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Thread: British Isles DNA Project by County Mapped for U152

  1. #1
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    British Isles DNA Project by County Mapped for U152

    Over the last couple of days I've been going through the British Isles DNA Project by County https://www.familytreedna.com/public...ame=ycolorized
    It seemed like a good place to find over a 1000 random y-dna samples from all over the British Isles. Plus they were already organized by county.


    Methodology:
    1. I set the page size to 2260 so that I was only looking at the county data

    2. I counted the total number of green haplogroups per county i.e. only those confirmed by SNP testing. There was a total 1040 green entries.

    3. I used the FTDNA haplotree to search for all U152 SNPs on the British Isles DNA Project by County. Of the 1040 there were 37 U152 entries...or 3.6% of the total number.

    4. I put all this data into a spreadsheet and divided the total U152 number for each county by the total number of green entries (confirmed SNPs).

    5. I initially created a county map of Great Britain showing the U152 percentage for each county, but found this unsatisfactory as it gave a misleading impression e.g. 1 county had 2 samples and 1 was U152, another has 4 samples and 2 were U152...so both of these counties were showing 50% U152. With more samples the percentage of U152 would most likely drop significantly.

    6. So I went back and geographically grouped counties together so that each group of counties had 32 to 60 confirmed SNP entries per group. I tried to keep historic regions in the same group of counties e.g. East Anglia counties in one region, Essex/Sussex (Historically Saxon areas) in another. As there were so few samples in the Welsh counties (only 32), I put them all in the same region.

    Here is the resulting map. EDIT: Updated.

    British-Isles-Regions-U152-2.jpg

    What I find interesting about these results is the total lack of U152 samples in Kent...which is usually shown on maps as the highest region for U152 in Britain. Of 28 confirmed SNPs in Kent, none were U152.
    Next door in East and West Sussex there were 12 confirmed SNPs. Again none were U152. So out of 40 entries in Southeast England, none were U152. Only when I added Essex to the group was there one U152 sample out of 58 total for the Southeast county group.

    Another surprise was how strong U152 was in Southeast Scotland, and to a lesser extent the North of England. Maybe this is a Roman soldier impact from the days of the Hadrian and Antonine walls? Maybe, but it could be much earlier with the arrival of Bell Beaker or Celts. The Brythonic kingdoms of Rheged and Strathclyde ruled these areas until the 8th and 11th Century respectively.
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...s_Wall_map.png

    Also, U152 was not present in the Belgae tribal area or the "Civitas of the Belgae" in Southern England...no U152 samples out of the 21 entries from the Isle of Wight, Hampshire, and Wiltshire

    Here are the counties that had at least one U152 sample. Keep in mind the small sample sizes when looking at the percent of U152.
    County/Total Confirmed SNPs/Total U152/Percent of U152
    Kinross 2 1 50.0%
    Westmorland 4 2 50.0%
    Roxburghshire 7 2 28.6%
    Berwickshire 5 1 20.0%
    Durham 12 2 16.7%
    Fife 6 1 16.7%
    Midlothian 12 2 16.7%
    Renfrewshire 6 1 16.7%
    Cambridge 7 1 14.3%
    Glamorgan 7 1 14.3%
    Buckinghamshire 15 2 13.3%
    Tipperary 10 1 10.0%
    Donegal 11 1 9.1%
    Hertfordshire 12 1 8.3%
    Lincolnshire 24 2 8.3%
    Nottinghamshire 12 1 8.3%
    Norfolk 28 2 7.1%
    Devonshire 29 2 6.9%
    Cork 17 1 5.9%
    Cheshire 18 1 5.6%
    Essex 18 1 5.6%
    Lancashire 37 2 5.4%
    Cornwall 19 1 5.3%
    Yorkshire N/Riding 22 1 4.5%
    Suffolk 23 1 4.3%
    Yorkshire W/Riding 26 1 3.8%
    Somerset 32 1 3.1%
    Middlesex 50 1 2.0%
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 04-29-2015 at 02:10 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Another surprise was how strong U152 was in Southeast Scotland, and to a lesser extent the North of England. Maybe this is a Roman soldier impact from the days of the Hadrian and Antonine walls? Maybe, but it could be much earlier with the arrival of Bell Beaker or Celts.
    Southeast Scotland was heavily Angle, as was Bernicia and Northumbria - Bede's country (northeastern England).

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    Might be better to split up Yorkshire and look at East Yorkshire which should be much more Anglian than the remainder.

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    Quote Originally Posted by falconson1 View Post
    Southeast Scotland was heavily Angle, as was Bernicia and Northumbria - Bede's country (northeastern England).
    Yes but so was East Anglia and York but they don't have the high percentages like SE Scotland and the North of England .

    Also it was Westmorland on the west side that was a U152 hotspot (albeit with a very small sample size). If I recall this was an old Brittonic holdout against kingdom of Northumbria. Then there is Cornwall and Devon which had very little Angle migration...until modern times.

    As is, the results strike me as pre Anglo-Saxon for the most part...but I will keep an open mind on other theories.

    I have to because before compiling the data I assumed the old Belgae stomping grounds in south central and southeast England would have had the highest percentages. Currently that is not the case. Maybe that will change when a large scale study comes out.
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 04-28-2015 at 02:22 PM.
    Y DNA line continued: Z142>Z12222>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
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    That's weird, especially considering the fact that East Anglia (Norfolk in particular) is often seen as a U152 hotspot.
    מכורותיך ומולדותיך מארץ הכנעני אביך האמורי ואמך חתית
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    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peccavi View Post
    Might be better to split up Yorkshire and look at East Yorkshire which should be much more Anglian than the remainder.
    None of the 9 confirmed SNPs from East Riding Yorkshire were U152. There was one U152 sample out of 22 for North Riding and 1 out of 26 for West Riding
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 04-28-2015 at 02:29 PM.
    Y DNA line continued: Z142>Z12222>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    That's weird, especially considering the fact that East Anglia (Norfolk in particular) is often seen as a U152 hotspot.
    I don't want to give the wrong impression, Norfolk by itself does have twice the percentage (7.1 vs 3.6%) compared to the British Isles as a whole .
    Y DNA line continued: Z142>Z12222>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
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    Here is the county level results. Just keep in mind the small sample sizes in some counties will show an under/over representation of the actual figures i.e. use with caution.

    Also attached an updated version of the map from the first post in this thread. I just changed the colors and updated the map key.

    British-Isles-U152-2.jpg
    British-Isles-Regions-U152-2.jpg
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 04-29-2015 at 02:13 AM.
    Y DNA line continued: Z142>Z12222>FGC12378>FGC12401>FGC12384
    35% English, 26% Scot/Ulster Scot, 14% Welsh, 14% German, 5% Ireland, 3% Nordic, 2% French/Dutch, 1% India
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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    ...Westmorland on the west side that was a U152 hotspot (albeit with a very small sample size). If I recall this was an old Brittonic holdout against kingdom of Northumbria.
    I found this on wiki about this area that was once part of the Brittonic Kingdom of Rheged.
    Rheged (Welsh pronunciation: [ˈr̥ɛɡɛd]) is described in poetic sources as one of the kingdoms of the Hen Ogledd ("Old North"), the Brittonic-speaking region of what is now Northern England and southern Scotland, in the Early Middle Ages...Its inhabitants spoke Cumbric, a Brittonic dialect closely related to Old Welsh...Rheged was annexed by Northumbria, some time before AD 730...After Rheged was incorporated into Northumbria, the old Cumbric language was gradually replaced by Old English, Cumbric surviving only in remote upland communities...In the 10th century, after the power of Northumbria was destroyed by Viking incursions and settlement, large areas west of the Pennines fell without warfare under the control of the British Kingdom of Strathclyde...The area of Cumbria remained under the control of Strathclyde until the early 11th century when Strathclyde itself was absorbed into the Scottish kingdom.
    The above mentioned Kingdom of Stathclyde overlapped the high concentrations of U152 in Southern Scotland. It lasted until sometime between 1018 and 1054.
    Strathclyde ...was one of the early medieval kingdoms of the Britons in the Hen Ogledd, the Brittonic-speaking parts of what is now southern Scotland and northern England...The kingdom developed during the post-Roman period. It is also known as Alt Clut, a Brittonic term for Dumbarton Castle, the medieval capital of the region. It may have had its origins with the Damnonii people of Ptolemy's Geography...
    Map of Westmoreland, Cumbria, and Stathclyde

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom...ence.areas.png
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    RB1_subclades.jpg

    Don't know how much credence can be attached to this map but if true, then U152 looks more likely to be Roman Legionaires!!

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