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Thread: Viking DNA research bothers anti-racism lunatic fringe activists ,what next ?

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    Viking DNA research bothers anti-racism lunatic fringe activists ,what next ?

    Viking DNA research raises eyebrows among Normandy anti-racism activists

    Anti-racism activists raised concerns about British research being carried out as the DNA of residents from Normandy in northern France began to be collected on Monday in search of Viking heritage

    DNA research in the search of Viking origins sparks racism concerns
    Around a hundred volunteers are giving DNA samples to academics at the University of Leicester, who are trying to find descendants of the Vikings who invaded what is now Normandy in the 9th century.

    “The aim is to learn more about the intensity of the Scandinavian colonisation in the 9th and 10th centuries in the Cotentin Peninsula, ” said senior history lecturer Richard Jones of the University of Leicester.

    “That includes trying to find out whether the colonisers kept to themselves or married amongst the locals,” he added.

    The French volunteers have been chosen because they have surnames that are of Scandinavian origin or that have been present in France since at least the 11th century. They also qualify if all four of their grandparents lived within a 50-kilometre radius of their current home.

    But the DNA testing has raised eyebrows in some quarters.

    “We’re worried this will build on the idea that there are real Normans and fake Normans,” said Jacques Declosmenil, head of the local wing of the Movement Against Racism (MRAP) group.

    “In the current context of xenophobia, it’s very dangerous. Racists could use this to say: ‘I’ve got proof that I haven’t got any Arab blood,’ for instance.”

    The team are searching for Viking roots amongst residents in three areas of Britain as well as in Normandy.

    But at the nearby University of Caen, medieval history professor Pierre Bauduin said he had warned the Leicester academics that racial origins are “an extremely sensitive topic in France”.

    “It’s important that the results of this are not misrepresented by anyone,” he said.

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    The results of this Y-Dna study carried by Richard Jones in 2015 are known since April 2016.

    Regarding these "Anti-racism activists", they are in fact "white supremacists"... Racial origins are “an extremely sensitive topic in France” just because according to the vast majority of French historians and politics, since the 19th century, all French people are supposed to descend from a single indo-european people named the "Gauls" (and about the recent migrations they simply just ignore or deny it). So these white supremacists were just probably terrified to find some "exotic" or non "indo-european" haplogroups, which could ruin this myth of origin.... But yes it is probably smarter for them to say they are "Anti-racism activists" than "white supremacists".
    Last edited by E_M81_I3A; 06-08-2016 at 06:28 AM.
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    Y Dna: E-M81-->CTS12227-->BY8900 : The oldest M81 known are Guanches 2000 BP
    MtDna: I3a1 : The oldest I3a1 known is VK164, Viking from Oxford, UK, 880-1000 CE.


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    according to the vast majority of French historians and politics, since the 19th century, all French people are supposed to descend from a single indo-european people named the "Gauls""
    I don't think it is true ( I mean, I don't think that french historians think that .... About politics, do they think?).
    and about the recent migrations they simply just ignore or deny it
    I'm afraid you are confusing very different things. First, the french archeologists ( and not only them) use to deny, since the years 1960-70, the preeminent role of migrations in the archeologic phenomena. It's the " pots are not people" dogma. But this concerns only the ancient migrations, and essentially the archeologists. About historians of the modern era ( say from Caesar to the Völkerwanderungen) , the situation in France is very more complex. Anyway, nothing of this has any rapport with the beliefs of the institutional politics and journalists, which can be summarized in one sentence: French result precisely from so many migrations that any "french population" concept would be nonsensical. There are only pure individuals, who are all french only because of a social, political and philosophical contract. What they deny, it's purely and simply the possibility to tell anything sensical about french people, and likely any people, with any genetical tool. Their dogma is "nature is nothing". Don't waste your time with those people and what they tell, this is all disgusting.
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    anglesqueville,

    Sounds like they're still stuck in the nihilistic processualism of 1960s ?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravetto-Danubian View Post
    anglesqueville,

    Sounds like they're still stuck in the nihilistic processualism of 1960s ?!
    Roughly said, yes. I tell "roughly" because there are many variations and shades. But, for the essential, they are children of the 60s.
    En North alom, de North venom
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    The French Republic was born with the idea that all French are equal, and therefore, have no difference between them.

    If the premise is correct, the conclusion is false.
    Search differences between the French people, it is therefore considered as racist.
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    Maybe underlining the historical interest here, viewing individuals from before the year 1000 as people, rather than as passportholders would help?

    The French do after all seem to take an interest in political history and fiercely defend their regional food specialties. Bretons are also allowed some leeway, so some geographical population labels are evidently used even if people have been forever moving in and out of regions and countries.

    An inquiry into the presumed stationary nature of the population of , say Wallonia, would not be of a sinister nature to Belgians even if the territory once was ruled from France. Looking into whether inhabitants in kanton Vaud might historically have straddled borders should not worry the Swiss, so why is it likely that people in Normandy should be upset unless one actively campaigned to use past history to stir animosity?

    p.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ph. View Post
    Maybe underlining the historical interest here, viewing individuals from before the year 1000 as people, rather than as passportholders would help?

    The French do after all seem to take an interest in political history and fiercely defend their regional food specialties. Bretons are also allowed some leeway, so some geographical population labels are evidently used even if people have been forever moving in and out of regions and countries.

    An inquiry into the presumed stationary nature of the population of , say Wallonia, would not be of a sinister nature to Belgians even if the territory once was ruled from France. Looking into whether inhabitants in kanton Vaud might historically have straddled borders should not worry the Swiss, so why is it likely that people in Normandy should be upset unless one actively campaigned to use past history to stir animosity?

    p.
    That is not a problem for Switzerland and Belgium because both are federal countries; they are aware that they are a federation of disparate regions. Wallonia was rarely ruled by France BTW, not any more than Flanders... France is a centralized state very keen on its (artificial) historical unity.

    The MRAP have some power, but they don't represent French people, they only represent themselves. Ironically French people are very attached to their region and ressent Parisian jacobinism. But regional identities are allowed to exist by the French republic only in the form of inoffensive folklore, for the sake of tourism.
    There is a propaganda to reduce regional cultures to "provincialism"; "Provinciaux" are supposed to be uncivilized rednecks in the process of being touched by the grace of Parisian culture at one point of their evolution.

    Ex: the Nord region has a prestigious history linked to greater Netherlands, but Parisians are eager to reduce their symbolic prestige into a region of uncivilized proles with no history (Ch'tis); it's their way of forcing every "provinces" to look toward Paris instead of looking outward.

    So any attempt at giving a region a wider prestige than the French republic (Rollo, Dutch golden age, Holy Roman Empire...) will be frown upon.
    Last edited by tchekitchek; 06-14-2016 at 06:26 PM.

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