbie Kennett" <[email protected]>
    Subject: [yDNAhgI] I2a now predicted as L201 (G1a1b)
    Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2014 19:28:02 +0100

    "I have a project member who was previously predicted to be I2a and is now
    predicted to be G-L201 (G1a1b). I presume the change is as a result of using
    37 markers for the predictions rather than just 12 markers. His 37-marker
    matches include people whose terminal SNP is listed as P37 (G1a1b), which
    appears to be synonymous with L201, and one person whose terminal SNP is
    L233 (I2a1b). P37 seems to be one of those SNPs that occurs in multiple
    haplogroups. I presume this is a convergence problem where it's difficult to
    distinguish the two haplogroups on 37-marker results. I note that a number
    of people in the I2a project are now all in haplogroup G. Are they really Gs
    or is this a problem with the new algorithms?"

    ...and F,and J1a1a1.Whats this?

  12. #8

  13. #9
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    Italo-Iberian
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    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1b-U152+L2+FGC10543
    mtDNA (M)
    H4a1-T152C!

    United States of America Italy 1861-1946 Spain
    Quote Originally Posted by lgmayka View Post
    I have been comparing the Novel Variants of the 10 I2a-Dinaric Big Y results in my project.

    I have only one YFull interpretation of a Big Y BAM file--my own. I wish I had more. YFull's interpretation is so much more useful and complete than a simplistic Novel Variants list, or VCF and BED files.

    The solidest correlation I see is that kits 76814, 101827, 109223, 131251, 213694, 255805, and 256403 share three SNPs that are definitely absent from my 56266, and apparently absent also from 133914 and 167859:

    14856842
    15531354 (S17250 or YP204)
    15548676 (YP205)

    The next-most reliable result is that kits 133914 and 167859 share three SNPs that are definitely absent from my 56266, and apparently absent from the other 7 kits too:

    9028830 (YFC010724)
    22310257 (YFC010698, but Thomas Krahn says that the 222-226 region is "problematic")
    23548545 (Y3118)

    Next is that 101827 and 256403 share two SNPs that 56266 definitely does not have, and the other 7 apparently do not have:

    6676628
    8896311

    Next, 109223 and 131251 share three SNPs that 56266 definitely does not have, and the other 7 apparently do not have. However, all of these three SNPs are in the region that Thomas Krahn calls "problematic":

    22278504
    22458415
    22477250

    Ironically, I myself am the "odd man out": My kit 56266 does not reliably share a SNP with any of the other 9 kits (except all of them together).
    lgmayka, if you could be so kind as to alert us if/when some of these become available for testing at FTDNA, that would be great. I'd like to test my father-in-law's lineage further and he was indeed I2a Dinaric from NE Poland.
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

  14. #10
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    Update on my investigation

    I have been comparing the Novel Variants of all 12 Dinaric Big Y results within my project, with the extremely valuable assistance of 2 YFull BAM analyses (kits 56266 and 133914). The 12 kits are:
    56266 76814 101827 109223 131251 133914 145940 167859 209633 213694 255805 256403

    Below is a complete list of apparently reliable SNPs found (only from among Novel Variants, not Known SNPs). It reconfirms and expands upon my previous results reported last month. Reqd means that an individual SNP test has been requested from FTDNA.

    76814, 101827, 109223, 131251, 145940, 213694, 255805, 256403 positive
    56266, 133914, 167859, 209633 negative
    14856842 A > G Y3548 Reqd
    15531354 G > A S17250 Reqd
    15548676 A > G YP205

    109223, 131251, 145940 positive
    Others negative
    22278504 T > C Z16968
    22458415 G > T Z16969
    22477250 G > C Z16970 Reqd

    101827, 256403 positive
    Others negative
    6676628 G > C Z16971 Reqd
    8896311 G > T Z16972

    133914, 167859, 209633 positive
    Others negative
    9028830 G > A YFC010724 Reqd

    133914, 167859 positive
    Others negative
    22310257 G > T Z16973
    23548545 T > C Y3118 Reqd

    My own kit 56266 is still the “odd man out,” all alone.

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