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Thread: Lebanon Y-DNA Distribution

  1. #1
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    Lebanon Y-DNA Distribution

    Unlike Cyprus, which I created a thread for here, there is plenty of data available on Lebanese Y-DNA haplogroups. However, though the papers do breakdown the haplogroup distribution by some religions and sects, I couldn’t find a comprehensive example of what I was looking for (e.g. I found nothing on the haplogroup distribution in Sunnis vs Shias).

    I have collated all the data found in Zalloua et al. 2008 and Haber et al. 2010, though I did not come to the exact same numbers the authors had. A few of the samples did not yield results, some I had to predict using Whit Athey’s Haplogroup Predictor (including only those which had a 95%+ chance of belonging to one haplogroup) and a few I omitted on the basis they were not of Lebanese origin – Assyrians and Armenians.

    This is the distribution I came to by sect:



    This is the distribution I came to by religion, including Catholics and other minor or unlisted denominations for the Christians, and a single non-specified Muslim sample:



    I excluded the Druze from the Muslims on the basis of their historical peculiarity.

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    Since "Other" far outsrips R2 and C, it would be useful to know how this breaks down. I would guess H must be a significant portion?

    A point:

    You appear not to be counting Greek Catholics, who are 5% of the population, and other Christians, who are an additional 3%.

    And another:

    By counting Shia and Sunni you are also counting many people not of Lebanese origins (Mamluks, Iranians, Gulf Staters, etc.). It would be less misleading to count everyone.
     

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    Other ancestral Y lines:

    E1b-M81 Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    E1b-V13 England
    I1-M253 Ireland
    I2-M423 Ukraine
    R1a-L176.1 Scotland
    R1b-L584 Syria/Turkey (Sephardi)
    R1b-L20 Ireland
    R1b-L21 (1)England; (2)Wales?>Connecticut
    R1b-L48 England
    R1b-P312 Scotland
    R1b-FGC32576 Ireland

    Other ancestral mtDNA lines:

    H1b2a Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    H6a1a3 Ukraine
    K1a9 Belarus (Ashkenazi)
    K1c2 Ireland
    V7a Ukraine

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    Quote Originally Posted by AJL View Post
    Since "Other" far outsrips R2 and C, it would be useful to know how this breaks down. I would guess H must be a significant portion?
    "Other" mostly consists of various types of E and R that can't be (or haven't been) categorised into any of the main branches I included in the table.

    Quote Originally Posted by AJL
    A point:

    You appear not to be counting Greek Catholics, who are 5% of the population, and other Christians, who are an additional 3%.
    The Greek Catholics and other minor Christian denominations are included in the Christian population of the second table. I didn't include the Greek Catholics in the first table as I could only find data for 40 individuals, and far fewer for the smaller Christian denominations.


    Quote Originally Posted by AJL
    By counting Shia and Sunni you are also counting many people not of Lebanese origins (Mamluks, Iranians, Gulf Staters, etc.). It would be less misleading to count everyone.
    The papers I cited above state that the individuals they sampled had confirmed at least three generations of paternal ancestry in Lebanon. The number of Armenians and Assyrians, who I discounted on the basis that it could reasonably be expected that their ancestry stems from outside Lebanon within recent times, would have been far too small to reasonably compare them to the religious denominations shown above.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mnd View Post
    The papers I cited above state that the individuals they sampled had confirmed at least three generations of paternal ancestry in Lebanon. The number of Armenians and Assyrians, who I discounted on the basis that it could reasonably be expected that their ancestry stems from outside Lebanon within recent times, would have been far too small to reasonably compare them to the religious denominations shown above.
    If I recall correctly, there were only 2 Assyrians in the Zalloua dataset(s). And, you are correct. Their ancestry would have most likely originated from outside Lebanon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mnd View Post
    "Other" mostly consists of various types of E and R that can't be (or haven't been) categorised into any of the main branches I included in the table.
    Thanks -- the E may be in part E1a or E2, while the R is probably R2 or R2 split with early R1b1 subclades such as V88. There may also be DE and F, both of which have been found in the Levant/West Asia. Even so that's not that large a margin of error for E1b or R1b -- much more so for R2, which could potentially be quite underreported.
     

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    Other ancestral Y lines:

    E1b-M81 Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    E1b-V13 England
    I1-M253 Ireland
    I2-M423 Ukraine
    R1a-L176.1 Scotland
    R1b-L584 Syria/Turkey (Sephardi)
    R1b-L20 Ireland
    R1b-L21 (1)England; (2)Wales?>Connecticut
    R1b-L48 England
    R1b-P312 Scotland
    R1b-FGC32576 Ireland

    Other ancestral mtDNA lines:

    H1b2a Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    H6a1a3 Ukraine
    K1a9 Belarus (Ashkenazi)
    K1c2 Ireland
    V7a Ukraine

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    I strongly suspect the coastal Levant must've been largely J2a during the Bronze Age, the Lebanese J2 frequencies seem to suggest this as well.
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    I strongly suspect the coastal Levant must've been largely J2a during the Bronze Age, the Lebanese J2 frequencies seem to suggest this as well.
    And then there is Zalloua's paper on J2a as a potential Phoenician trace, which he might have overstated though the idea does have merit.
     

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    Other ancestral Y lines:

    E1b-M81 Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    E1b-V13 England
    I1-M253 Ireland
    I2-M423 Ukraine
    R1a-L176.1 Scotland
    R1b-L584 Syria/Turkey (Sephardi)
    R1b-L20 Ireland
    R1b-L21 (1)England; (2)Wales?>Connecticut
    R1b-L48 England
    R1b-P312 Scotland
    R1b-FGC32576 Ireland

    Other ancestral mtDNA lines:

    H1b2a Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    H6a1a3 Ukraine
    K1a9 Belarus (Ashkenazi)
    K1c2 Ireland
    V7a Ukraine

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    Have you haplogroup of alawits?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mnd View Post
    I excluded the Druze from the Muslims on the basis of their historical peculiarity.
    Good work, but I don't understand the reasoning behind this statement. Seems biased.

    ie: European Christians have incorporated many Pre-Christian traditions into their religion, but they are still Christian.
    YDNA: R1b-Z220 (A7066+) (1800's Stepney, London(Bethnal Green), UK George Wood b. 1782
    maternal-grandfather YDNA: prob. I1 Gurr, George 1843, Feversham, Kent, England.
    maternal-grandmother YDNA: ? Beech, John Richard b. 1780, Lewes, England
    maternal-ggrandfather YDNA R1b-U106 Thomas, Edward b 1854, Sittingbourne, Kent
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Gould, John Somerset England 1800s.
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Scott, William Hamilton mdka Ireland(?) < 1800s

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    Which subclades of E1b1b are most commonly found among the Lebanese?

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