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Thread: Y-DNA N Bianbian of Shandong as a major ancient bearer of Japanese-like DNA

  1. #1

    Y-DNA N Bianbian of Shandong as a major ancient bearer of Japanese-like DNA

    The Y-DNA N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374) Bianbian individual of the earliest Houli culture pottery 9500 years ago on Shandong peninsula contains one of the largest shares of the Japanese-like DNA among ancient samples.

    Yellow River ancestry—ancestry associated with populations in the Yellow River region, with the oldest individual sampled to date represented by a 9,500-year-old individual from the lower reaches of the Yellow River in Shandong, i.e. Bianbian [68]. Populations associated with this ancestry greatly impacted most present-day East and Southeast Asians.
    A genetic history of migration, diversification, and admixture in Asia
    Melinda A. Yang
    Department of Biology, University of Richmond, Richmond, VA, USA
    http://www.pivotscipub.com/hpgg/2/1/0001/html

    It can be seen from the model below, that Bianbian (nEastAsian_N) of Shandong, resided on the substratum similar to the Amur AR19K sample (Y-DNA C2, mtDNA G) rather than on the substratum of Devil's Gate-Yumin-Jomon Ikawazu (the northern component of Jomon Ikawazu).
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60982222009289




    Interestingly, as testified by another later Houli culture sample Boshan who is also Y-DNA N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374) in "Human population history at the crossroads of East and Southeast Asia", at least ancestors of Boshan, Dushan (a Miao-Yao-like branch of Y-DNA O) and Tianyuan should share a small amount of DNA with mtDNA M populations ca.40000 years ago which should only be related to other similar Homo Sapiens of that period, but not to some 120000-130000-year-old populations. This limitation means that modern O and N haplogroups are not related to mtDNA M people of Jomon-like Minatogawa1+ BachoKiro-like mtDNA M Qoyet116 from Europe + archaic mtDNA M71 variant in Longlin + some Mamanwa (the highest Denisovan in the world), that is, modern O and N haplogroups did not derive from the above-mentioned cluster of populations devised by Japanese investigators (see below).



    Ancestors of modern O and N haplogroups might interact with some of representatives of the mentioned cluster of populations, but only much later in the Palaeolithic. There was a different set of mtDNA M populations with whom ancestors of Dushan and some ancestors of Tianyuan interacted the same as with whom some ancestors of Y-DNA N Bianbian and Boshan similarly interacted, and those populations' interaction with Native American ancestors (mtDNA D1) was negligible and was mediated by some other later populations than those populations 40000 years ago. Thus, Y-DNA N Bianbian and Boshan were not related to Native Americans and can acquire some of their component only via the AR19K-like substratum.
    Last edited by East-Asia; 03-16-2023 at 06:29 PM.

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  3. #2
    Agriculturalists had a near complete replacement of the male lines, before being affected by an expansion by the Jomon hunter gatherers, both on the Korean peninsula and the Japanese archipelago.

    Boisman had more ancestry from the northern areas of the Amur watershed. While the slightly later-on the timescale and geographic northern Devil's Gate/Chertovy Vorota had increased ancestry from the southern perimeters of Northeast Asia and the approximately 14000BP samples found in Zhaodong.
    Last edited by alienation; 03-18-2023 at 09:05 AM.

  4. #3
    Also the Boisman sample with high Jomon ancestry I3354 is not to be typically viewed as Amur + Jomon, the Jomon admixture was already influenced by a Yayoi like population, in the middle or intermediate between that coastal stretch

    The Nivkh as well as historical or archaeologically excavated samples could be applied with the same analyses as well.
    Last edited by alienation; 03-18-2023 at 07:14 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by alienation View Post
    Agriculturalists had a near complete replacement of the male lines, before being affected by an expansion by the Jomon hunter gatherers, both on the Korean peninsula and the Japanese archipelago.

    Boisman had more ancestry from the northern areas of the Amur watershed. While the slightly later-on the timescale and geographic northern Devil's Gate/Chertovy Vorota had increased ancestry from the southern perimeters of Northeast Asia and the approximately 14000BP samples found in Zhaodong.
    Nothing indicates that Japanese and Korean O1b2 ought to be "agriculturalists".

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  7. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by MNOPSC1b View Post
    Nothing indicates that Japanese and Korean O1b2 ought to be "agriculturalists".
    I actually agree with this. I think O1b2 was hyperlocalized to the Korean peninsula which developed agriculture somewhat late. Tentative continental agriculturalist elements were likely associated with other patrilineages.

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  9. #6
    Even if the clade is hyperlocalized, it can further be amplified through agriculture based on the success of a once relatively small group of farmer kinsmen, and may likely be the reason it is not commonly found in traces as north as the Liaodong Peninsula.

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  11. #7
    Also this might be of interest to some:
    According to the abstract for a doctoral dissertation by Vladimir Nikolaevich Kharkov, a sample of 52 Nivkhs (Нивхи) from Sakhalin Oblast (Сахалинская область) contained the following Y-DNA haplogroups: 71% (37/52) C-M217(xC-M77/M86, C-M407), 7.7% (4/52) O-M324(xO-M134), 7.7% (4/52) Q-M242(xQ-M346), 5.8% (3/52) D-M174, 3.8% (2/52) O-M175(xO-P31, O-M122), 1.9% (1/52) O-P31, and 1.9% (1/52) N-M46/M178.[65]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nivkh_...ation_genetics

  12. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by East-Asia View Post
    The Y-DNA N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374) Bianbian individual of the earliest Houli culture pottery 9500 years ago on Shandong peninsula contains one of the largest shares of the Japanese-like DNA among ancient samples.

    Yellow River ancestry—ancestry associated with populations in the Yellow River region, with the oldest individual sampled to date represented by a 9,500-year-old individual from the lower reaches of the Yellow River in Shandong, i.e. Bianbian [68]. Populations associated with this ancestry greatly impacted most present-day East and Southeast Asians.
    A genetic history of migration, diversification, and admixture in Asia
    Melinda A. Yang
    Department of Biology, University of Richmond, Richmond, VA, USA
    http://www.pivotscipub.com/hpgg/2/1/0001/html

    It can be seen from the model below, that Bianbian (nEastAsian_N) of Shandong, resided on the substratum similar to the Amur AR19K sample (Y-DNA C2, mtDNA G) rather than on the substratum of Devil's Gate-Yumin-Jomon Ikawazu (the northern component of Jomon Ikawazu).
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60982222009289




    Interestingly, as testified by another later Houli culture sample Boshan who is also Y-DNA N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374) in "Human population history at the crossroads of East and Southeast Asia", at least ancestors of Boshan, Dushan (a Miao-Yao-like branch of Y-DNA O) and Tianyuan should share a small amount of DNA with mtDNA M populations ca.40000 years ago which should only be related to other similar Homo Sapiens of that period, but not to some 120000-130000-year-old populations. This limitation means that modern O and N haplogroups are not related to mtDNA M people of Jomon-like Minatogawa1+ BachoKiro-like mtDNA M Qoyet116 from Europe + archaic mtDNA M71 variant in Longlin + some Mamanwa (the highest Denisovan in the world), that is, modern O and N haplogroups did not derive from the above-mentioned cluster of populations devised by Japanese investigators (see below).



    Ancestors of modern O and N haplogroups might interact with some of representatives of the mentioned cluster of populations, but only much later in the Palaeolithic. There was a different set of mtDNA M populations with whom ancestors of Dushan and some ancestors of Tianyuan interacted the same as with whom some ancestors of Y-DNA N Bianbian and Boshan similarly interacted, and those populations' interaction with Native American ancestors (mtDNA D1) was negligible and was mediated by some other later populations than those populations 40000 years ago. Thus, Y-DNA N Bianbian and Boshan were not related to Native Americans and can acquire some of their component only via the AR19K-like substratum.
    Closely related to the Bianbian and Boshan samples on the paternal line here Actually Bianbian cannot be considered at the early Neolithic Houli culture stage yet, but a predecessor of the later Boshan and Xiaojingshan samples which do indeed belong to the Houli culture stage are also closely related with the same Y-Haplo N1b1-CTS582.

    Actually, I am not too sure why Japanese is being portrayed as 100% Northern East Asian in this study, unless modern Japanese are being used as the reference base for Northern East Asian component here? We all know the Japanese were formed through a particularly complex tripartite origins including that of the Kofun, Yayoi and Jomon.

    It is interesting that these ancient samples had a particularly significant or major impact on the DNA development of modern day East Asian populations, but Y-Haplogroup N1b1-CTS582 is very rare today, only accounting for barely 1 to 2% of modern East Asian males.
    Y-DNA haplogroup: N-M231-Z4762-F2905-Z4784-Y23789-Y139167-MF28233
    N1b1
    Bianbian, Shandong Province, China: 9500 ybp
    Houli Culture, Boshan, Shandong Province, China: 8200 ybp
    Houli Culture, Xiaojingshan, Shandong Province, China: 7800 ybp
    Lower Xiajiadian Culture, Erdaojingzi, Inner Mongolia, China: 4000 ybp

    MTDNA: R11b

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  14. #9
    Bianbian pottery remains already resembled the Houli culture pottery, that is why I have written "the earliest Houli culture pottery 9500 years", rather than simply "Houli culture".
    As far as Admixture models go, Bianbian is likely to have a tiny trace of Afanasievo-like component (ANE?), but Boshan does not have this component, though both Bianbian and Boshan should belong to the same branch such as N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374). So Afanasievo-like/ANE-like component should not be considered to be the common part of Shandong N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374) population ancestry, but should only be limited to Bianbian, meaning that the substratum component of Bianbian, who was found in the remote area in the mountains, was microblade-producing, as microblades are likely to be connected to the ANE. The newest study on Tibetans supported that Bianbian received an AR19K ancestry, though this feature of Bianbian is in common with Shimao_LN (Han-related). Probably in case of Bianbian (who has a small Afanasievo-like component) it would mean that AR19K substratum interacted with microblade-producing ANE as some microblade settlements were reported from Shandong. However, the ANE-like component is not in Boshan (another y-dna N-CTS582(xY24397, xY6374)), meaning that Boshan and Bianbian were incoming adstratum initially without ANE.

    Quote Originally Posted by talljimmy0 View Post
    It’s still quite speculative, until samples representing the “Coastal Ghost” are found, and these could be buried anywhere in Korea or deep in the Yellow Sea.
    What is speculative? In any case, "coastal ghost component" which reached Devil's Cave did not leave traces of pottery artifacts which would be similar to influences of more southern mainland populations such as Xianrendong on Northern populations such as Bianbian. It is believed in China that the characteristics of Xianrendong pottery are different from the characteristics of the earliest Jomon pottery. So if the earliest Jomon pottery were the doing of "coastal ghost", it would be in any case of different origin than the Houli pottery which arose under the Xianrendong-like influence.
    Last edited by East-Asia; 03-19-2023 at 05:07 PM.

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  16. #10
    It’s still quite speculative, until samples representing the “Coastal Ghost” are found, and these could be buried anywhere in Korea or deep in the Yellow Sea.

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