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Thread: ZZ11

  1. #1
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    ZZ11

    I noticed that Alex Williamson still has ZZ11 above U152 and DF27 on his Big Tree. I seem to recall Razyn posting about this somewhere, but I can't find the thread. So my question for anyone who knows, is this placement holding up? Are the results coming in for BigY kits for DF27 and U152, confirming this placement?

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  3. #2
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    ZZ11_1 = ChrY:22286799 C->G. BigY and FGC results in YFull P312 group shows positive results for all U152, DF27 and some P312* results and negative for L21 and DF99. There is one exception - this is one DF27 with ZZ11_1 negative: http://www.yfull.com/share/yreport/7...02a8e2a6b21c3/
    Y-DNA: R-Y14088 (ISOGG: R1b1a1a2a1a2b1c2b1a1a)
    mtDNA: J1c1i (J1c1 + 7735G and 8848C) Extras: 198T 12007A 16422C 16431A

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  5. #3
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    Y-DNA (P)
    U152>L2>Z49>Z142>
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    I may have posted this before but here is my stats for Z11_1

    ChrY position: 22286799 (+strand)
    Reads: 323
    Position data: 257C 66G
    Weight for C: 0.793926959376
    Weight for G: 0.206073040624
    Probability of error: 0.29143128889 (0<->1)
    Sample allele: C
    Reference (hg19) allele: C
    If I recall, Z11_1 is odd in that you are looking for is some G percentage as opposed to the typical 90% or higher. In my case I have 79.4% for the reference allele C, and 20.6% reads for the derived G allelle.
    Y dna continued: Z142>Z150>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
    80% Brit/Ir-ish
    35% English/14% Welsh/15% Scot/11% Ulster Scot/5% Irish
    14% German/3% Scandi-Finn/2% French & Dutch/1% India

    Be more concerned about seeking the truth than winning an argument.

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  7. #4
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    My cousin is R1b-Z49* (Z49 < L2 < U152) , and YFull says he has:
    ---
    Sample: #YF02497 (R-L2)
    ChrY position: 22286799 (+strand)
    Reads: 396
    Position data: 396C
    Weight for C: 1.0
    Probability of error: 0.0 (0<->1)
    Sample allele: C
    Reference (hg19) allele: C

    ---

    Note that Z49 was a no-call for him, so YFull lists him merely as R-L2. FTDNA's Sanger sequencing found him Z49+ .
    Last edited by lgmayka; 03-30-2015 at 11:11 PM.

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  9. #5
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    ZZ11, being upstream from U152 and DF27, but not L21, mirrors a geographical and possibly linguistic divide between continental and insular P312. Many scholars are of the opinion that Celtic languages are divided between Continental Celtic and Insular Celtic. Although on the continent, the Breton language is Insular, having been brought to Brittany by Britons fleeing the Saxon invasions. So this also fits the scenario as Brittany is largely L21, one of the few such places in continental Europe.
    Last edited by breckenheimer; 04-04-2015 at 10:39 PM.
    R1b-P312-DF7+ DF17+ CTS7768+ FGC14124+
    13-23-15-11-11-14-12-12-11-13-15-30
    Earliest known Y ancestor: Hesse, Germany 1705

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  11. #6
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    Since Billy Webb started a thread about ZZ11, and I've posted about it two other places but not here, I think I'll cite one that cites the other (if you care enough to look) and then go do something more concrete, like restore an old mandola I keep putting off.

    http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...ll=1#post79456

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  13. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by razyn View Post
    Since Billy Webb started a thread about ZZ11, and I've posted about it two other places but not here, I think I'll cite one that cites the other (if you care enough to look) and then go do something more concrete, like restore an old mandola I keep putting off.

    http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...ll=1#post79456
    This may be a silly remark, but Akhenaten and Tut were a long time ago, so maybe looking at their STRs (finally released, after all these years) one might surmise that they were ZZ11. https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post742955
    Last edited by razyn; 02-02-2021 at 04:50 PM.

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  15. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by razyn View Post
    This may be a silly remark, but Akhenaton and Tut were a long time ago, so maybe looking at their STRs (finally released, after all these years) one might surmise that they were ZZ11. https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....l=1#post742955
    A very wild turn of events!!!

  16. #9
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    U152>L2>Z49>Z142>
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    Maybe this is old news but it’s new to me (or I lost those brain cells)

    Apparently DF27 and U152 have a brother under ZZ11

    BY140446. 6 samples total of which 3 are from Scotland, 1 from France, 1 from N. Ireland, 1 unknown origin.
    Y dna continued: Z142>Z150>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
    80% Brit/Ir-ish
    35% English/14% Welsh/15% Scot/11% Ulster Scot/5% Irish
    14% German/3% Scandi-Finn/2% French & Dutch/1% India

    Be more concerned about seeking the truth than winning an argument.

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  18. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Maybe this is old news but it’s new to me (or I lost those brain cells)

    Apparently DF27 and U152 have a brother under ZZ11

    BY140446. 6 samples total of which 3 are from Scotland, 1 from France, 1 from N. Ireland, 1 unknown origin.
    Here is a link to the P312** thread where Goldenhind posted in post#211 about the discovery of BY140446, however, I don't think at that time it was recognized as being below ZZ11.

    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....-DF99-)/page22

    When I ran a Google search on it, the website Genetic Homeland shows it being a child of ZZ11.

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