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Thread: I need help with my G25 showing weird northern euro ancestry

  1. #11
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    Arabsiyo,Somaliland
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    Y-DNA (P)
    E-V32>E-FT385910
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    L0a1d
    Y-DNA (M)
    T-FGC92488

    Somaliland Adal Sultanate Yemen African Union Canada
    Quote Originally Posted by Magnetic View Post
    ^ i dont think that your modelling is a good approach tbh .i wont explain in detail why i think that because i am on phone . but you are using too many different ethnic groups
    It's your choice if you want to think this individual is a 1/3 French, no need to explain yourself.

  2. #12
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    Greece
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    G-L91
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    T2f2

    If it's recent ancestry then 23andMe should be able to find it, if you're willing to take another test obv

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to peloponnesian For This Useful Post:

     Axios (03-17-2021)

  4. #13
    Gold Class Member
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    Arabsiyo,Somaliland
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    Canadian
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-V32>E-FT385910
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    L0a1d
    Y-DNA (M)
    T-FGC92488

    Somaliland Adal Sultanate Yemen African Union Canada
    Deleted
    Last edited by drobbah; 03-17-2021 at 12:26 PM.
    Target: Drobbah_scaled
    Distance: 2.8833% / 0.02883253
    93.8 Somali
    6.2 Yemenite_Dhamar

    FTDNA myorigins 3.0:
    Eritrea, Northern Ethiopia & Somalia
    94%
    Yemenite Jewish
    6%

  5. #14
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    There is definitely a shift in your coordinates that is not only European, but precisely North European and this is evidenced by both scaled and unscaled coordinates. I can't tell you how close this is to reality, though... Could you post your Eurogenes K15 and K13 results? I've already made models for you with modern averages, most of your ancestry is Berber-related about 85 to 89%, the remaining European is estimated at 11 to 14%.

    Using SCALED coordinates:

    Code:
    Target: Axios_scaled
    
    Distance: 0.0161% | R2P
    88.9	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    11.1	Finnish_East
    
    Distance: 0.0143% | R3P
    82.6	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    13.8	Norwegian
    3.6	Ethiopian_Agaw
    
    Distance: 0.0133% | R4P
    82.6	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    10.6	Norwegian
    3.7	Lak
    3.1	Ethiopian_Agaw
    Using UNSCALED coordinates:

    Code:
    Target: Axios
    
    Distance: 1.0503% | R2P
    86.0	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    14.0	Shetlandic
    
    Distance: 0.9533% | R3P
    83.2	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    11.2	Norwegian
    5.6	Ethiopian_Agaw
    
    Distance: 0.9027% | R4P
    83.0	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    8.0	Shetlandic
    4.8	Ethiopian_Agaw
    4.2	Shor_Khakassia
    Last edited by Ajeje Brazorf; 03-17-2021 at 11:11 AM.
    [1] "distance%=2.9299"

    Ajeje Brazorf

    EEF,51.4
    BALTIC_BA,12.6
    GANJ_DAREH,10.8
    CHG,10.4
    MIDDLE_EAST,10
    ANE,2.4
    TAFORALT,1.8
    WHG,0.6

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to Ajeje Brazorf For This Useful Post:

     drobbah (03-17-2021)

  7. #15
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    日本人

    Japan United States of America
    You are mostly Amazigh, with some North European affinity.

    Target: Ouail_scaled
    Distance: 2.2173% / 0.02217343
    86.8 Canary_Islands_Guanche
    7.0 German
    6.2 Polish

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to SilkRoad For This Useful Post:

     Axios (03-17-2021),  ThaYamamoto (03-17-2021)

  9. #16
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    日本人

    Japan United States of America
    Quote Originally Posted by Ignis90 View Post
    Steppes is already high in the Rif in general so you need to use a Rif (or Chaouia) individual + Europeans in your models. You can't use a Southern Moroccan for example as a reference because they have a different genesis (high Iberomaurusian, low to no steppes, low to no Afroasiatic-related ancestry etc...). And your known genealogy is from the Rif, so even using a Kabyle or a Tunisian wouldn't be useful, even though still more proximate than a Soussi.

    I don't have my computer with me currently but in any case, you are mostly Berber with a minor European pull that should be recent.
    You might need to explore the communities MH gave you, by checking your European matches. European matches are the most common ones for Maghrebis in general because Maghrebis are not very well represented in the clientele. But if you didn't have recent European ancestry, you wouldn't have hundreds or thousands of matches with Northern Europeans for instance (or any unusual European population for a Maghrebi to match with).
    Bizarrely his steppe is accompanied by lower Anatolian Neolithic. His IBM is unusually higher too. It makes his affinity highly & strangely North European affiliated explaining the lower Neolithic Anatolian.
    Last edited by SilkRoad; 03-18-2021 at 04:08 AM.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to SilkRoad For This Useful Post:

     ThaYamamoto (03-17-2021)

  11. #17
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    Riffian Berber
    Y-DNA (P)
    Probably E-M81
    mtDNA (M)
    Soon

    MoroccoPreColonial
    Quote Originally Posted by Ajeje Brazorf View Post
    There is definitely a shift in your coordinates that is not only European, but precisely North European and this is evidenced by both scaled and unscaled coordinates. I can't tell you how close this is to reality, though... Could you post your Eurogenes K15 and K13 results? I've already made models for you with modern averages, most of your ancestry is Berber-related about 85 to 89%, the remaining European is estimated at 11 to 14%.

    Using SCALED coordinates:

    Code:
    Target: Axios_scaled
    
    Distance: 0.0161% | R2P
    88.9	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    11.1	Finnish_East
    
    Distance: 0.0143% | R3P
    82.6	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    13.8	Norwegian
    3.6	Ethiopian_Agaw
    
    Distance: 0.0133% | R4P
    82.6	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    10.6	Norwegian
    3.7	Lak
    3.1	Ethiopian_Agaw
    Using UNSCALED coordinates:

    Code:
    Target: Axios
    
    Distance: 1.0503% | R2P
    86.0	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    14.0	Shetlandic
    
    Distance: 0.9533% | R3P
    83.2	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    11.2	Norwegian
    5.6	Ethiopian_Agaw
    
    Distance: 0.9027% | R4P
    83.0	Berber_Tunisia_Chen
    8.0	Shetlandic
    4.8	Ethiopian_Agaw
    4.2	Shor_Khakassia
    K13:


    # Population Percent
    1 East_Med 27.08
    2 West_Med 22.48
    3 North_Atlantic 15.78
    4 Red_Sea 14.41
    5 Northeast_African 11.4
    6 Sub-Saharan 5.71
    7 Baltic 1.45
    8 Siberian 1.32
    9 Amerindian 0.19
    10 Oceanian 0.16

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Algerian 7.36
    2 Moroccan 8.15
    3 Tunisian 9.06
    4 Mozabite_Berber 9.22
    5 Libyan_Jewish 17.64
    6 Algerian_Jewish 17.9
    7 Tunisian_Jewish 18.92
    8 West_Sicilian 19.31
    9 Italian_Jewish 19.54
    10 Sephardic_Jewish 19.6
    11 Egyptian 19.93
    12 East_Sicilian 20.11
    13 Ashkenazi 20.31
    14 South_Italian 21.21
    15 Tuscan 22.27
    16 Italian_Abruzzo 22.62
    17 Central_Greek 22.66
    18 Greek_Thessaly 24.08
    19 Bedouin 24.39
    20 Jordanian 25.86

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 84.2% Algerian + 15.8% Spanish_Murcia @ 4.87
    2 84.7% Algerian + 15.3% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 4.9
    3 76.9% Moroccan + 23.1% Tuscan @ 4.91
    4 85% Algerian + 15% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 4.91
    5 84% Algerian + 16% Portuguese @ 4.94
    6 86% Algerian + 14% Spanish_Aragon @ 4.95
    7 84.5% Algerian + 15.5% Spanish_Andalucia @ 4.96
    8 84% Algerian + 16% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.02
    9 85.2% Algerian + 14.8% Spanish_Valencia @ 5.03
    10 82.1% Moroccan + 17.9% Spanish_Murcia @ 5.05
    11 85.7% Algerian + 14.3% Spanish_Cataluna @ 5.07
    12 84.7% Algerian + 15.3% Spanish_Galicia @ 5.07
    13 86.2% Algerian + 13.8% Spanish_Cantabria @ 5.11
    14 80% Moroccan + 20% North_Italian @ 5.13
    15 82.8% Algerian + 17.2% North_Italian @ 5.13
    16 87% Algerian + 13% Southwest_French @ 5.14
    17 81.9% Moroccan + 18.1% Portuguese @ 5.15
    18 84.9% Moroccan + 15.1% French @ 5.16
    19 87.1% Algerian + 12.9% French @ 5.17
    20 83.2% Moroccan + 16.8% Spanish_Valencia @ 5.2

    K12b:



    K15:



    # Population Percent
    1 East_Med 24.09
    2 West_Med 20.46
    3 Atlantic 14.36
    4 Red_Sea 13.98
    5 Northeast_African 13.09
    6 North_Sea 5.38
    7 Sub-Saharan 5.33
    8 Baltic 2
    9 Siberian 1.08
    10 Amerindian 0.17
    11 Oceanian 0.05
    12 Southeast_Asian 0.01

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Algerian 8.07
    2 Moroccan 8.18
    3 Tunisian 8.73
    4 Mozabite_Berber 9.52
    5 Algerian_Jewish 18.77
    6 Libyan_Jewish 19.62
    7 West_Sicilian 19.75
    8 Italian_Jewish 19.95
    9 Tunisian_Jewish 20.13
    10 Egyptian 20.18
    11 Sephardic_Jewish 20.55
    12 East_Sicilian 20.84
    13 Ashkenazi 20.85
    14 Tuscan 22.19
    15 South_Italian 22.36
    16 Italian_Abruzzo 23.17
    17 Central_Greek 23.41
    18 Greek_Thessaly 24.29
    19 Greek 24.34
    20 Bedouin 24.68

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 75.2% Moroccan + 24.8% West_Sicilian @ 5.26
    2 81.2% Moroccan + 18.8% Spanish_Murcia @ 5.33
    3 77.8% Moroccan + 22.2% Tuscan @ 5.4
    4 82.5% Moroccan + 17.5% Spanish_Valencia @ 5.47
    5 80% Moroccan + 20% North_Italian @ 5.49
    6 82.1% Moroccan + 17.9% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 5.52
    7 83% Moroccan + 17% Spanish_Cataluna @ 5.54
    8 81.8% Moroccan + 18.2% Spanish_Andalucia @ 5.57
    9 81.4% Moroccan + 18.6% Spanish_Extremadura @ 5.62
    10 82.8% Moroccan + 17.2% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 5.64
    11 87.6% Moroccan + 12.4% Southeast_English @ 5.64
    12 88% Moroccan + 12% Irish @ 5.65
    13 81.7% Moroccan + 18.3% Portuguese @ 5.66
    14 79.2% Moroccan + 20.8% Italian_Abruzzo @ 5.68
    15 88.2% Moroccan + 11.8% West_Scottish @ 5.68
    16 83.7% Moroccan + 16.3% Spanish_Aragon @ 5.68
    17 87.6% Moroccan + 12.4% North_German @ 5.69
    18 86.3% Moroccan + 13.7% South_Dutch @ 5.7
    19 85% Moroccan + 15% French @ 5.73
    20 88.1% Moroccan + 11.9% Danish @ 5.73


    Dodecad K12b:



    # Population Percent
    1 Northwest_African 28.82
    2 Atlantic_Med 23.05
    3 Southwest_Asian 14.53
    4 Caucasus 13.53
    5 East_African 7.66
    6 North_European 6.51
    7 Sub_Saharan 3.27
    8 Siberian 1.05
    9 South_Asian 0.71
    10 Gedrosia 0.48
    11 Southeast_Asian 0.34
    12 East_Asian 0.06

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Algerian (Dodecad) 9.52
    2 Moroccan (Dodecad) 16.75
    3 Moroccans (Behar) 18.72
    4 Morocco_Jews (Behar) 27.46
    5 Egyptans (Behar) 30.69
    6 Canarias (1000Genomes) 31.72
    7 Sephardic_Jews (Behar) 31.9
    8 Sicilian (Dodecad) 33.09
    9 Ashkenazi (Dodecad) 33.22
    10 Ashkenazy_Jews (Behar) 33.97
    11 S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) 34.16
    12 C_Italian (Dodecad) 34.9
    13 O_Italian (Dodecad) 35.6
    14 Portuguese (Dodecad) 36.18
    15 Jordanians (Behar) 36.49
    16 TSI30 (Metspalu) 36.77
    17 Palestinian (HGDP) 37.1
    18 Tuscan (HGDP) 37.39
    19 Extremadura (1000Genomes) 37.43
    20 Greek (Dodecad) 37.6

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 83.8% Algerian (Dodecad) + 16.2% Bulgarians (Yunusbayev) @ 5.04
    2 83.8% Algerian (Dodecad) + 16.2% Romanians (Behar) @ 5.04
    3 83.7% Algerian (Dodecad) + 16.3% Bulgarian (Dodecad) @ 5.11
    4 81.7% Algerian (Dodecad) + 18.3% O_Italian (Dodecad) @ 5.32
    5 82.7% Algerian (Dodecad) + 17.3% N_Italian (Dodecad) @ 5.33
    6 86.2% Algerian (Dodecad) + 13.8% Hungarians (Behar) @ 5.39
    7 82.3% Algerian (Dodecad) + 17.7% TSI30 (Metspalu) @ 5.46
    8 82.6% Algerian (Dodecad) + 17.4% Tuscan (HGDP) @ 5.51
    9 83.1% Algerian (Dodecad) + 16.9% North_Italian (HGDP) @ 5.51
    10 67.5% Moroccans (Behar) + 32.5% Greek (Dodecad) @ 5.54
    11 65.8% Moroccans (Behar) + 34.2% C_Italian (Dodecad) @ 5.58
    12 81.7% Algerian (Dodecad) + 18.3% C_Italian (Dodecad) @ 5.58
    13 82.9% Algerian (Dodecad) + 17.1% Greek (Dodecad) @ 5.63
    14 66.3% Moroccans (Behar) + 33.7% O_Italian (Dodecad) @ 5.64
    15 86.7% Algerian (Dodecad) + 13.3% German (Dodecad) @ 5.64
    16 67.5% Moroccans (Behar) + 32.5% Tuscan (HGDP) @ 5.77
    17 85.8% Algerian (Dodecad) + 14.2% French (HGDP) @ 5.77
    18 86.8% Algerian (Dodecad) + 13.2% Mixed_Germanic (Dodecad) @ 5.86
    19 65.4% Moroccans (Behar) + 34.6% S_Italian_Sicilian (Dodecad) @ 5.88
    20 70.3% Moroccan (Dodecad) + 29.7% Greek (Dodecad) @ 5.89


    The northern euro thing appears in all calculators

  12. #18
    Registered Users
    Posts
    70
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    Riffian Berber
    Y-DNA (P)
    Probably E-M81
    mtDNA (M)
    Soon

    MoroccoPreColonial
    Quote Originally Posted by Ignis90 View Post
    Steppes is already high in the Rif in general so you need to use a Rif (or Chaouia) individual + Europeans in your models. You can't use a Southern Moroccan for example as a reference because they have a different genesis (high Iberomaurusian, low to no steppes, low to no Afroasiatic-related ancestry etc...). And your known genealogy is from the Rif, so even using a Kabyle or a Tunisian wouldn't be useful, even though still more proximate than a Soussi.

    I don't have my computer with me currently but in any case, you are mostly Berber with a minor European pull that should be recent.
    You might need to explore the communities MH gave you, by checking your European matches. European matches are the most common ones for Maghrebis in general because Maghrebis are not very well represented in the clientele. But if you didn't have recent European ancestry, you wouldn't have hundreds or thousands of matches with Northern Europeans for instance (or any unusual European population for a Maghrebi to match with).

    How many matches/cousins do you have on myheritage? What percentage of them are clearly not Maghrebis or of Maghrebi descent?
    I do get a lot of europeans but i share small segments with them
    Last edited by Moderator; 03-17-2021 at 04:20 PM. Reason: Tos 5.1 - Privacy Violation

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     GabrielZelalem (03-17-2021)

  14. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axios View Post
    The northern euro thing appears in all calculators
    On GEDmatch the shift is more towards the Iberian Peninsula or Southern Europe in general, only on Global25 is it towards Northern Europe. Which of the two will be the more correct?

    Target: Axios (Eurogenes K15)
    Distance: 5.5263% | R2P
    87.1 Algerian
    12.9 French_Southwest

    In these two tables I have compared your results with those of ancient and modern North African populations, the thing that differentiates you most is the greater intake of CHG and Steppe.

    Ancients:

    WHG West Africa-related TAFORALT CHG IRAN_N EEF ANE East Africa-related Middle East-related Baltic-related
    Axios_scaled 0 2,2 29,6 7,6 0 35,8 3,4 2 9,8 9,4
    Canary_Islands_Guanche (626-1095 AD) 2,28 4,4 33,2 3,24 2,4 38,16 1,2 2,16 8,24 3,92
    Iberia_Central_CA_Afr (2273 BC) 2,6 2,6 29 0 0 45,8 0 8 12 0
    ITA_Sardinia_C_o (2271 BC) 0,6 2 44 0 0 35 0 6,6 11,8 0

    Moderns:

    WHG West Africa-related TAFORALT CHG IRAN_N EEF Biaka-related ANE East Africa-related Middle East-related Baltic-related
    Axios_scaled 0 2,2 29,6 7,6 0 35,8 0 3,4 2 9,8 9,4
    Moroccan_North 2,06 5,36 29,57 4,10 3,59 39,01 0,20 0,87 0,71 8,74 4,73
    Berber_Tunisia_Chen 0,36 3,10 34,58 4,39 3,50 39,89 0,11 0,41 1,28 6,99 5,00
    Mozabite 0,82 9,48 32,05 4,63 1,93 36,17 0,06 0,30 0,75 8,53 4,94
    Tunisian_Berber_Zraoua 0,23 5,89 28,56 4,04 2,93 35,53 0,07 0,83 0,52 16,63 4,71
    Tunisian_Berber_Matmata 0,56 8,19 27,01 4,23 3,17 35,93 0,06 0,90 1,87 14,10 3,59
    Algerian 0,77 10,13 24,77 4,41 2,87 33,65 0,36 0,59 2,64 14,13 4,97
    Berber_MAR_ERR 0,61 10,74 34,16 2,40 2,46 34,00 0,29 0,54 1,83 8,24 3,93
    Saharawi 0,57 9,88 36,44 1,63 1,35 30,25 0,26 0,13 1,87 14,59 2,43
    Moroccan 0,49 12,89 27,33 3,20 3,09 29,67 0,00 0,62 1,22 17,42 3,64
    Berber_MAR_TIZ 0,94 9,79 40,31 1,49 2,00 35,39 0,57 0,30 1,99 4,27 2,60
    Tunisian 0,30 8,18 22,85 2,55 4,70 30,85 0,20 0,65 2,33 21,53 5,38
    Last edited by Ajeje Brazorf; 03-17-2021 at 04:04 PM.
    [1] "distance%=2.9299"

    Ajeje Brazorf

    EEF,51.4
    BALTIC_BA,12.6
    GANJ_DAREH,10.8
    CHG,10.4
    MIDDLE_EAST,10
    ANE,2.4
    TAFORALT,1.8
    WHG,0.6

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