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Thread: Are you a Gypsy? Would you like to know?

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by valteague View Post
    Evon Thanks again for your insight. You are kind to take the time to share your knowledge.

    I will do some research on the groups you mentioned.
    I do know my grandmothers people had very dark coloring and black hair. Sometimes confused with mixed with African American so maybe that can help me narrow the potential groups down.
    If you or anyone else have any other thoughts, I would be very happy to hear it.
    It depends on the country where she lived, in the colonies as an example, semi-nomadic groups often did mix with African and Native groups. If these features were from a Romani source I would have seen it in your matches, there is no doubt about that, unless you happen to have inherited none of the Romani DNA from her, which is unlikely if her connection was that recent.

    As an example, people with a single Romani ancestor from the early 1800's, will usually have multiple Romani matches from all over Europe and Asia..

  2. #72
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    That helps guide me. I’m going to take look at the other options you mentioned.
    Much much thanks!

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by valteague View Post
    That helps guide me. I’m going to take look at the other options you mentioned.
    Much much thanks!
    If you tell me the country she came from I can try to guide you some more...?

    Here as an example, is a nice documentary about one of the largest semi-nomadic groups of Europe, known as the Yenish people:
    http://www.cultureunplugged.com/docu...ng-und-Jenisch

    I suspect Norwegian Travelers are related to them, although I have not been able to confirm that...


    You can look here for some basic information:

    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itiner...oups_in_Europe
    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagrancy_(people)
    Last edited by evon; 01-13-2018 at 05:20 PM.

  4. #74
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    Romani England Hungary United States of America Luxembourg Bohemia
    yes, I am very new to self investigation, I still am not sure what to set calculators at, still unsure of what im looking at, but I will read on and look deeper, again Thank you.

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by GBouse View Post
    yes, I am very new to self investigation, I still am not sure what to set calculators at, still unsure of what im looking at, but I will read on and look deeper, again Thank you.
    My advice, forget admixture calculators in relation to Romani ancestry, focus on matches and try to triangulate them in an effort to figure out where the various segments "come from".. All Romani match each other, just like all Ashkenazi, Icelanders, Fins etc match others within their respective ethnic group.

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  7. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by therrien.joel View Post
    Behar would signify jewish ancestry from what I understand of that, so no that would not.

    BTW, welcome to the H2a2a1 mtDNA club. That might be a clue for you, not necessarily indicating Romani, but it isn't common in western europe.
    Thanks t.joel, this is what im dealing with ,which is making me bald,

    MDLP K23b Admixture Proportions

    MDLP K23b

    Kit Number: A026519



    Population Chr--> 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22
    Amerindian - - - - 0.7 - 1.6 2.0 0.1 1.6 0.2 2.4 2.6 - - 2.0 1.2 - - - - 0.4
    Ancestral_Altaic 8.6 4.5 3.8 4.5 6.4 4.7 1.4 3.7 2.2 5.0 2.0 2.2 1.3 10.3 9.4 10.9 9.8 3.8 8.1 7.1 3.6 -
    South_Central_Asian 8.8 4.2 6.5 4.1 2.4 - 3.7 2.8 5.4 8.4 5.4 8.0 - - - - - 12.9 2.3 4.4 8.6 1.9
    Arctic 1.1 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    South_Indian - - - - 3.7 - - - 2.3 - - - - 3.2 - - - 0.2 6.4 0.9 - -
    Australoid 0.4 0.6 1.6 1.6 - - 0.4 0.4 0.3 - - - - - 0.3 - - 1.1 - - 0.5 0.3
    Austronesian - - - - - 2.8 0.9 - - - 0.3 - - - - - - - - 3.3 - -
    Caucasian 21.9 18.6 14.1 20.5 19.0 23.7 22.1 27.9 22.3 20.4 24.6 19.2 25.6 27.7 24.7 20.1 25.6 11.9 7.6 20.3 29.0 29.5
    Archaic_Human - 1.0 - - - - - 1.4 0.2 - - - - 0.9 0.1 - 0.4 - - - - 0.2
    East_African - 1.2 - - - - - 1.6 - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    East_Siberian 1.1 - 0.4 1.5 - - 2.5 - - - - 1.0 - - - - - - 0.1 - - -
    European_Early_Farmers 17.7 28.0 32.8 27.5 29.7 23.9 29.6 23.7 27.0 24.5 23.0 33.9 32.5 32.4 26.2 28.0 30.4 38.2 42.1 23.5 22.8 11.2
    Khoisan - - 0.4 0.1 - - - 0.1 - - - 0.6 - - 1.7 0.8 - - - - - -
    Melano_Polynesian - 4.2 0.9 0.7 - - 0.2 - - 1.3 2.1 - - - - - - 0.1 - - - -
    Archaic_African - - - - 0.4 - - - - - - - - - 0.6 0.1 - - - - - -
    Near_East 1.2 0.3 - - - 0.6 - 4.3 4.7 4.1 3.1 2.9 3.1 2.3 0.7 - - - 5.4 10.7 - 0.2
    North_African - - 4.2 5.7 9.4 6.0 - 2.1 - 2.8 0.2 - - - 2.9 - - 1.7 - - - 4.2
    Paleo_Siberian 2.1 - 0.7 - - 0.5 - - - - - - - - - - 0.2 - - - - -
    African_Pygmy - - - - - - - 1.1 0.5 - - 1.3 - - - - 2.5 - 1.6 - - -
    South_East_Asian - - - - - 1.4 - 0.5 - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    Subsaharian - - - - - - - 1.2 0.8 - - - - - - 1.0 - - - - - -
    Tungus-Altaic - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    European_Hunters_Gatherers 37.1 37.3 34.5 33.9 28.5 36.3 37.6 27.3 34.2 31.9 39.1 28.4 35.0 23.2 33.3 37.1 29.9 30.0 26.4 29.6 35.5 52.1
    Number of SNPs eval: 9178 9548 7958 6204 6266 6193 5234 5433 4918 6318 5745 5851 4132 3982 3745 3858 3083 3584 1856 3238 1761 1710

  8. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by lukaszM View Post
    No, it only means samples are taken form Behar study. But only in some calculators authors indicated it. Romanians and Hungarians from Behar are ethnic Romanians and Hungarians.
    Jews from those countries in this study are Austrohungarian_Jews and Romanian_Jews

    And Romanian isn't Romani.
    Thanks Lukas.
    Still wondering if the small % of South Indian in admixture percentages show something.

    "Jtest Oracle

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 97.9% Orcadian + 2.1% AJ @ 0.93
    2 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% GE @ 1.03
    3 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Kalash @ 1.06
    4 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Balochi @ 1.06
    5 98.8% Orcadian + 1.2% Brahui @ 1.06
    6 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% TR @ 1.07
    7 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Armenian @ 1.07
    8 98.8% Orcadian + 1.2% Burusho @ 1.07
    9 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% Lezgin @ 1.07
    10 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% IR @ 1.09
    11 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Kurdish @ 1.09
    12 99% Orcadian + 1% Sindhi @ 1.09

    EUtest Oracle

    Population
    SOUTH_BALTIC 12.84
    EAST_EURO 11.78
    NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO 27.62
    ATLANTIC 28.96
    WEST_MED 10.32
    EAST_MED 2.23
    WEST_ASIAN 5.36
    MIDDLE_EASTERN -
    SOUTH_ASIAN 0.68
    EAST_AFRICAN -
    EAST_ASIAN -
    SIBERIAN 0.20
    WEST_AFRICAN -

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 75.7% IE + 24.3% West_&_Central_German @ 0.62
    2 71.1% IE + 28.9% NL @ 0.67
    3 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% GE @ 0.77
    4 98.3% Orcadian + 1.7% TR @ 0.8
    5 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% Armenian @ 0.81
    6 98.6% Orcadian + 1.4% Brahui @ 0.83
    7 98.3% Orcadian + 1.7% Lezgin @ 0.83
    8 98.6% Orcadian + 1.4% Balochi @ 0.83
    9 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% IR @ 0.84
    10 98.5% Orcadian + 1.5% Kurdish @ 0.84
    11 98.6% Orcadian + 1.4% Assyrian @ 0.86
    12 97.4% Orcadian + 2.6% Tuscan @ 0.87
    13 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Kalash @ 0.88
    14 98.7% Orcadian + 1.3% Mandean @ 0.89
    15 98.2% Orcadian + 1.8% GR @ 0.89
    16 85.3% Orcadian + 14.7% NL @ 0.9
    17 69.3% IE + 30.7% English @ 0.9
    18 98.1% Orcadian + 1.9% South_Italian_&_Sicilian @ 0.9
    19 98.8% Orcadian + 1.2% Burusho @ 0.9
    20 98.9% Orcadian + 1.1% Sindhi @ 0.91

    (see spoliers for my other results)
    Perhaps @evon can jump in here. My Gedmatch is M972977

    Quote Originally Posted by evon View Post
    My advice, forget admixture calculators in relation to Romani ancestry, focus on matches and try to triangulate them in an effort to figure out where the various segments "come from".. All Romani match each other, just like all Ashkenazi, Icelanders, Fins etc match others within their respective ethnic group.
    Is there a shared list of their IDs? I get an insane amount of matches unless I set minimum CM to 14 or more. And then they turn out to be pretty close in generations and miss known distant relatives...

    My
    Last edited by Askye; 01-13-2018 at 10:46 PM.

  9. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Askye View Post

    (see spoliers for my other results)
    Perhaps @evon can jump in here. My Gedmatch is M972977

    Is there a shared list of their IDs? I get an insane amount of matches unless I set minimum CM to 14 or more. And then they turn out to be pretty close in generations and miss known distant relatives...

    My
    You just have to know the matches by memory, very little enthusiasm for such lists (that is why I say that I only take a quick look, because I search for specific people that most Romani match, mostly due to their high level of Romani DNA etc).. But like I said before, if you match one person on a "Romani related DNA segment", you will match a bunch of others of Romani ancestry on the same segment, so Romani matches never come on ones, but in 5, 10's etc...

    I took a look, but I didnt see any Romani matches...

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  11. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by evon View Post
    You just have to know the matches by memory, very little enthusiasm for such lists (that is why I say that I only take a quick look, because I search for specific people that most Romani match, mostly due to their high level of Romani DNA etc).. But like I said before, if you match one person on a "Romani related DNA segment", you will match a bunch of others of Romani ancestry on the same segment, so Romani matches never come on ones, but in 5, 10's etc...

    I took a look, but I didnt see any Romani matches...
    Interesting, thank you.
    I wonder what that small % of Pakistan and South Indian admixture in calcs is from then......

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  13. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Askye View Post
    Interesting, thank you.
    I wonder what that small % of Pakistan and South Indian admixture in calcs is from then......
    as someone in the same situation i would still question it.
    i also have proven gypsy roots which could easily have romani in it.
    MyHeritage: 95.1% Ireland Scotland Wales, 3.6% Finland, 1.3% Middle East
    Geneplaza K29: 62.8% Orkney Isles Scotland French English 25.2% Belarus Ukraine, 10.8% Basque Spain, 1.1% Karitiana Surui Quechua
    Eurogenes K36: Hidden Content
    23&me: 90% Irish, 7% Broadly North West European, then Italian, Scandinavian, Yakut, Broadly South European and West African
    Wegene: 2.64% Indian, 63.98% Hungarian, 33.33% French

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