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Thread: Are South Italians more than half Middle Eastern/Caucasian?

  1. #1
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    Are South Italians more than half Middle Eastern/Caucasian?

    https://bmcbiol.biomedcentral.com/ar...15-020-00778-4

    Are they talking about ancient ancestry?Am I interpretating this study properly?

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  3. #2
    They choose inaccurate and misleading names. Ancestral genetics has proven ethnic South Italians have 0.1-3% recent (that came from Roman times/Middle Ages) MENA admixture depending on the person. The "Middle Eastern" shifted component is really the Neolithic descended Anatolian Farmer component that most Europeans have a significant ancestral component of.

  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSpaceCorridor View Post
    They choose inaccurate and misleading names. Ancestral genetics has proven ethnic South Italians have 0.1-3% recent (that came from Roman times/Middle Ages) MENA admixture depending on the person. The "Middle Eastern" shifted component is really the Neolithic descended Anatolian Farmer component that most Europeans have a significant ancestral component of.
    This is completely wrong, nice try lol
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222>Y15245

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandfather's Mother's line) Y: R1b-U152>L2

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandmother's Mother's line) Y: I2-P78>A427>S23612>Y6396

    Other Y lines Confirmed: 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-M67, 4x GG on Maternal side: R1b-PF7562, 5x GG on Maternal side: E-V13, 5x GG on Maternal side: R2-L266

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  6. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azbuzz View Post
    https://bmcbiol.biomedcentral.com/ar...15-020-00778-4

    Are they talking about ancient ancestry?Am I interpretating this study properly?
    It’s impossible at the moment to know the exact number but its definitely less than half. Also depending the time period as well, if you count only Steppe and WHG than yeah, but it’s ridiculous to do so, the Neolithic Farmers would have started to arrive in Europe almost 9000 years ago making this a native component. CHG gets tricky because Steppe populations had it as well as some Neolithic communities. But for the sakes of Middle Eastern in a Classic sense such as the BA Anatolia, the Levant and North Africa it is clear there has been quite a bit of Middle Eastern admixture. If you look at the typical results of genetic companies 4-5 years ago almost all Southern Italians scored 30% Middle Eastern and this is not the Neolithic variety but rather the majority come in from Iron Age up and until the end of the Western Roman Empire, its clear from all the ancient papers there was a massive demographic shift. The only more recent admixture event from the Middle East would be North African and its mostly restricted to Sicily and Malta.
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222>Y15245

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandfather's Mother's line) Y: R1b-U152>L2

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandmother's Mother's line) Y: I2-P78>A427>S23612>Y6396

    Other Y lines Confirmed: 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-M67, 4x GG on Maternal side: R1b-PF7562, 5x GG on Maternal side: E-V13, 5x GG on Maternal side: R2-L266

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  8. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Principe View Post
    It’s impossible at the moment to know the exact number but its definitely less than half. Also depending the time period as well, if you count only Steppe and WHG than yeah, but it’s ridiculous to do so, the Neolithic Farmers would have started to arrive in Europe almost 9000 years ago making this a native component. CHG gets tricky because Steppe populations had it as well as some Neolithic communities. But for the sakes of Middle Eastern in a Classic sense such as the BA Anatolia, the Levant and North Africa it is clear there has been quite a bit of Middle Eastern admixture. If you look at the typical results of genetic companies 4-5 years ago almost all Southern Italians scored 30% Middle Eastern and this is not the Neolithic variety but rather the majority come in from Iron Age up and until the end of the Western Roman Empire, its clear from all the ancient papers there was a massive demographic shift. The only more recent admixture event from the Middle East would be North African and its mostly restricted to Sicily and Malta.
    Very well-said Principe.
    MDKA: Robert Boulay, b. 1631, Rťveillon, Orne, France
    Y-DNA: R1b-U152 > L2 > Z367 > Z34 > Z33 > BY164497> BY3604

    Maternal Y-DNA: J2a-M67 > Z1847 > Y4036 > Z467 > Z447> L210

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  10. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by alchemist223 View Post
    Very well-said Principe.
    Thanks I appreciate it
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222>Y15245

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandfather's Mother's line) Y: R1b-U152>L2

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandmother's Mother's line) Y: I2-P78>A427>S23612>Y6396

    Other Y lines Confirmed: 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-M67, 4x GG on Maternal side: R1b-PF7562, 5x GG on Maternal side: E-V13, 5x GG on Maternal side: R2-L266

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  12. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Principe View Post
    Middle Eastern in a Classic sense such as the BA Anatolia, the Levant and North Africa
    Wouldn't BA Anatolian ancestry be extremely different from North African ancestry? Genuinely curious.

  13. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by bovefex View Post
    Wouldn't BA Anatolian ancestry be extremely different from North African ancestry? Genuinely curious.
    They are completely different, I am just answering to the broader MENA question with the whole Neolithic crowd shtick
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222>Y15245

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandfather's Mother's line) Y: R1b-U152>L2

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandmother's Mother's line) Y: I2-P78>A427>S23612>Y6396

    Other Y lines Confirmed: 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-M67, 4x GG on Maternal side: R1b-PF7562, 5x GG on Maternal side: E-V13, 5x GG on Maternal side: R2-L266

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    Quote Originally Posted by Principe View Post
    They are completely different, I am just answering to the broader MENA question with the whole Neolithic crowd shtick
    Thank you. So putting those together into the same group (MENA) is also completely wrong, right?

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  17. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by bovefex View Post
    Thank you. So putting those together into the same group (MENA) is also completely wrong, right?
    Yeah at least genetically I would say. There are some shared components, but for the most part North African ethnogenesis is different than the Middle East.
    My Y Line: J2a-L210>Z489>Z482>Y15222>Y15245

    My Maternal Y: R1b-U152>Z36>Y156527

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandfather's Mother's line) Y: R1b-U152>L2

    Great Grandparent (Maternal Grandmother's Mother's line) Y: I2-P78>A427>S23612>Y6396

    Other Y lines Confirmed: 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-S25258>SK1336, 3x GG on Maternal side: J2a-M67, 4x GG on Maternal side: R1b-PF7562, 5x GG on Maternal side: E-V13, 5x GG on Maternal side: R2-L266

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