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Thread: Making hard questions

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    Making hard questions

    I just posted the exact same text youll read bellow on the Apricity but i would also like the opinion you people in here

    Why is everyone in all these forums so preoccupied with DNA tests when so many fundamental issues need questioning ? Is the out of Africa theory even remotely correct ? What about others that talk about multiple hominids ? Is the anthropological academia really doing research or do they have a political agenda like most other science fields nowadays and once you start making questions or make some actual findings you get crucified ? Since thats (the last question) true how reliable anything related to DNA testing is ? DNA testing started roughly 25 years ago how much of the info regarding autosomal tests is reliable ? How much anything related to haplogroups is true and how much can we rely to them ? How much do phenotypes corelate with genetics and can we just look at skulls and faces and guess someones haplo and autosomal composition (not really a hard question and i believe that yes we can but we need good pictures of individuals going back 2-3 generations to have a good idea) ? How do we know that those testing companies dont take our genetic information in order to use them in malicious ways ? After all all other big companies do take massive amounts of info in order to social engineer whole societies.I think we can have a good,polite and sober conversation

    Of course,to go back to the first question,i have been preoccupied with tests myself but a lot of questions started popping in my head in retrospective.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HunterKillerDrone View Post
    I just posted the exact same text youll read bellow on the Apricity but i would also like the opinion you people in here

    Why is everyone in all these forums so preoccupied with DNA tests when so many fundamental issues need questioning ? Is the out of Africa theory even remotely correct ? What about others that talk about multiple hominids ? Is the anthropological academia really doing research or do they have a political agenda like most other science fields nowadays and once you start making questions or make some actual findings you get crucified ? Since thats (the last question) true how reliable anything related to DNA testing is ? DNA testing started roughly 25 years ago how much of the info regarding autosomal tests is reliable ? How much anything related to haplogroups is true and how much can we rely to them ? How much do phenotypes corelate with genetics and can we just look at skulls and faces and guess someones haplo and autosomal composition (not really a hard question and i believe that yes we can but we need good pictures of individuals going back 2-3 generations to have a good idea) ? How do we know that those testing companies dont take our genetic information in order to use them in malicious ways ? After all all other big companies do take massive amounts of info in order to social engineer whole societies.I think we can have a good,polite and sober conversation

    Of course,to go back to the first question,i have been preoccupied with tests myself but a lot of questions started popping in my head in retrospective.
    If you're asking the question you need to provide counter arguments. Why do you think the out of africa theory is wrong and what do you suggest in it's place
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gentica277282 View Post
    If you're asking the question you need to provide counter arguments. Why do you think the out of africa theory is wrong and what do you suggest in it's place
    I believe its wrong because both genetic data and anthropological data show otherwise but the establisment chooses to brush them aside for their own reasons.The theory of multiple hominids developing in different environments is the most sound i have found and discussed with a real life anthropologist friend.

    This is a guy i subscribe to and consider very good at what hes doing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MKbT9YxLF4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3m991eC1G8&t=1048s

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    Quote Originally Posted by HunterKillerDrone View Post
    I believe its wrong because both genetic data and anthropological data show otherwise but the establisment chooses to brush them aside for their own reasons.
    I'm sure the folks at TA would accept such arguments, but conspiracy theories aren't welcome here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    I'm sure the folks at TA would accept such arguments, but conspiracy theories aren't welcome here.
    If its that much of a problem i wont talk about it anymore but i have to say this,those that are in positions of power dont work for the interest of the rest of us and havent been doing so for many years.The church used to promote and say that he Earth was flat and if you dared prove them wrong you were in danger.Its not much different now.People in academia are old and mostly parrot others before them so as they dont lose their place or because they dont know otherwise or because they serve another purpose.Those people will write books later on and people think their gods of infallible knowledge and that what they write is completely objective.My moto in life is "Question everything" and that ill continiou to do
    Last edited by HunterKillerDrone; 11-28-2022 at 03:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CopperAxe View Post
    Robert Sepehr
    Ive seen a couple of his videos and i agree with him so i said why not show him as an example.If his statements are that wrong please enlighten me

    Again theres no reason to get angry or become emotional.Were all here to learn and share our opinions and if certain opinions are silenced then whats the point of a forum ? I also dont claim to know everything but i considered it an interesting topic
    Last edited by HunterKillerDrone; 11-28-2022 at 03:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HunterKillerDrone View Post
    I just posted the exact same text youll read bellow on the Apricity but i would also like the opinion you people in here

    Why is everyone in all these forums so preoccupied with DNA tests when so many fundamental issues need questioning ? Is the out of Africa theory even remotely correct ? What about others that talk about multiple hominids ? Is the anthropological academia really doing research or do they have a political agenda like most other science fields nowadays and once you start making questions or make some actual findings you get crucified ? Since thats (the last question) true how reliable anything related to DNA testing is ? DNA testing started roughly 25 years ago how much of the info regarding autosomal tests is reliable ? How much anything related to haplogroups is true and how much can we rely to them ? How much do phenotypes corelate with genetics and can we just look at skulls and faces and guess someones haplo and autosomal composition (not really a hard question and i believe that yes we can but we need good pictures of individuals going back 2-3 generations to have a good idea) ? How do we know that those testing companies dont take our genetic information in order to use them in malicious ways ? After all all other big companies do take massive amounts of info in order to social engineer whole societies.I think we can have a good,polite and sober conversation

    Of course,to go back to the first question,i have been preoccupied with tests myself but a lot of questions started popping in my head in retrospective.
    I have done multiple tests with 23andMe, Ancestry, Dante Labs, Nebula, FTDNA (Big Y), and 10x Genomics. The WGS tests used both BGI and Illumina technology. Multiple family members (five individuals, three generations) have done multiple tests, a total of 14 WGS tests so far. One of the first things I do when I get a new test result is cross check the raw data against previous tests for the same individual (if available) and other family members. All the tests results have been reasonably consistent with each other: 23andMe, Ancestry and the WGS tests. I've been writing lots of code to process the fastq files, so I'm not completely relying on downstream analysis for WGS though I look at them and cross check, of course.


    Do you believe all those companies somehow conspired together to produce consistent results? BGI is Chinese and Illumina is American. There are plenty of reasons not to trust Chinese and American companies. However, the Chinese and Americans don't seem to be on the greatest of terms at the moment, but they are conspiring together on DNA?

    There are mind-boggling amounts of sequence data being generated and freely available for download at sites like ENA. Have all the laboratories uploading the data conspired together as well?
    Anyone can download that data and analyze it themselves. I do. As do quite a few other amateurs, including other members of this board.

    Or maybe the data is useable, but there's a problem with the analysis? Many laboratories publicly post their software and their workflow, for example Reich Lab.

    Or maybe there are issues with standard software packages like samtools? The source code is on github. I've downloaded, modified and rebuilt samtools myself.

    Science is a trial and error process. There are always mistakes being made and improvements needed. Science is a human endeavour and "to err is human". It is easy to say something might be wrong, of course something might be wrong, any sensible person assumes that.

    Unfortunately, actually doing science is also a lot of hard work.

    If people don't seem that interested in your critiques, it might in part be because you aren't showing them all the hard work you've put into it, with sufficient public disclosure of your methods and results to enable them to be independently evaluated.
    Last edited by pmokeefe; 11-28-2022 at 06:11 PM.
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    Here's a video from Chris Stringer, who very much does "look at skulls", he's a physical anthropologist, though in recent years he's been working with DNA as well.


    While in this section of the talk he says "let's look at Africa and our origins there" he goes on to say that we don't know where the common ancestor of Neanderthals and modern humans lived, it could have been Europe, Asia or Africa.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbsuzQA41wU&t=264s

    Here's a personal account by Chris Stringer of his role in the early days of the the Out of Africa Theory (that in the 1970s, was he was looking at skulls, this was long before DNA).
    Last edited by pmokeefe; 11-28-2022 at 07:58 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmokeefe View Post
    I have done multiple tests with 23andMe, Ancestry, Dante Labs, Nebula, FTDNA (Big Y), and 10x Genomics. The WGS tests used both BGI and Illumina technology. Multiple family members (five individuals, three generations) have done multiple tests, a total of 14 WGS tests so far. One of the first things I do when I get a new test result is cross check the raw data against previous tests for the same individual (if available) and other family members. All the tests results have been reasonably consistent with each other: 23andMe, Ancestry and the WGS tests. I've been writing lots of code to process the fastq files, so I'm not completely relying on downstream analysis for WGS though I look at them and cross check, of course.


    Do you believe all those companies somehow conspired together to produce consistent results? BGI is Chinese and Illumina is American. There are plenty of reasons not to trust Chinese and American companies. However, the Chinese and Americans don't seem to be on the greatest of terms at the moment, but they are conspiring together on DNA?

    There are mind-boggling amounts of sequence data being generated and freely available for download at sites like ENA. Have all the laboratories uploading the data conspired together as well?
    Anyone can download that data and analyze it themselves. I do. As do quite a few other amateurs, including other members of this board.

    Or maybe the data is useable, but there's a problem with the analysis? Many laboratories publicly post their software and their workflow, for example Reich Lab.

    Or maybe there are issues with standard software packages like samtools? The source code is on github. I've downloaded, modified and rebuilt samtools myself.

    Science is a trial and error process. There are always mistakes being made and improvements needed. Science is a human endeavour and "to err is human". It is easy to say something might be wrong, of course something might be wrong, any sensible person assumes that.

    Unfortunately, actually doing science is also a lot of hard work.

    If people don't seem that interested in your critiques, it might in part be because you aren't showing them all the hard work you've put into it, with sufficient public disclosure of your methods and results to enable them to be independently evaluated.



    Chinese and jewish american/european scientists conspiring together suposedly to indirectly promote race mixing and diversity, and destroy the white race (great replacement theory), this is some of the craziest most dangerous, disgusting and radioactive ideas many many many people that are atracted to genetic foruns subscribe to after too much exposure to them, here less because good administration and rules, banning the uncloseted ones, but in "The apricity" you can see the truth behind the people that spread these ideas clearly, as you can see with someone like Varg Vikernes.
    Some dont even want to accept that 96 - 99 % of theyr ancestors came from africa,( 100% of the monoparental ones) , and that this is a fact not a "woke" propagandism or nonsense conspiracy but merely the irony of human hystory and the dimension of unrealism in racial theories.
    It is simply ridiculous the amount of effort and secrecy from genetic companies it would take to hide that Y dna is fake, they made it all up LOL, actualy they hire professional spies that are simultaneously excepicionaly good genealogists or flat out investigators, it is just hylarious.Do they persecute dissidents ? traitors?lol
    Many are selective and try to separate what scientific discoveries that are fake and promote the great replacement conspiracy , what is a lie , that is what atacks their fragile identities entirely based on Looks.
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