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Thread: East Med/West Asia and european scores.

  1. #21
    East Med = Levantine? I don't think so.

    Minoan Z501208 K13:

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 East_Med 54.37
    2 West_Med 41.81
    3 West_Asian 3.18
    4 Red_Sea 0.64

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Algerian_Jewish 27.09
    2 Italian_Jewish 28.38
    3 Cyprian 28.66
    4 Tunisian_Jewish 29.44
    5 Libyan_Jewish 29.59
    6 Samaritan 30.28
    7 Sephardic_Jewish 30.63
    8 Lebanese_Christian 31.02
    9 South_Italian 32.05
    10 Ashkenazi 32.49
    11 Lebanese_Druze 33.92
    12 East_Sicilian 34.11
    13 Lebanese_Muslim 34.72
    14 Central_Greek 35
    15 West_Sicilian 35.01
    16 Tunisian 35.12
    17 Sardinian 35.47
    18 Palestinian 35.54
    19 Syrian 36.05
    20 Jordanian 36.4


    ANF M897077 K13:

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 West_Med 48.34
    2 East_Med 40.09
    3 North_Atlantic 7.7
    4 Red_Sea 3.86

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Sardinian 20.72
    2 Algerian_Jewish 25.84
    3 Italian_Jewish 27.54
    4 South_Italian 29.02
    5 Sephardic_Jewish 29.54
    6 Libyan_Jewish 29.88
    7 Tunisian_Jewish 29.98
    8 West_Sicilian 30.08
    9 East_Sicilian 30.75
    10 Ashkenazi 31.04
    11 Tunisian 31.44
    12 Cyprian 31.56
    13 Central_Greek 31.64
    14 Moroccan 32.07
    15 Algerian 32.51
    16 Mozabite_Berber 32.56
    17 Tuscan 33.01
    18 Italian_Abruzzo 33.81
    19 Greek_Thessaly 34.61
    20 Samaritan 35

    I1098_Anatolia_N_8288_ybp K13:

    # Population Percent
    1 East Med 45.08
    2 West Med 40.63
    3 North Atlantic 8.97
    4 Red Sea 5.32

    Distance to: I1098_Anatolia_N_8288_ybp
    22.97311254 Algerian_Jewish
    24.47130565 Italian_Jewish
    26.58189045 Libyan_Jewish
    26.65631820 Tunisian_Jewish
    27.07008127 Sephardic_Jewish
    28.57850066 South_Italian
    29.13031582 Tunisian
    29.26430590 Ashkenazi
    29.59806075 Sardinian
    29.81014760 Cyprian
    30.29211944 West_Sicilian
    30.62566244 East_Sicilian
    30.83162500 Algerian
    31.36723609 Mozabite_Berber
    31.55393319 Moroccan
    32.03641990 Central_Greek
    32.48080972 Samaritan
    34.38619636 Lebanese_Christian
    34.63761683 Italian_Abruzzo
    34.85238155 Tuscan
    36.08691037 Greek_Thessaly
    36.40802933 Egyptian
    36.57733178 Lebanese_Muslim
    36.65682474 Palestinian
    37.31814706 Syrian

    I3709_Greece_Peloponnese_N_5847_ybp

    # Population Percent
    1 East Med 43.55
    2 West Med 41.41
    3 North Atlantic 8.93
    4 Red Sea 4.14
    5 West Asian 1.97

    Distance to: I3709_Greece_Peloponnese_N_5847_ybp
    22.45078395 Algerian_Jewish
    24.05813376 Italian_Jewish
    26.42355956 Libyan_Jewish
    26.47565485 Tunisian_Jewish
    26.57188928 Sephardic_Jewish
    27.44467344 South_Italian
    28.06274755 Sardinian
    28.78758413 Ashkenazi
    29.03850375 Cyprian
    29.34399598 Tunisian
    29.34615648 West_Sicilian
    29.63578580 East_Sicilian
    30.90500607 Central_Greek
    30.98979025 Algerian
    31.38833382 Mozabite_Berber
    31.57754740 Moroccan
    32.39313816 Samaritan
    33.56366041 Italian_Abruzzo
    33.92225671 Tuscan
    34.22047779 Lebanese_Christian
    35.09980484 Greek_Thessaly
    35.95647369 Lebanese_Muslim
    36.79011824 Palestinian
    36.81858634 Syrian
    36.91122323 Egyptian
    Last edited by lockdownboredom; 07-30-2021 at 11:42 PM.

  2. #22
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    I fail to see the logic in claiming that the East-Med component has nothing to do with the Middle-East when among ancient individuals, it peaks in PPNB and Chalcolithic samples from the Levant, not the Mediterranean coast of Europe.


    Sample East Med Red Sea Baltic West Med West Asian South Asian Amerindian Northeast African Oceanian East Asian North Atlantic Sub-Saharan Siberian
    Jordan PPNB ► I1709 78.81 19.97 1.23 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
    Yehud IBA ► I7177 68.88 22.97 0 8.14 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10104 60.32 22.17 0 6.16 8.26 2.03 1.06 0 0 0 0 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1727 59.11 16.24 0 20.39 0 0 0 4.26 0 0 0 0 0
    Levant CA ► I1165 57.42 26.5 0 15.84 0 0 0 0 0.25 0 0 0 0
    Levant CA ► I1160 53.85 25.92 0 20.24 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1710 53.45 20.71 0 25.03 0 0 0 0.82 0 0 0 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1704 52.47 24.88 0 17.38 0 0 0 3.73 1.54 0 0 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1707 51.48 23.47 0 18.96 0 0 0 4.41 0.74 0.95 0 0 0
    Israel PPNB ► I0867 50.66 22.67 0 24.45 0 0 0 2.22 0 0 0 0 0
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10101 50.11 15.78 0 15.18 10.7 0 0 0 3.32 0 4.91 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1415 49.85 18.07 0 25.31 0 0 0 6.23 0 0 0.52 0.02 0
    Israel C ► I1177 49.76 25.03 0 23.72 0 0 0 1.49 0 0 0 0 0
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10092 48.31 22.86 0 11.99 12.56 0 0 0.48 0.7 1.76 1.34 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1700 47.63 13.39 0 35.24 0 0 0 3.73 0 0 0 0 0
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10270 47.27 18.7 0 12.94 16.43 2.21 0 0 2.46 0 0 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1414 47.16 17.6 0 29.63 0 0 0 4.96 0.65 0 0 0 0
    Yehud IBA ► I6922 47.05 19.39 0 15.12 11.25 0.61 6.46 0 0 0 0 0 0.11
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10264 46.8 19.51 0 9.52 20.42 0 0 1.84 1.92 0 0 0 0
    Yehud IBA ► I7180 45.75 25.19 0 11.8 14.35 0 0.8 0 1.79 0.32 0 0 0
    Megiddo IA ► I4517 44.82 19.37 0 12.06 17.85 0 0 1.46 1.33 0 3.11 0 0
    Greece Minoan Lassithi ► I0074 44.4 2.67 0 38.34 7.57 0 0 0 0.49 0.11 6.41 0 0
    Greece Minoan Lassithi ► I0073 43.64 0.31 0 39.66 7.91 0 0 0 0 0 8.48 0 0
    Peloponnese Neolithic ► I3708 41.42 4.63 0 44.42 0 0 0 0 0 0 9.52 0 0
    Greece Minoan Lassithi ► I0070 41.4 4.85 0 36.7 9.08 0 0 0 0.18 0 7.79 0 0
    Greece Minoan Lassithi ► I0071 40.74 4.59 0 37.28 7.46 0 0 0 0.26 0 9.67 0 0
    Jordan PPNB ► I1701 40.72 35.19 0 23.55 0 0 0 0 0.55 0 0 0 0
    Megiddo MLBA ► I10096 40.56 29.09 1.06 0 27.53 0 0 0 0 0 1.77 0 0
    Greece Minoan Odigitria ► I9128 40.38 8.44 0 34.7 0 0 0 0 0 0 16.48 0 0
    Peloponnese Neolithic ► I5427 40.36 5.15 0 50.02 0 0 0 0 0 0 4.47 0 0
    Greece Peloponnese N ► I2937 40.14 5.77 0 44.39 0 0 0 0 0 0 9.7 0 0
    Greece Peloponnese N ► I2937 all 39.54 6.84 0 43.38 0 0 0 0 0 0 10.23 0 0
    Greece Minoan Lassithi ► I9005 38.16 4.29 0 34.89 8.15 0 0 0 0 0 14.51 0 0
    Greece BA Mycenaean ► I9006 36.89 3.75 4.33 32.75 11.93 0 0.52 0 0.7 0 9.09 0 0.05
    Greece LN ► Klei10.SG 36.25 4.23 0 49.26 0 0 0 0 0 0.3 9.97 0 0
    Greece BA Mycenaean ► I9010 35.29 8.38 2.75 33.21 8.36 0 0 0 0.74 0 11.09 0.17 0
    Greece Minoan Odigitria ► I9129 33.87 8.31 0 36.99 3.08 0 0 0 0 0 16.02 1.72 0
    Greece BA Mycenaean ► I9041 33.77 3.64 0 30.94 9.98 0 0 0.03 0 0.37 20 0 1.26
    Greece BA Mycenaean Pylos ► I9033 25.79 3.12 2.28 31.31 12.2 0 0 3.36 0.74 1.36 19.36 0.49 0
    YDNA (P): R-Y33
    YDNA (P, maternal line): R-Y20756
    YDNA(M): E-Y6938

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  4. #23
    The majority of East Med in Europeans is derived from ANF, not Levantines is the point.

  5. #24
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    The component PEAKS among modern Levantines and Arabians on gedmatch. It doesn’t correlate exactly to some Neolithic component. In reality it likely includes high Levant_N affinity primarily and secondarily a lot of ANF and some Iran_N+CHG affinity. Those ancient Anatolian and Greek samples you posted have massively higher ANF than any living population while lacking WHG and lacking or being low in Levant_N. The West Med component, based off Sardinians and Basques, is associated with(NOT directly correlated with) Iberia_N, which had a fair amount of WHG-something that the Aegian area samples lack. The result is that the Greek/Anatolian samples compensate by scoring massive amounts of both East Med and West Med to make up for that deficiency.

    The Europeans scoring any substantial East Med are getting it due a connection with Levant_N ancestry mainly but in other cases also elevated ANF and Iran_N/CHG. Once you realize that ancient components dont line up exactly, it isnt that hard.

    Target: Basque_Spanish
    Distance: 5.3729% / 0.05372851
    57.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    22.0 WHG
    20.6 RUS_Progress_En

    Target: Iberia_N
    Distance: 4.6461% / 0.04646142
    86.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    14.0 WHG

    Target: Iberia_N
    Distance: 4.6380% / 0.04637960
    83.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    13.0 WHG
    3.4 Basque_Spanish

    Target: Sardinian
    Distance: 3.4672% / 0.03467208
    82.2 TUR_Barcin_N
    13.4 WHG
    4.4 RUS_Progress_En

    Target: GRC_Peloponnese_N
    Distance: 1.3464% / 0.01346409
    93.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    4.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    2.0 GEO_CHG

    Target: GRC_N
    Distance: 2.9424% / 0.02942398
    100.0 TUR_Barcin_N

    Target: GRC_Minoan_Lassithi
    Distance: 1.9983% / 0.01998345
    86.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    9.0 GEO_CHG
    4.4 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    Last edited by Cynic; 07-31-2021 at 12:40 AM.

  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cynic View Post
    The component PEAKS among modern Levantines and Arabians on gedmatch. It doesn’t correlate exactly to some Neolithic component. In reality it likely includes high Levant_N affinity primarily and secondarily a lot of ANF and some Iran_N+CHG affinity. Those ancient Anatolian and Greek samples you posted have massively higher ANF than any living population while lacking WHG and lacking or being low in Levant_N. The West Med component, based off Sardinians and Basques, is associated with(NOT directly correlated with) Iberia_N, which had a fair amount of WHG-something that the Aegian area samples lack. The result is that the Greek/Anatolian samples compensate by scoring massive amounts of both East Med and West Med to make up for that deficiency.

    The Europeans scoring any substantial East Med are getting it due a connection with Levant_N ancestry mainly but in other cases also elevated ANF and Iran_N/CHG. Once you realize that ancient components dont line up exactly, it isnt that hard.

    Target: Basque_Spanish
    Distance: 5.3729% / 0.05372851
    57.4 TUR_Barcin_N
    22.0 WHG
    20.6 RUS_Progress_En

    Target: Iberia_N
    Distance: 4.6461% / 0.04646142
    86.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    14.0 WHG

    Target: Iberia_N
    Distance: 4.6380% / 0.04637960
    83.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    13.0 WHG
    3.4 Basque_Spanish

    Target: Sardinian
    Distance: 3.4672% / 0.03467208
    82.2 TUR_Barcin_N
    13.4 WHG
    4.4 RUS_Progress_En

    Target: GRC_Peloponnese_N
    Distance: 1.3464% / 0.01346409
    93.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    4.2 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    2.0 GEO_CHG

    Target: GRC_N
    Distance: 2.9424% / 0.02942398
    100.0 TUR_Barcin_N

    Target: GRC_Minoan_Lassithi
    Distance: 1.9983% / 0.01998345
    86.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    9.0 GEO_CHG
    4.4 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    So you're saying that east med is similar to neolithic levantine farmers, and that Europeans lacking levant are scoring east med when in actuality they're west asian (Iran N) + ANF without steppe/or whg?

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Levantine_Viking View Post
    So you're saying that east med is similar to neolithic levantine farmers, and that Europeans lacking levant are scoring east med when in actuality they're west asian (Iran N) + ANF without steppe/or whg?
    The minor amounts of east med that pop up among east/central/northern Euros is from ANF. The east med in southern euros is more diverse it’s owed to Levant N and other west Asian components and excess ANF as well. Gedmatch is very complicated

  8. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Cynic View Post
    The east med in southern euros is more diverse it’s owed to Levant N and other west Asian components.
    Lol, what a load of crap.

    Eurogenes K13 Oracle results:

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 East_Med 24.39
    2 West_Med 20.69
    3 North_Atlantic 19.33
    4 Baltic 19.3
    5 West_Asian 12.68
    6 Red_Sea 2.66
    7 Amerindian 0.55
    8 East_Asian 0.4


    Target: LB_scaled
    Distance: 5.1673% / 0.05167282
    58.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    37.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    2.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    1.4 WHG
    0.6 Levant_PPNB

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  10. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by lockdownboredom View Post
    Lol, what a load of crap.

    Eurogenes K13 Oracle results:

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 East_Med 24.39
    2 West_Med 20.69
    3 North_Atlantic 19.33
    4 Baltic 19.3
    5 West_Asian 12.68
    6 Red_Sea 2.66
    7 Amerindian 0.55
    8 East_Asian 0.4


    Target: LB_scaled
    Distance: 5.1673% / 0.05167282
    58.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    37.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    2.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    1.4 WHG
    0.6 Levant_PPNB
    ANF can have natufian in of itself, albeit lower amounts no? Can you try subbing barcin_n with barcin0724 sample and see what happens? This barcin almost has no minor southern component

  11. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cynic View Post
    The minor amounts of east med that pop up among east/central/northern Euros is from ANF. The east med in southern euros is more diverse it’s owed to Levant N and other west Asian components and excess ANF as well. Gedmatch is very complicated
    Is the reason / correlation with some east med scores attributed to excess ANF due to minor natufian components that are naturally contained within Barcin?

  12. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Levantine_Viking View Post
    ANF can have natufian in of itself, albeit lower amounts no? Can you try subbing barcin_n with barcin0724 sample and see what happens? This barcin almost has no minor southern component
    Done. Levant_PPNB elevates at the expense of a poorer fit. As far as I am aware, Levant_PPNB is farmer admixed (overlapping elements).

    Target: LB_scaled
    Distance: 5.9452% / 0.05945152
    50.0 TUR_Barcin_N
    37.4 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    8.8 Levant_PPNB
    2.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    1.2 WHG

    Switching PPNB with Natufian

    Target: LB_scaled
    Distance: 6.0182% / 0.06018195
    56.6 TUR_Barcin_N
    36.2 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
    3.8 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    2.2 Levant_Natufian
    1.2 WHG

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