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Thread: Tatars and J2b2

  1. #1
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    Tatars and J2b2

    Hi.
    My paternal ancestry is North-Norwegian, and I' J2b2, which is kind of rare in Norway, especially Northern Norway.
    On FTDNA, I have no Y-DNA STR matches.

    On my BigY result, I have some distant SNP-matches. And a lot of them seem to be Turkic peoples from Russia (Tatars, Moksha-converted Tatars, and Chuvash).
    Is this normal for people of J2b2?
    Does this mean anything at all?
    Last edited by Táltos; 02-20-2016 at 05:48 AM. Reason: image removed for privacy concerns

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  3. #2
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    J-L283

    Albania United States of America Kosovo European Union
    I'm guessing you are 225319/YF03063
    If it's you then you split with the Tatars 2900 ybp since according to your BigY, you have tested Y12000-, CTS11760-, and Z39660-. So you form your own branch parallel to them. Your MRCA shared with them is J-Z8430, 2900 ybp:
    www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z8430/
    http://tree.j2-m172.info/?Hg=J2b2a1a1a1a1a1a

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  5. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trojet View Post
    I'm guessing you are 225319/YF03063
    If it's you then you split with the Tatars 2900 ybp since according to your BigY, you have tested Y12000-, CTS11760-, and Z39660-. So you form your own branch parallel to them. Your MRCA shared with them is J-Z8430, 2900 ybp:
    www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z8430/
    http://tree.j2-m172.info/?Hg=J2b2a1a1a1a1a1a
    Haha, you are correct.
    Well that kind of sucks. I was hoping I would get some kind of matches that gave me some pointer to where my paternal ancestry is from...since I had no STR matches on FTDNA.
    But it seems even with Big-Y and SNPs, I'm alone on my parallel branch

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  7. #4
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    J-L283

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    Quote Originally Posted by hintsu View Post
    Haha, you are correct.
    Well that kind of sucks. I was hoping I would get some kind of matches that gave me some pointer to where my paternal ancestry is from...since I had no STR matches on FTDNA.
    But it seems even with Big-Y and SNPs, I'm alone on my parallel branch
    Yea, so the lack of STR matches means you don't have any closer (genealogical) matches (yet).

    But eventually your paternal line in more ancient times, as well as the J2b2 Tatars, seemingly hails from the Balkans, since the diversity and frequency of J2b2-L283 is highest in the Balkans. Me and you for example split 3900 ybp. Our MRCA is J-Z1296:
    www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z1296/

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  9. #5
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    This branch have not oldest... estimated around 1600 years before present... czech sample in the root. I think were revers migration from EU to Volga region. I calculated haplotype variance (by 17 loci) in the Moksha peoples (~20% of J2b's) and I get similar age ~ 1000-1200 years. Or we have classical founder effect, but it is important to note that the branch is in the lowest position downstream to EU J-Z8430.

  10. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus View Post
    This branch have not oldest... estimated around 1600 years before present... czech sample in the root. I think were revers migration from EU to Volga region. I calculated haplotype variance (by 17 loci) in the Moksha peoples (~20% of J2b's) and I get similar age ~ 1000-1200 years. Or we have classical founder effect, but it is important to note that the branch is in the lowest position downstream to EU J-Z8430.
    I commented on this quote. With which I do not quite agree...

    "As a result, both the Illyrians and the Mycenaeans (and possibly the Albanians) would be descended from Middle to Late Bronze Age Steppe migrants to the Southeast Europe, in a migration that was particularly rich in J2b lineages from the Middle Volga region. That would explain why it has been so hard to identify R1a or R1b lineages that could be of Illyrian or Mycenaean origin. The only variety of R1b that is found at reasonably high frequencies in Southeast Europe, and particularly in Greece, is R1b-Z2103, the branch found in the eastern Yamna culture, including the Volga-Ural region."
    http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_J2_Y-DNA.shtml

  11. #7
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    I can say with confidence that almost all Moksha J2b will into the J-Y12000 branch or slightly lower.

  12. #8
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    I just saw this thread and I wanted to add that we observe something similar in V13, which off course has a distribution that closely resembles that of L283. We find members in Tatarstan and Scandinavia, and sometimes they are close. My best guess for now is that they are both the result of Viking slave trade in the early middle ages, some being taken by a straight route northwards to Scandinavia, other over the Volga route to the Volga Bulgar state.

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