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Thread: Miscellaneous Welsh Odds and Ends

  1. #601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Watts View Post
    There are some interesting odds and ends on the National Library of Wales blog - there is a Story of Wales category.

    The latest is about Humphrey Llwyd, known as a cartographer, author, antiquary and Member of Parliament

    https://blog.library.wales/humphrey_llwyd/
    Lloyd (Llwyd) is one of the surnames in my y-dna haplotype cluster. I'm not saying Humphrey Llwyd would have been, but maybe.

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  3. #602
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    Some of these descriptive surnames were adopted early by gentry families, so if you are related to them you might well find their family trees.

    Quite a few Lloyds in the Welsh biographies here: https://biography.wales/browse/L
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  5. #603
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    There are a few Welsh legends and myths about the loss of fertile land to the sea. They appear in early Welsh books and may refer to yr Hen Ogledd, to north Wales or as here to Cardigan bay:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-48407795

    The recent storms have taken away the sand that covered the “evidence” of Cantre’r Gwaelod.
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  7. #604
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    Have you any information about St Dogmael?

    "Welsh monk of the house of Cunedda, the son of Ithel ab Ceredig ab Cunedda Wledig. He preached in Pembrokeshire, Wales, and then went to Brittany, in France. Several churches bear his name."

    It is believed to have landed at Le Yaudet near Lannion in the early 6th century from Pembrokeshire. Three chapels are dedicated to him in Trégor (Ploulec'h, Rospez, Pommerit-Jaudy).

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  9. #605
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trelvern View Post
    Have you any information about St Dogmael?

    "Welsh monk of the house of Cunedda, the son of Ithel ab Ceredig ab Cunedda Wledig. He preached in Pembrokeshire, Wales, and then went to Brittany, in France. Several churches bear his name."

    It is believed to have landed at Le Yaudet near Lannion in the early 6th century from Pembrokeshire. Three chapels are dedicated to him in Trégor (Ploulec'h, Rospez, Pommerit-Jaudy).
    It looks as if little is known of him. Dictionary of Welsh Biography says “No details of the life of S. Dogmael are extant. The Welsh genealogies connect him with one of the three saintly tribes of Wales by making him the son of Ithel ap Ceredig ap Cunedda Wledig. To judge from the churches bearing his name, his activities in Wales were confined almost entirely to Pembrokeshire; for Llandudoch or S. Dogmaels (on the Teifi, opposite Cardigan) together with Capel Degwel in the same parish, S. Dogwell's (near Fish-guard), Mynachlog-ddu, and Meline are all in that county. The only exception is the church of Llanddogwel in Anglesey, formerly a parish in itself, but later attached to Llanfechell. In the 12th century a Benedictine priory was established on the site of Dogmael's chief foundation at Llandudoch. Traces of a S. Dogmael are to be found also in Brittany. Both 14 June and 31 October are quoted in different sources as his feast day.”

    https://biography.wales/article/s-DOGM-SAN-0500
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  11. #606
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    We were brought up with tales of “Y Wladfa”, the Welsh settlement in Patagonia. I have some relatives in my tree who went out to Patagonia, one or two died there and the others either returned to Wales or moved on to north America.

    I don’t visit MyHeritage very often but I take a look at my new matches from time to time. European matches stand out well there. I use the location flags to sift the matches. Interesting to see that I now have more matches from Argentina with Spanish forenames and Welsh surnames. Their ancestors were obviously Welsh settlers in Chile and Patagonia but the connection must be quite distant.
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  13. #607
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Watts View Post
    We were brought up with tales of “Y Wladfa”, the Welsh settlement in Patagonia. I have some relatives in my tree who went out to Patagonia, one or two died there and the others either returned to Wales or moved on to north America.

    I don’t visit MyHeritage very often but I take a look at my new matches from time to time. European matches stand out well there. I use the location flags to sift the matches. Interesting to see that I now have more matches from Argentina with Spanish forenames and Welsh surnames. Their ancestors were obviously Welsh settlers in Chile and Patagonia but the connection must be quite distant.
    Fascinating. Did the Welsh settlers who made the voyage come from very specific parts of the language-speaking heartlands?
    Living DNA's former Cautious mode:
    Wales-related ancestry: 86.8%
    Cornwall: 8%
    North England-related ancestry: 5.2%
    Y line: Peak District, England. Big Y match: Scania, Sweden; TMRCA 1,250 ybp (YFull);
    mtDNA: traces to Glamorgan, Wales
    Mother's Y: traces to Llanvair Discoed, Wales

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  15. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonikW View Post
    Fascinating. Did the Welsh settlers who made the voyage come from very specific parts of the language-speaking heartlands?
    Good question. The venture was widely advertised, so they came from all over the heartlands - including Llynlleifiad (Liverpool) and Herefordshire. There was some secondary emigration too - people who had moved from rural Wales to the valleys already had looser roots. I think there were groups - geographic or denominational - but I don’t recall the detail.

    ADD - there is a list of the fist emigrants on the Mimosa from Liverpool here: http://www.argbrit.org/Patagonia/mimosa.htm

    (Note the uncertainty)
    Last edited by Phoebe Watts; 06-15-2019 at 02:32 PM. Reason: Added link
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  17. #609
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Watts View Post
    Good question. The venture was widely advertised, so they came from all over the heartlands - including Llynlleifiad (Liverpool) and Herefordshire. There was some secondary emigration too - people who had moved from rural Wales to the valleys already had looser roots. I think there were groups - geographic or denominational - but I don’t recall the detail.

    ADD - there is a list of the fist emigrants on the Mimosa from Liverpool here: http://www.argbrit.org/Patagonia/mimosa.htm

    (Note the uncertainty)
    Thanks for adding the link. It's interesting that the Mimosa passengers seem to have come from various places from the far south to the north as well as some from Merseyside and its surrounds with Welsh surnames. I was surprised by the high number from Mountain Ash. I wonder what their trades were because it might suggest there was a severe shortage of work there at that point in time. Or was there also some kind of religious motivation?
    Living DNA's former Cautious mode:
    Wales-related ancestry: 86.8%
    Cornwall: 8%
    North England-related ancestry: 5.2%
    Y line: Peak District, England. Big Y match: Scania, Sweden; TMRCA 1,250 ybp (YFull);
    mtDNA: traces to Glamorgan, Wales
    Mother's Y: traces to Llanvair Discoed, Wales

  18. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonikW View Post
    Thanks for adding the link. It's interesting that the Mimosa passengers seem to have come from various places from the far south to the north as well as some from Merseyside and its surrounds with Welsh surnames. I was surprised by the high number from Mountain Ash. I wonder what their trades were because it might suggest there was a severe shortage of work there at that point in time. Or was there also some kind of religious motivation?
    The histories of the settlement cite poverty and bad landlords. And it was a cultural movement building on some of the older emigrations to north America. There was a realisation that the Welsh settlements in north America were only surviving a couple of generations so they were looking for somewhere more isolated where they would be able to run their own affairs.

    Merseyside and Manchester are just the north Wales equivalent of the South Wales valleys in this context. The emigrants from there were mostly recent inmigrants from the rural hinterland.

    A popular minister went from Mountain Ash and some of his flock followed him in later years. Perhaps that was an influence? Mountain Ash was relatively new in the 1860s too so perhaps the population was still quite transient?I know that my great great grandfather left rural Carmarthenshire for Miskin in Mountain Ash in the 1860s. He went back marry and the family then lived in the Llantrisant area for a few months before returning to the south west.
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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