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Thread: Laz Y-DNA Distribution

  1. #1
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    Lazistan Turkey United States of America

    Laz Y-DNA Distribution

    Laz Y-DNA Distribution

    I gathered Laz Y-DNA information from various projects and created a pie chart. I will update periodically when I have more data. Most of the data is from FTDNA.

    N=54 (December 26, 2015)


    Haplogroup Percentage
    J2=18 33.33%
    G2=17 31.48%
    L=6 11.11%
    R1b=5 9.26%
    J1=3 5.56%
    I=2 3.70%
    E=2 3.70%
    G1=1 1.85%





    Laz Y-DNA distribution.jpg

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  3. #2
    J Man
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    Makes sense and looks good.

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     XooR (12-28-2015)

  5. #3
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    I saw a different distribution in the another forum as below.

    L1b - 42%
    J2a - 28%
    G2a - 17%
    J1 - 3%
    R1b1a2 - 3%
    E1b1b - 6%
    I2a - 3%

    (Rates are probably rounded and I don't know what is source)

    Also, L1b is found more than 30% among Hemshins (from Rize and Artvin), found about 25% among Pontic Greeks (from Trabzon, Gümüşhane and Erzurum) and found about 20% among Megrelians (mostly from Zugdidi). The members of famous Megrelian dynasties of Georgia are belong to this haplogroup. Sources are FTDNA projects.

    I don't know which samples that were used in this chart, but I'm sure that Lazes have more L1b than 11%.
    Last edited by Caspian; 12-28-2015 at 09:26 PM.
    Y-dna: L1b*-M317 (Pontic Cluster, PH8+, PH2079+, Y49809+) is a 2500 years old and very specific subclade which found among Pontic Greeks and Laz people.

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  7. #4
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    Lazistan Turkey United States of America
    Quote Originally Posted by Caspian View Post
    I saw a different distribution in the another forum as below.

    L1b - 42%
    J2a - 28%
    G2a - 17%
    J1 - 3%
    R1b1a2 - 3%
    E1b1b - 6%
    I2a - 3%

    (Rates are probably rounded and I don't know what is source)

    Also, L1b is found more than 30% among Hemshins (from Rize and Artvin), found about 25% among Pontic Greeks (from Trabzon, Gümüşhane and Erzurum) and found about 20% among Megrelians (mostly from Zugdidi). The members of famous Megrelian dynasties of Georgia are belong to this haplogroup. Sources are FTDNA projects.

    I don't know which samples that were used in this chart, but I'm sure that Lazes have more L1b than 11%.
    Caspian,

    You are right, L1b percentage was very high in the beginning , as time passed by there was no additional "L" found, as a matter of fact "L" percentage declined rapidly. I just found a chart from April 2015, which total number of input was (24).
    11179950_10155550459795533_5820278480124455258_n.jpg
    I dont really have old data for Megrelians but when I created Laz percentages I also collected Megrel data and combined them since according to some historians Laz and Megrel are the same people but different religion + nationality. Anyways attached are Laz and Megrel Y-DNA distributions. Data was mostly collected from FTDNA.
    1496406_10153868930721457_3206878711174855125_o.jpg

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  9. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by XooR View Post
    Caspian,

    You are right, L1b percentage was very high in the beginning , as time passed by there was no additional "L" found, as a matter of fact "L" percentage declined rapidly. I just found a chart from April 2015, which total number of input was (24).
    11179950_10155550459795533_5820278480124455258_n.jpg
    I dont really have old data for Megrelians but when I created Laz percentages I also collected Megrel data and combined them since according to some historians Laz and Megrel are the same people but different religion + nationality. Anyways attached are Laz and Megrel Y-DNA distributions. Data was mostly collected from FTDNA.
    1496406_10153868930721457_3206878711174855125_o.jpg
    Hello Xoor,

    Thank you for information.

    I don't know numbers and details of Laz samples at FTDNA projects. You're right that it's the old distribution. I could found only 26 Laz samples at FTDNA Georgian project, but probably you have more data. I'm only wonder that are all of the samples in your database really ethnic Laz or Pseudo-Laz Northeast Anatolian? Becuse I know that sometimes the "Laz" term is used for all people who live from Samsun to Artvin in Turkey as you know.

    As for the Megrelians, I've found 43 Megrelian samples at the FTDNA Georgian project and 9 of them (21%) are L1b. You have probably found 5 Megrelian L1b among 40 samples. I think I have made mistakes. There are 3 L1b samples who have "Chikovani" surname and I thought they are Megrelian because Chikovani dynasty were rulers of Megrelia and their capital was Zugdidi. However, their origin probably was Svan according to their surname, because -ani is a Svan surname from Western Georgia according to this article.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgian_name#Surnames

    Other 6 Megrelian L1b samples are below.

    259003 Megrelian
    259001 Megrelian
    311524 Shelia Zugdidi, Anaklia, Sachino, megrel
    259004 Megrelian
    250027 Kudava Mamuka Kudava, XVIII c, Zemo Nagvazao, Georgia
    258974 Megrelian

    https://www.familytreedna.com/public...ction=yresults

    6 samples among 40 Megrelians are L1b according to my data now so 15% of them and 8.5% (4/47) of Svans are L1b.
    Last edited by Caspian; 01-06-2016 at 01:53 AM.
    Y-dna: L1b*-M317 (Pontic Cluster, PH8+, PH2079+, Y49809+) is a 2500 years old and very specific subclade which found among Pontic Greeks and Laz people.

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  11. #6
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    Can you make the sample with the Lazs proper excluding Mingrelians?

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  13. #7
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    That's interesting
    I expected J1 percentages to be bigger

  14. #8
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    Haplogroup L (and its subclades, particularly L1b) is quite high among Lazs. Strange, it is quite low among the other Kartvelian populations (Georgians, etc.)

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  16. #9
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    As far as I know, the haplogroup L is east Iranian. Some of those L males travelled around the Caspian Sea and settled in Caucasus, gradually expanding Southwardly into Anatolia. Hence the large concentration of the L haplogroup among the Laz people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lupus82 View Post
    As far as I know, the haplogroup L is east Iranian. Some of those L males travelled around the Caspian Sea and settled in Caucasus, gradually expanding Southwardly into Anatolia. Hence the large concentration of the L haplogroup among the Laz people.
    good fiction but science is not a fiction. Only movies may be.

    Let me inform you then. The subsclade of South caucasian L1b is L1b-PH8 and very unique to region so far. On the other hand it might be 3000-3500 years old. Here is the yfull tree of pontic cluster of L. https://yfull.com/tree/L-Y16366/

    What is interesting is the closest match to PH8 is a Mountain jew from Dagestan in the sister clade of Ph8 which mRCA of 9400 but still there is no any eastern iranian so far. As far as we talk about makro haplogroups like R, L and j, we should never claim a specific plaece for a origin. First L man may have origin in anywhere in the world as far as L has 46 thousand years old.

    About Ph8, i suspect that Ph8 may have oriign of south western iran or mesopotamian origin before the indo iranian invasion on the region

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