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Thread: Flag Request Thread

  1. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Haha
    Ha ha. You.

    This is a thread intended to suggest flags be added to the site, not to insult anyone's ethnicity or political ideals. I can't politely say go away with your meaningless, uneducated, irrelevant comment, but please.

    Someone actually liked this person's post? Do any mods here speak English?

    edit: The video included in my flag request is not mine. It is copyrighted and I own no rights to any of the material included within, it is not my property. As I understand it I posted it well within the guidelines of YouTube video sharing, and this is the direct link to the video on that site: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_vj6miIOcY

    I am not privy to those behind the New California movement, nor do I espouse their cause one way or another on this site or in this thread. I included the video as it has discourse within it that describes the creation of a flag quite succinctly, the narrator describes the various parts of a flag and its/their meaning. Its very educational and presented in an entertaining manner.

    There. Onward. For someone to attack and attempt to discredit a benign effort to have a flag included on this site is reprehensible. It's basically an affront to Anthrogenica's policy to recognize the people who use DNA testing to find out who they are and where they're from, where they live and how, why, and when they got there. I am not venting, but for a post to appear here and not only not get deleted by a moderator, but to have a person "like" it is simply not in keeping with the philosophy of genetic testing and its related issues.

    A post like the one which I am referring to can dash the hopes, dreams, and spirits of those who wish a better and/or different life. It's just not a casual comment, there's obvious ill-will and intent behind it. This is not the forum for that, that despicable type of slander belongs elsewhere.
    Last edited by curiousII; 03-24-2018 at 05:29 AM. Reason: wanted to
    "Bid me discourse, I will enchant thine ear..."

  2. #222
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    @curiousII

    Look, I'm not going to pretend I know exactly what your political ideologies are. However, thinking about it rationally, why would anyone suggest adding specific flags (especially for non existent states) unless they had some intent to use them? You noted that you aren't "privy" to the New California movement nor "do you espouse their cause" in one way or another. Perhaps, it's just me but that seems a bit farfetched.

    Anyways, the video is irrelevant to my comments. It's great that it is educational and presented in a professional or entertaining manner. However, I wasn't directing my comments toward it but the concept of "New California" in general. You call me out for "discrediting an effort to have a flag included on the site." That was not my intent. It was to attack the entire concept of New California as a political movement. The entire idea to have New California secede from California is a very political right wing movement. You have insinuated my comments are reprehensible and an affront to anthrogenica's "policy to recognize the people who use DNA testing to find out their origins and ancestral roots, etc." That couldn't be further from the truth. New California isn't about people finding "their roots or anything remotely similar." It is a deeply political movement to break away the rural and more conservative counties of California from the the more urban and left-wing coastal counties.

    To sum it up, the concept of New California is:

    1. Deeply offensive due to its secessionist nature to a proud Californian such as myself.
    2. Has a very right-wing political ideology attached to it. Not bad in itself of course but it mean it is a political flag. It is not about people finding their ancestral origins, which distinguishes it from "freedom fighting liberation flags from the old world."
    3. To myself and many others, the movement has some deep rooted racial tension to it as well, which can partially be seen through the demographics (see first link) of the counties that would break away from the liberal coastal areas of the current California.

    So yes, I do have ill-will and intent behind my comments. The very nature of "New California" is repulsive and offensive to my very existence.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/02/u...servative.html

    http://www.newsweek.com/new-californ...liberal-783117

    https://www.gq.com/story/new-california-is-a-bad-idea

    edit: That's my opinion of the flag and the movement it represents. I won't object to the moderators adding it if they feel it is suitable to do so.
    Last edited by Sapporo; 03-24-2018 at 09:54 AM.

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  4. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    @curiousII

    Look, I'm not going to pretend I know exactly what your political ideologies are
    Thank you. Apparently you cannot understand them anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    To sum it up, the concept of New California is:

    1. Deeply offensive due to its secessionist nature to a proud Californian such as myself.
    No, I am a Californian.
    .
    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post

    3. To myself and many, the movement has some deep rooted racial tension to it as well...
    This is not the proper venue to voice your misconceptions. Please stop it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post

    So yes, I do have ill-will and intent behind my comments. The very nature of "New California" is repulsive and offensive to my very existence.


    edit: That's my opinion of the flag and the movement it represents. I won't object to the moderators adding it if they feel it is suitable to do so.
    OK, then, that's all you have to say. You obviously fail to understand how deeply corrupted the state's judicial system is and you, yourself, are blind to the depredations and atrocities that true Californians are subjected to on a daily basis. New California's flag is a symbol of freedom, liberty, and equality. I would be proud to have it on.this website.
    "Bid me discourse, I will enchant thine ear..."

  5. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousII View Post
    Thank you. Apparently you cannot understand them anyway.
    Your welcome. Apparently, you don't understand or care for mine either.

    No, I am a Californian.

    This is not the proper venue to voice your misconceptions. Please stop it.
    That's great. For someone who doesn't privy the movement or espouse the cause, you are quite well informed about it. However, I will note that you don't speak for most Californians who live in the urban coastal counties. I am more representative of the majority of the state's population. Regardless of my "misconceptions", we both know the vast majority of the state would vote against it.

    OK, then, that's all you have to say. You obviously fail to understand how deeply corrupted the state's judicial system is and you, yourself, are blind to the depredations and atrocities that true Californians are subjected to on a daily basis. New California's flag is a symbol of freedom, liberty, and equality. I would be proud to have it on.this website.
    Thanks for laying out a summary of your thoughts. You've appear to have established which side of the political spectrum you land on and possibly implied that you do indeed support the movement. "True Californians" is a highly inflammatory designation.

    Anyways, if the mods want to add the flag, I will not protest it.
    Last edited by Sapporo; 03-24-2018 at 10:54 AM.

  6. #225
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    It's a disgrace we don't have a Jolly Roger -im related to captain Kidd ! ;0)

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  8. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Your welcome.
    grammcow.jpg

    Yes, I see.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    However, I will note that you don't speak for most Californians who live in the urban coastal counties. I am more representative of the majority of the state's population.
    I grew up in Northern California before a lot of the rivers were dammed up for Southern California water. I still have some photos of what it used to look like.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Regardless of my "misconceptions", we both know the vast majority of the state would vote against it.
    Vote? What?



    DF27 isn't from Iberia, you know.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    "True Californians" is a highly inflammatory designation.
    Hmm, wait a second...


    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    So yes, I do have ill-will and intent behind my comments. The very nature of "New California" is repulsive and offensive to my very existence.
    That's not inflammatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Anyways, if the mods want to add the flag, I will not protest it.
    Kind of you, thanks.
    "Bid me discourse, I will enchant thine ear..."

  9. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousII View Post
    grammcow.jpg

    Yes, I see.
    Thank you for correcting my grammar. You were even nice enough to attach a "meme." So, considerate.


    I grew up in Northern California before a lot of the rivers were dammed up for Southern California water. I still have some photos of what it used to look like.
    Define Northern California. Are you referring to the SF Bay Area or rural upstate California (which sometimes includes Sacramento)? Two very distinct areas in terms of demographics and culture.


    Vote? What?

    DF27 isn't from Iberia, you know.
    On the creation of "New California." The flag and support for it are based primarily on political ideology. Not people trying to find out more about their ancestry or roots.

    I didn't ask for your Y-DNA history. Nor does DF27 have anything to do with the rural counties of California.


    That's not inflammatory?
    In very different ways. One would be seen as inflammatory against your opinion, thoughts and views if you support the concept of "New California." The other can be seen as inflammatory attack against oneself as an individual person (an attack on one personally) or even in a racial sense. I'd compare it to the concept of "True or Real American" that is sometimes thrown around.

    https://newsone.com/3769552/new-cali...m-urban-areas/

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/201...racy-Theorists
    Last edited by Sapporo; 03-24-2018 at 07:09 PM.

  10. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Define Northern California. Are you referring to the SF Bay Area or rural upstate California (which sometimes includes Sacramento)?
    Google Maps says the middle of California is roughly around North Fork and Italian Bar. You'll see Italian Bar is almost due East of San Francisco. San Francisco is mid-California; Northern California is when you get up around Sacramento in the Central Valley, or maybe Santa Rosa or Bodega Bay going up along the coast.

    Now I get to show you my baby pictures. This is across the dirt road where I grew up. You'll see the rolling hills behind the cows and me. That was in Sacramento County. Visualize land like that pretty much all over that end of the state 60-70 years ago. Then Google places like Sunrise Mall in Citrus Heights, you'll see what it is now.

    meandcow.jpg

    That wasn't my family's property, ours was on the other side of the camera. Just an example; it's hard to imagine all that's gone now. Folsom Dam was the cause of all this specific land to disappear under asphalt, there weren't any words like "environmentalist" or "ecologist" that you'd hear much back then. Progress is good and all, but the way that the northern end of the state was demolished to funnel water down to the southern end has turned disastrous.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    On the creation of "New California." The flag and support for it are based primarily on political ideology. Not people trying to find out more about their ancestry or roots.

    I didn't ask for your Y-DNA history. Nor does DF27 have anything to do with the rural counties of California.
    Then it's not racism like you alluded to. OK, I stand corrected. But DF27 doesn't have origins in Iberia. Any influx of immigrants into the state from the south who may have that haplogroup can rest assured that they're not indigenous to Iberia. Their ancestors were migratory there, also. Me, I'm Z2573 which is sans Basque Marker. I believe this specific haplogroup is the Missing Link. That works into the conversation somehow.

    So I'll stop now. I'm not part of the New California movement and I don't wish to damage it by misquoting or misinterpreting things here, here being quite inappropriate for this discussion. But I do need to ask: Do you do this with many people who propose flag inclusions, or just me? Am I your first? Is there something specific about the New California flag that set you off? From what I read it's not definite yet, and the fellow in the video doesn't sound like he likes it too much. Maybe they'll adopt another one before the Stars and Stripes gets another star. All those new flags, must be costly. They'll probably raise taxes to cover expenses.

    Anyhow, the thought's nice but personally I think the new flag should include the California bear. There's history behind the bear and it's been symbolic of the state for quite a few years now. Would you be happier if the new flag had a bear or two on it?
    Last edited by curiousII; 03-25-2018 at 07:28 AM.

  11. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by curiousII View Post
    Google Maps says the middle of California is roughly around North Fork and Italian Bar. You'll see Italian Bar is almost due East of San Francisco. San Francisco is mid-California; Northern California is when you get up around Sacramento in the Central Valley, or maybe Santa Rosa or Bodega Bay going up along the coast.
    Well, that clears things up. I understand San Francisco and the Bay Area are geographically Central California. I do live in the SF Bay Area after all. However, in common nomenclature and in day to day conversation, they are typically considered Northern California. When speaking of the divide between NorCal and SoCal, the SF Bay Area + the Greater Sacramento Area are often put up against greater Los Angeles + San Diego as the major metropolitan areas representative of the two regions. Rural upstate California ("geographically" Northern California) and eastern California are often ignored due to being sparsely populated in comparison.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_California
    Now I get to show you my baby pictures. This is across the dirt road where I grew up. You'll see the rolling hills behind the cows and me. That was in Sacramento County. Visualize land like that pretty much all over that end of the state 60-70 years ago. Then Google places like Sunrise Mall in Citrus Heights, you'll see what it is now.

    That wasn't my family's property, ours was on the other side of the camera. Just an example; it's hard to imagine all that's gone now. Folsom Dam was the cause of all this specific land to disappear under asphalt, there weren't any words like "environmentalist" or "ecologist" that you'd hear much back then. Progress is good and all, but the way that the northern end of the state was demolished to funnel water down to the southern end has turned disastrous.
    Nice picture. However, this discussion is entirely off-topic (thread is meant for requests only; which I am at fault for). Anyways, I'm not old enough to understand or really empathize with how Sacramento was previously. However, my maternal family are all from the greater Sacramento area and were originally farmers. If I go back far enough, I believe we have had relatives here in NorCal for nearly 90-100 years. I've driven through and stayed in areas of Yuba County (Yuba City and Olivehurst) many times. It's mostly still quite rural from what I recollect. Most of them (1st and 2nd cousins) still reside within the region. It's just my immediate family in the Bay Area and one 1st cousin. As for developments such as the Folsom Dam, I can understand your discontent toward it but it's all quite before my time. It's quite difficult to relate.

    Then it's not racism like you alluded to. OK, I stand corrected. But DF27 doesn't have origins in Iberia. Any influx of immigrants into the state from the south who may have that haplogroup can rest assured that they're not indigenous to Iberia. Their ancestors were migratory there, also. Me, I'm Z2573 which is sans Basque Marker. I believe this specific haplogroup is the Missing Link. That works into the conversation somehow.
    I'll agree to disagree. It's an extremely political discussion and this isn't the forum for that. The Y-DNA stuff is cool but this isn't the sub-forum for it either.

    So I'll stop now. I'm not part of the New California movement and I don't wish to damage it by misquoting or misinterpreting things here, here being quite inappropriate for this discussion. But I do need to ask: Do you do this with many people who propose flag inclusions, or just me? Am I your first? Is there something specific about the New California flag that set you off? From what I read it's not definite yet, and the fellow in the video doesn't sound like he likes it too much. Maybe they'll adopt another one before the Stars and Stripes gets another star. All those new flags, must be costly. They'll probably raise taxes to cover expenses. Anyhow, the thought's nice but personally I think the new flag should include the California bear. There's history behind the bear and it's been symbolic of the state for quite a few years now. Would you be happier if the new flag had a bear or two on it?
    This is the first time. I've never objected to adding any flag previously. My issue with the New California flag isn't the flag in of itself (aesthetics or otherwise). It's with part of the driving political ideology and movement behind the flag. Well, I'm not a fan of secession from California obviously, it's not the primary factor behind my opposition to the flag. Anyways, I've said my piece. I don't think there is any benefit to continuing this discussion (inappropriate place as the thread is simply for requests; not discussion). The moderators will add the flag if they see fit. It's best to leave it at that.
    Last edited by Sapporo; 03-25-2018 at 08:51 AM.

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  13. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapporo View Post
    Anyways, I've said my piece. I don't think there is any benefit to continuing this discussion (inappropriate place as the thread is simply for requests; not discussion). The moderators will add the flag if they see fit. It's best to leave it at that.
    I agree. This was something meant for private messages or The Lounge or something. But I'm still not knowledgeable enough about it to put any input into anything.
    "Bid me discourse, I will enchant thine ear..."

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