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Thread: Spanish DNA

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by digital_noise View Post
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....4-G25-Ancestry
    Mate, people have been asking for you since February to provide any result from a commercial test so we can have a foundation to offer assistance. The thing is, G25 and Gedmatch are kinda useless unless you have some base understanding. If I relied on Gedmatch results and random G25 models, I would be having an identity crisis as so many fit good enough. I dont intend to be toxic, but in this thread you are asking about Spanish, and a previous one Latin America and then another about African ancestry. All 3 of those will have vastly different outcomes given your actual background and at this point its just too confusing to keep up.

    If you want any sort of actual help instead of us shooting in the dark, provide some sort of visual results so we can then build a meaningful method of sorting this out.
    I already made a model for him based on his ancestry...it wasn’t a “random” model. I have experience in data science and carefully chose samples for him so I definitely know what I’m doing. Also his Broadly Southern European could easily be Spanish considering he does get a signal for the Canary Islands in G25.

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  3. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by chocoholic View Post
    I already made a model for him based on his ancestry...it wasn’t a “random” model. I have experience in data science and carefully chose samples for him so I definitely know what I’m doing. Also his Broadly Southern European could easily be Spanish considering he does get a signal for the Canary Islands in G25.
    I'm not doubting you or your skill. I'm doubting the modern samples available as they are not fully vetted. That's why at a certain point Davidski stopped or was planning on stopping using them.

    And while I am certainly not a pro at this, I too have enough of an understanding to know how all of this works. I can model myself as Spanish as well as Macedonian, Greek etc. despite not having any of those so one model does not trump a handful of commercial tests.

    But that's not the issue. I was simply trying to see what a commercial test provided as a basis for helping. A few other threads he's asking about Cuban, Puerto Rican etc. So if his broadly southern was from there, its going to be a lot different than a standard Spanish result.

    EDIT
    I will say that I do find it odd that 10% broadly southern is still applied here. I dont know what version of the test he took or when but if it was pre v4, I dont really know if they upgraded those versions.
    Last edited by digital_noise; 06-19-2021 at 04:29 AM.
    distance%=4.6465"
    Barcin_N,47.2
    Yamnaya_Samara,41.4
    WHG,10.6
    Ethiopia_4500BP,0.8

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  5. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by digital_noise View Post
    I'm not doubting you or your skill. I'm doubting the modern samples available as they are not fully vetted. That's why at a certain point Davidski stopped or was planning on stopping using them.

    And while I am certainly not a pro at this, I too have enough of an understanding to know how all of this works. I can model myself as Spanish as well as Macedonian, Greek etc. despite not having any of those so one model does not trump a handful of commercial tests.

    But that's not the issue. I was simply trying to see what a commercial test provided as a basis for helping. A few other threads he's asking about Cuban, Puerto Rican etc. So if his broadly southern was from there, its going to be a lot different than a standard Spanish result.
    Let me clarify:

    The reason I asked about the Cuban and Puerto Rican samples is that my father and myself have Cuban and Puerto Rican dna matches that are in 3rd and 4th cousin range.

    I simply wanted to see if there was a sample for this. I know the samples will differ from Spanish samples but considering I do not know too much about my family history past 4 generations other than my moms paternal line I wanted to inquire into what could have possibly been the locations of my ancestors.

    I am also just curious, not only for myself but in regards to admixture samples in general from the Americas. I study anthropology at my university and I wanted to see if there was someone who modeled the average admixture of Noerh American groups on here. I didn’t mean to cause confusion.

    When I first took 23andme, I was surprised to see there was ancestry components I didn’t know about. My moms maternal side tested and came up with some Native American from the Caribbean so I was asking about that.

    That’s all. I hope this helps I was just curious

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     digital_noise (06-19-2021)

  7. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by digital_noise View Post
    I'm not doubting you or your skill. I'm doubting the modern samples available as they are not fully vetted. That's why at a certain point Davidski stopped or was planning on stopping using them.

    And while I am certainly not a pro at this, I too have enough of an understanding to know how all of this works. I can model myself as Spanish as well as Macedonian, Greek etc. despite not having any of those so one model does not trump a handful of commercial tests.

    But that's not the issue. I was simply trying to see what a commercial test provided as a basis for helping. A few other threads he's asking about Cuban, Puerto Rican etc. So if his broadly southern was from there, its going to be a lot different than a standard Spanish result.

    EDIT
    I will say that I do find it odd that 10% broadly southern is still applied here. I dont know what version of the test he took or when but if it was pre v4, I dont really know if they upgraded those versions.
    I apologize for coming off as defensive. I have gotten some very rude comments in these communities before, given that I’m a girl who likes math and science so I jumped to conclusions.

    Do you know which samples in particular were not fully vetted? You can generally get a pretty good model if you choose the correct samples. My belief is that G25 is an excellent supplement to a 23andme test. I modeled your coordinates that you messaged me a while back and got a very good fit for you when I chose the samples based on your known ancestry.

    I think this one is fairly accurate for you…I used the Longobard sample because a lot of Germans seem to cluster with it:

    Target: Digital_Noise_scaled
    Distance: 2.2648% / 0.02264838
    44.0 English
    25.4 Sicilian_West
    10.2 ITALY_LONGOBARD
    9.4 Swedish
    6.2 German
    3.6 French_Auvergne
    1.2 Italian_Molise

    The reason you get Spanish or Macedonian is because your German ancestry combined with your Calabrese makes an “oracle-like” result. I do believe 23andme is good to have with G25 especially since overfitting and oracle effects can happen a lot. Like my German doesn’t show up unless I use the Longobard sample since my ancestry comes from the Black Forest region of the country, which clusters with French and Swiss groups.

    Is Davdiski planning on updating G25 anytime soon?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sokoski View Post
    Let me clarify:

    The reason I asked about the Cuban and Puerto Rican samples is that my father and myself have Cuban and Puerto Rican dna matches that are in 3rd and 4th cousin range.

    I simply wanted to see if there was a sample for this. I know the samples will differ from Spanish samples but considering I do not know too much about my family history past 4 generations other than my moms paternal line I wanted to inquire into what could have possibly been the locations of my ancestors.

    I am also just curious, not only for myself but in regards to admixture samples in general from the Americas. I study anthropology at my university and I wanted to see if there was someone who modeled the average admixture of Noerh American groups on here. I didnít mean to cause confusion.

    When I first took 23andme, I was surprised to see there was ancestry components I didnít know about. My moms maternal side tested and came up with some Native American from the Caribbean so I was asking about that.

    Thatís all. I hope this helps I was just curious
    Post the complete results from 23andme, a single screenshot with the full results. If you do this people would be able to tell you what you have given that 23andme is the most accurate test by now
    and it is necessary for suggesting models with other tools. You are contradicting yourself too much.
    Last edited by Caius Agrippa; 06-19-2021 at 05:30 AM.

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  10. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by chocoholic View Post
    I apologize for coming off as defensive. I have gotten some very rude comments in these communities before, given that I’m a girl who likes math and science so I jumped to conclusions.

    Do you know which samples in particular were not fully vetted? You can generally get a pretty good model if you choose the correct samples. My belief is that G25 is an excellent supplement to a 23andme test. I modeled your coordinates that you messaged me a while back and got a very good fit for you when I chose the samples based on your known ancestry.

    I think this one is fairly accurate for you…I used the Longobard sample because a lot of Germans seem to cluster with it:

    Target: Digital_Noise_scaled
    Distance: 2.2648% / 0.02264838
    44.0 English
    25.4 Sicilian_West
    10.2 ITALY_LONGOBARD
    9.4 Swedish
    6.2 German
    3.6 French_Auvergne
    1.2 Italian_Molise

    The reason you get Spanish or Macedonian is because your German ancestry combined with your Calabrese makes an “oracle-like” result. I do believe 23andme is good to have with G25 especially since overfitting and oracle effects can happen a lot. Like my German doesn’t show up unless I use the Longobard sample since my ancestry comes from the Black Forest region of the country, which clusters with French and Swiss groups.

    Is Davdiski planning on updating G25 anytime soon?
    I'm not sure any of the modern samples have actually been vetted, but thats my ignorance on the subject so I could be wrong. By vetted, I mean a genealogical backtrack to prove they are a good fit for the particular ethnicity they are representing. I dont mean to cast extreme doubt on them, and I think its not realistic to put the burden on someone like Davidski to do so, but nonetheless, there are many many of the modern samples that "lean" or are straight up admixed. I think there are a lot of "close enough" samples representing certain modern categories. Its more prevalent in certain populations than others and unfortunately I am painting with broad brushstrokes in my explanation. I believe this was the reason why, at the time, he decided to not continue with modern samples. And I read that he is moving on from G25 so no clue as to its future.

    And I too agree its a good supplemental tool, but not as a primary tool for modern conversations. Its great for ancient modeling.
    Last edited by digital_noise; 06-19-2021 at 05:49 AM.
    distance%=4.6465"
    Barcin_N,47.2
    Yamnaya_Samara,41.4
    WHG,10.6
    Ethiopia_4500BP,0.8

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  12. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caius Agrippa View Post
    Post the complete results from 23andme, a single screenshot with the full results. If you do this people would be able to tell you what you have given that 23andme is the most accurate test by now
    and it is necessary for suggesting models with other tools. You are contradicting yourself too much.
    this is basically what I have tried asking for, but I am growing tired of the back and forth. Its not due to lack of trust, not really, rather its hard to make an informed suggestion when the data is provided in unverified chunks.
    distance%=4.6465"
    Barcin_N,47.2
    Yamnaya_Samara,41.4
    WHG,10.6
    Ethiopia_4500BP,0.8

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  14. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sokoski View Post
    I know! I don’t understand it at all hence the questions. My coordinates are from Ancestry and Geneplaza so I’m not sure if it affects it but it makes no sense at all. I’m perplexed by it
    Hi,
    I don't understand why did you said before that you have with 23AndMe results, 7% North African and 3% Congo https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779149
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779151
    and when you share your 23andMe results you have nothing for these....:
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779428
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779431
    anyway....good luck
    Last edited by Aben Aboo; 06-20-2021 at 03:55 AM.

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  16. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aben Aboo View Post
    Hi,
    I don't understand why did you said before that you have with 23AndMe results, 7% North African and 3% Congo https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779149
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779151
    and when you share your 23andMe results you have nothing for these....:
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779428
    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post779431
    anyway....good luck
    It’s because before the update I had these. But oh well now; I won’t ask any more questions about my ancestry bur rather try to support the overall G25 research

  17. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sokoski View Post
    It’s because before the update I had these. But oh well now; I won’t ask any more questions about my ancestry bur rather try to support the overall G25 research
    Ok and I see your ancient result "before" the update, no 7% North African but 3.1% Western Asian with 2.1% Northern Western Asian and 0.7% Arab, Levantine and Egyptian, not 7% North African like you said ... https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post749598
    Good luck for your G25 research...and have a good day

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