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Thread: Tri-Racial Isolate Groups of the US

  1. #11
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    There is an interesting thread at 23andme related to this topic. https://www.23andme.com/you/communit...8/#most_recent

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Human View Post
    There is an interesting thread at 23andme related to this topic. https://www.23andme.com/you/communit...8/#most_recent
    Unfortunately, people not registered with 23andMe cannot view this. Also, the link address must be bad. It does not direct to a thread when I log in.

    What is the name of it, I probably saw this?

  3. #13
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    In case the link does not work, it is titled, "To those with a tiny % of African admixture.: Have you been able to identify your black ancestor(s)?" in General Ancestry.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Human View Post
    In case the link does not work, it is titled, "To those with a tiny % of African admixture.: Have you been able to identify your black ancestor(s)?" in General Ancestry.
    Okay thanks.

    The gist of it is:
    "My ancestry painting is 99.81% European and 0.19% African, but I haven't been able to identify my black ancestor(s)."

    If you're a member of 23andme
    https://www.23andme.com/you/communit...8/#most_recent
    Last edited by AppalachianGumbo; 09-17-2012 at 10:46 PM.

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    My distant African ancestry is somewhere down the line on one of these two branches. They are my great-grandparents. It was my great-grandfather (below) that is called "Black Dutch" and Cherokee. Although this is a suggestive clue that the ancestry might be from his side, I cannot say for certain which branch is the source because only my grandmother, their daughter, was tested. They have long been deceased.
    ggrandparents.jpg

    and this is my great-great-grandmother (his mother), whom it is said had Cherokee ancestry.
    gggrandmother.jpg


    [I talked about this branch of my family before back on dna-forums a few years back already, but now that we have a new site, I am posting about this again here. I apologize if you have already seen my discussion about my genealogical brick wall before there.]
    Last edited by Human; 09-20-2012 at 05:23 PM.

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  7. #16
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    I had a conversation with a friend of mine. I post this on 23andMe but will post here as well.

    Me:
    I wanted to ask you. There is a hot debate on 23and me about Melungeons. Was this a real group of people? Roberta Estes did a study on them and was wondering what your thoughts were if you read her study. The halpogroup study and the surname.

    His answer:
    Oh there is definitely a distinct mixed-heritage population in the upper Southern Highlands that has Mediterranean and northern African traits. I don't think that the scientists doing the DNA study of the Melungeons took enough samples. There are too many differences between each of the Melungeon family lines.

    Me
    Do you think about their origins?

    His answer:
    This is purely speculative on my part, but I suspect that individual Melungeon family lines have varying heritages. Most likely they are a varying mix of runaway British bond servants from Virginia, runaway African & Native American slaves from Virginia & NC, local Indians who intermarried with European & African refugees, descendants of the 80 Moorish galley slaves who escaped the attempted Spanish colony on Sapelo Island, GA in 1526 and descendants of the many Sephardic Jewish gold & silver miners who lived in the Georgia & North Carolina Mountains in the 1600s.
    Last edited by AppalachianGumbo; 09-21-2012 at 10:36 PM.

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  9. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Human View Post
    My distant African ancestry is somewhere down the line on one of these two branches. They are my great-grandparents. It was my great-grandfather (below) that is called "Black Dutch" and Cherokee. Although this is a suggestive clue that the ancestry might be from his side, I cannot say for certain which branch is the source because only my grandmother, their daughter, was tested. They have long been deceased.
    ggrandparents.jpg

    and this is my great-great-grandmother (his mother), whom it is said had Cherokee ancestry.
    gggrandmother.jpg


    [I talked about this branch of my family before back on dna-forums a few years back already, but now that we have a new site, I am posting about this again here. I apologize if you have already seen my discussion about my genealogical brick wall before there.]
    Great pics of your family. I was never on DNA Forums. Thanks for sharing. The one is very hard to see. It looks almost like a *watermark* design. Did you test with 23andMe? Has any Asian/Amerindian surfaced in your or families results? Hard to judge by their pheno. People can look very European and be 1/4 Indian.

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    We tested with 23andme. I tested with them and dnatribes. At 23andme, my grandmother, daughter of the couple above, scored mostly European, but with 7 blocks (totaling 2%) of African in the ancestry painting. I think this is real, but was surprised to see little clues of any native ancestry. She did have a small block under Dr. McD's tool, but this was well within the possible "noise" range. Also, I did have one STR allele via dnatribes, when looked at individually, appeared *very* native to the Americas, but there appears to be little confidence in dnatribes STR allele data. There was another, but it was more widespread from Central Asia to the Americas, and even lower scores in E. Europe. Basically then, an acceptable level of confidence is there that we have African ancestry down the line in this branch, but if there is native ancestry at all in the family, it is probably *much* older.

    My maternal grandmother's 23andme results from Dr. McD's BGA are posted in that respective thread, as are two other grandparents' results. Another semi-interesting little fact is that "Black Dutch" ancestry was also mentioned by my maternal grandfather (results available in Dr. McD's BGA thread) down his maternal branch, of which little is known. His paternal branch has French, Basque, and Irish ancestry. My grandfather *also* had a very small amount (<1%) of "African" in his ancestry painting. Considering this reference to "Black Dutch" ancestry, I think that is somewhat interesting as well, though this amount is probably well within the range of possible "noise." Of course, I first thought my small amount was "noise" too, until I had my grandmother genotyped.

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  12. #19
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    @Human

    I'm not very familiar with *Black Dutch.* What area did this group inhabit? What was their known genetic make-up?

  13. #20
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    short answer: SE USA

    It was used by a number of people/groups, but I think it was probably more of a colloquialism. I think it was probably used as a way of saying, "Yeah... I am a little darker-featured, but I am just a darker-featured European(white)." This is purely anecdotal, but this is the way it was used by my grandmother. When I asked what it meant, she said she didn't really know the ancestry. Quoting my grandmother here, she said, "We just called him [her father] that because he was somewhat dark and had black eyes and hair."

    Wikipedia summarizes "Black-Dutch" fairly well... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black-Dutch
    Last edited by Human; 09-30-2012 at 01:18 AM.

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