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Thread: What do you think Jesus looked like?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny ola View Post
    Read carefully what I wrote. The church didn't change, it is the priests and clergy who changing things. Most youngers have not interest to church and to religion in general but priests and clergy doing things even worse with their corrupted attitude and with their wrong policies in many subjects(foreign policies especially/refugee theme) . It is not the west or protestantism, but that Greeks year by year have become more secular and that many people(with open mind) seeing church as a company/business etc. I am really wondering why the haven't paid a big amount of our dept yet... Their wealth is maybe bigger than our GDP!!!
    The ecclesia is not the clergy but the people. They have changed, too. I cannot stand this one sided bashing of the clergy, it’s not that black and white all. And the Orthodox Church has not the role to pay the debts of the society, you have western expectations of what the task of the orthodox church is. On the other hand, the church administration should not act like the church is their company or something of course, it’s true that such impressions destroy the trust in the church. But again, when people think of the church the clergy comes into their mind but that’s simply and clearly not right. These Are the very basics of orthodoxy. The church is no state like institution where you go as a believer or customer in order to get something. You go to the church to experience an alternative way of existing
    Last edited by Chatzianastasoglou; 12-15-2019 at 11:21 AM.

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonahst View Post
    Oh, don't worry, I didn't think you actually endorsed any sort of BHI narrative , but the Cesare Borgia theory is most popular and most frequently cited by them or others with similar ideas.

    The thing is, Cesare Borgia didn't have blonde hair or blue eyes, he had brown hair and brown eyes. While it's possible that his image had some influence on Renaissance depictions of Jesus due to his relationship with Leonardo da Vinci, that same general image of a light skinned bearded man with long brown hair predates Borgia by 1100 years. It might have originated in Rome (which we now know was primarily inhabited by East Mediterranean peoples), but it was at least used in the Near East by the 6th century.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depiction_of_Jesus

    I believe some of my earliest posts on this forum were in this thread, long before I did any DNA tests or posted regularly, and I stated that I think he probably looked like modern Levantine Christians or Samaritans, but I agree with others here that East Med and Levantine populations are often indistinguishable, more than most other genetically-distinct groups.

    Anyway, I think the depictions of Jews made by Jews in the Levant during the Roman period are probably our best estimate for what Jesus and other Judeans looked like at the time.













    On a separate but related note, I just stumbled upon this image that I hadn't seen before. I always assumed that the red-headed David was a European innovation, but this is apparently from Gaza (?). Does anybody know anything more about this?

     
    Hehe no worries all is good

    I don't think that it's far fetched to assume the historical David could've had red hair, I mean this feature exists among Samaritans, and wasn't Ramses the 2nd Red headed? At least that was the colour of his hair when his mummified body was found

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  4. #153
    Some Judeans believed that he was a Samaritan (John 8:48), so he probably looked like them.

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  5. #154
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    I wouldn't make any phenotypic inferences from modern Samaritans because they are so inbred. The pigmentation of the Lebanese is probably the most reliable indication of what most Levantines in general were like pigmentationally at the time of Jesus. Of course, we don't have any known Judaean genomes from the period yet so there might be some surprises; some, many, or maybe even most of them might already have had significant Aegean DNA like Romaniotes do. If we do see that, it might be an urban phenomenon. I actually doubt that Jesus would have been genetically different from the Roman era Levantines we have on record already, but it's a possibility.
    Last edited by Michalis Moriopoulos; 06-25-2020 at 03:13 AM.
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    slap a beard on Jamie Farr.

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    Since it was so long ago I don't think will have a clear answer until the debate around Jesus's genome is settled. I mean, people are speculating about his phenotype based on his mother but what about his father? Did Jesus have a paternal haplogroup? Did he only have his mothers DNA or did he also have half Godly DNA? Or was it just some special genome? Some people also say he had human father and their ancestry would be a factor.

    It's said Jesus was completely human and completely god. Well humans have a complete genome so that's needs to be taken into account. A phenotype can significantly change based on half a persons genome and he could of had an unexpected look.

    At most I would say he could of looked somewhat similar to these people.

    Since they are the last people who spoke the language of Jesus they probably have the closest phenotype to him since that indicates they likely mixed less than other people in the region and show a more basal west asian/semitic phenotype.
    Last edited by uflakmoon; 06-25-2020 at 05:53 AM.

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    Well he likely wasn’t a blonde and blue eyed Nord and he almost certainly wasn’t a Bantu. Probably similar to modern day Levantine individuals, like a Lebanese or a non phenotypically Arabid shifted looking Palestinian. Of course a lot of people want “god to look like them” why is why both white and black centerists have these silly theories.

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    This is a general warning to please read the ToS regarding the posting of images and associated phenotype classification.
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  13. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Michalis Moriopoulos View Post
    I wouldn't make any phenotypic inferences from modern Samaritans because they are so inbred. The pigmentation of the Lebanese is probably the most reliable indication of what most Levantines in general were like pigmentationally at the time of Jesus. Of course, we don't have any known Judaean genomes from the period yet so there might be some surprises; some, many, or maybe even most of them might already have had significant Aegean DNA like Romaniotes do. If we do see that, it might be an urban phenomenon. I actually doubt that Jesus would have been genetically different from the Roman era Levantines we have on record already, but it's a possibility.
    Ancient jews were also very inbred, and Henryk Szpidbaum found samaritans and sephardic to be very similar phenotypically and yes Lebanon is probably the country that most resembles ancient Judea/Palestina although again there is no much difference between the muslim/christian counterparts, druze come as the outliers being noticeably light eyed than both.
    Regarding aegean ancestry, in the new testament there are some people that are of jew and greek ancestry like Timothy whose father was greek, or jews who have greek names and not records of hebrew/aramaic names like Andrew the apostle(so possibly they had greek ancestry) and for sure greek converts like Jason.
    I think ITA_Rome_Imperial:RMPR42 was probably a jew since he matches with lebanese christians, samaritans, palestinians, druze and karaites.
    Do you have the link or results of the roman era levantines? I I would appreciate if you can send them to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by uflakmoon View Post
    Since it was so long ago I don't think will have a clear answer until the debate around Jesus's genome is settled. I mean, people are speculating about his phenotype based on his mother but what about his father? Did Jesus have a paternal haplogroup? Did he only have his mothers DNA or did he also have half Godly DNA? Or was it just some special genome? Some people also say he had human father and their ancestry would be a factor.

    It's said Jesus was completely human and completely god. Well humans have a complete genome so that's needs to be taken into account. A phenotype can significantly change based on half a persons genome and he could of had an unexpected look.
    We're looking at this from a secular perspective: Jesus as a fully human historical figure of Jewish descent, not as some kind of demigod. Even if you did accept the latter as a matter of faith (which I personally do not), the Gospels make it obvious that he wasn't anything special and looked no different from his disciples.
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