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Thread: Why are Lebanese Muslims genetically more European than Lebanese Christians?

  1. #1
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    Why are Lebanese Muslims genetically more European than Lebanese Christians?

    Why are Lebanese Muslims genetically more European than Lebanese Christians?

  2. #2
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    Could you provide some samples that display your point?

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  4. #3
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    From what I can tell, there seems to be more steppe input in Levantine Muslims compared to Levantine non-Muslims including Christians. That extra steppe could have come from anywhere but I think it could be a possible reason for the observation that they seem genetically more "European".

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  6. #4
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    With average pops.
    Muslims
    Distance to: Lebanese_Muslim_Sunni
    0.16748966 Sardinian
    0.18190965 Basque_French
    0.18215608 German
    0.18531000 Basque_Spanish
    0.21427859 Russian_Smolensk



    Distance to: Lebanese_Muslim_Shia
    0.16478626 Sardinian
    0.17839017 German
    0.17892901 Basque_French
    0.18201754 Basque_Spanish
    0.21124147 Russian_Smolensk


    Distance to: Lebanese_Muslim
    0.15905150 Sardinian
    0.17454116 German
    0.17472169 Basque_French
    0.17785783 Basque_Spanish
    0.20720860 Russian_Smolensk

    Then Christians:

    Distance to: Lebanese_Christian_Maronite
    0.15388375 Sardinian
    0.17765663 Basque_French
    0.17997308 Basque_Spanish
    0.18183923 German
    0.21699811 Russian_Smolensk


    Distance to: Lebanese_Christian_Greek_Orthodox
    0.15384082 Sardinian
    0.17864688 Basque_French
    0.18091847 Basque_Spanish
    0.18352810 German
    0.21906220 Russian_Smolensk


    Distance to: Lebanese_Christian
    0.15165832 Sardinian
    0.17651290 Basque_French
    0.17876605 Basque_Spanish
    0.18189168 German
    0.21759170 Russian_Smolensk

    It doesn't seem to be the case. Christians Lebanese are closer to europeans than Muslims are to europeans.
    Muslims have a little more input from Yamnaya but for to say they are "genetically more european", according what?just because of this input?because for example, we can to say Muslims are genetically more african too (Christians have none or very very little African input).
    Last edited by Aben Aboo; 04-28-2021 at 08:26 PM.

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  8. #5
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    Lebanese and Syrian Muslims have Turkish input.

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim_Sunni
    Distance: 0.4193% / 0.00419340
    71.8 Lebanese_Druze
    11.2 Turkish_Kayseri
    7.6 Somali
    6.6 Turkish_Adana
    2.8 Saudi

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim_Shia
    Distance: 0.4271% / 0.00427081
    70.2 Lebanese_Druze
    17.4 Turkish_Adana
    4.2 Saudi
    4.0 Somali
    3.0 Turkish_Central
    1.2 Turkish_Kayseri

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim
    Distance: 0.4611% / 0.00461054
    77.4 Lebanese_Druze
    6.0 Turkish_Adana
    5.2 Saudi
    4.0 Turkish_Kayseri
    2.6 Turkish_Central
    2.0 Somali
    1.6 German
    1.2 Turkish_Balikesir

    Target: Lebanese_Christian_Maronite
    Distance: 1.0374% / 0.01037376
    91.8 Lebanese_Druze
    4.4 Saudi
    3.8 Turkish_Kayseri

    Target: Lebanese_Christian_Greek_Orthodox
    Distance: 1.1091% / 0.01109115
    93.2 Lebanese_Druze
    4.8 Saudi
    2.0 Turkish_Kayseri

    Target: Lebanese_Christian
    Distance: 1.1139% / 0.01113934
    89.0 Lebanese_Druze
    9.0 Saudi
    2.0 German

    Lebanese Muslims achieved higher steppe by mixing with Turks:

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim_Sunni
    Distance: 1.0867% / 0.01086675
    38.8 Levant_JOR_EBA
    23.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    16.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    8.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    8.0 Somali
    3.2 GEO_CHG
    1.0 Mongol

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim_Shia
    Distance: 0.9223% / 0.00922293
    40.2 Levant_JOR_EBA
    24.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    18.4 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    8.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    4.6 Somali
    2.6 GEO_CHG
    1.0 Mongol

    Target: Lebanese_Muslim
    Distance: 1.1726% / 0.01172610
    42.8 Levant_JOR_EBA
    24.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    16.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    10.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    3.2 Somali
    2.8 GEO_CHG
    0.8 Mongol

    Target: Lebanese_Christian_Maronite
    Distance: 0.9343% / 0.00934267
    48.2 Levant_JOR_EBA
    26.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    14.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    5.6 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    5.2 GEO_CHG

    Target: Lebanese_Christian_Greek_Orthodox
    Distance: 0.9317% / 0.00931745
    48.2 Levant_JOR_EBA
    27.2 TUR_Barcin_N
    14.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    5.4 GEO_CHG
    5.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara

    Target: Lebanese_Christian
    Distance: 0.9831% / 0.00983075
    49.2 Levant_JOR_EBA
    27.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    14.4 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    6.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    3.2 GEO_CHG
    0.2 Somali

    Target: Turkish_Kayseri
    Distance: 1.2327% / 0.01232735
    31.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    20.4 Levant_JOR_EBA
    15.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    12.8 GEO_CHG
    12.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    7.0 Mongol

    Target: Turkish_Istanbul
    Distance: 0.9714% / 0.00971403
    38.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    22.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    13.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    11.6 Levant_JOR_EBA
    7.6 GEO_CHG
    7.0 Mongol

    Target: Turkish_Central
    Distance: 0.9567% / 0.00956713
    31.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    19.4 Levant_JOR_EBA
    14.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    13.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    12.4 GEO_CHG
    9.4 Mongol

    Target: Turkish_Balikesir
    Distance: 0.7943% / 0.00794262
    32.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    22.0 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    14.8 Mongol
    12.8 Levant_JOR_EBA
    11.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    6.0 GEO_CHG

    Target: Turkish_Aydin
    Distance: 0.8200% / 0.00819966
    30.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    17.4 Levant_JOR_EBA
    16.6 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    15.2 Mongol
    10.4 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    9.6 GEO_CHG

    Target: Turkish_Adana
    Distance: 0.9680% / 0.00968007
    30.2 TUR_Barcin_N
    20.0 Levant_JOR_EBA
    18.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    14.6 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    9.2 GEO_CHG
    7.8 Mongol

    This can make Euro populations show up in some calculators.

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  10. #6
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    Yes, i think it's more through Turkish people they have this input, because of the Ottoman Caliphate, history, neighbor country, same religion so the possibility of more interactions like the marriage act between them, ect.
    Last edited by Aben Aboo; 05-03-2021 at 08:17 PM.

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  12. #7
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    Don't the Egyptian muslims also have more Steppe then the copts? Perhaps just like the West African/Sudanese admixture in MENA muslims, increased steppe compared to their Christian counterparts might come from the Islamic slave trade?
    Target: Drobbah_scaled
    Distance: 2.8833% / 0.02883253
    93.8 Somali
    6.2 Yemenite_Dhamar

    FTDNA myorigins 3.0:
    Eritrea, Northern Ethiopia & Somalia
    94%
    Yemenite Jewish
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  13. #8
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    I don't think it's only through the slavery.
    Muslims Caucasians people and Turkish are just near to this area.
    And in the Islamic era there was more circulation and interactions between peoples, especially as the Levant is at the crossroads and heart of the Arab Muslim zone.
    Last edited by Aben Aboo; 05-03-2021 at 08:26 PM.

  14. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aben Aboo View Post
    I don't think it's only through the slavery.
    Muslims Caucasians people and Turkish are just near to this area.
    And in the Islamic era there was more circulation and interactions between peoples, especially as the Levant is at the crossroads and heart of the Arab Muslim zone.
    There was large amounts of European slaves especially via Crimea and later the Barbary slave trade.Many of those Turks were slaves themselves although the men were mostly military slaves.

    Ofcourse not all Euro admixture is slavery mediated just like all the West African/Sahelian or Bantu admixture isn't just slavery mediated.Till today there are descendants of West African pilgrims in the Hijaz and Jerusalem

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  16. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aben Aboo View Post
    Yes, i think it's more through Turkish people they have this input, because of the Ottoman Caliphate, history, neighbor country, same religion so the possibility of more interactions like the marriage act between them, ect.
    I don't think it's as simple as Lebanese muslims mixed with Turkish muslims. After all how did Lebanese Christians get steppe admixture as well? It could have been through the same Greco/Anatolian source.

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