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Thread: Features of Z283 clade

  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jan_Noack View Post
    what did the Viking age show? I think that would be interesting
    There is a Viking paper on the way , but we already have samples from late 10th-early 11th century Iceland that had Y and autosomal DNA data. Those with Norse , majority Norse and mixed Norse-Gael ancestry had paternal lines associated with Scandinavians :I1 (L22 and Z58) , R1a ( particularly Z284 ), R1b-U106 and L238. Those of full Gael or majority Gael ancestry tended to be R1b-L21 .The few females tested were also Norse , mixed or Gael.


    Ancestry: 34% N.East English, 36% Scots, 15% Irish, 14% S.East English
    Y lines : Scotland ( R1a-Z284 and x2 R1b-L21 ) : England ( I-L22 , G-L14 and R1b )
    mt lines : Scotland ( H7 , U5a1) : England ( K1a-195C , H1e1a)

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  3. #132
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    New paper

    EXPLOSION FROM THE STEPPE? The distribution and origins of the Y-haplogroup R1a
    Draft only for comment, 2019
    Dr. Joe Flood

    https://www.academia.edu/39342899/EX...jaZZYXutS3pQuc

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  5. #133
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    If I'm not mistaken, there is an error. The PDF text reads: "Another small branch FGC9998 (R1a1a1a2, parallel to L664) has been found only in England, and as it has TMRCA 1200 AD, it probably came with L664 from Norway during the Viking intrusions."

    I believe it the text instead *should* read: FGC9988.

  6. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by J1 DYS388=13 View Post
    New paper

    EXPLOSION FROM THE STEPPE? The distribution and origins of the Y-haplogroup R1a
    Draft only for comment, 2019
    Dr. Joe Flood

    https://www.academia.edu/39342899/EX...jaZZYXutS3pQuc
    The Ashkenazi expansion caused friction with expanding Germanic tribes?

    LOL

    And has he ever heard of the R from Upper Paleolithic Siberia? Doesn't sound like it.

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  8. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Generalissimo View Post
    The Ashkenazi expansion caused friction with expanding Germanic tribes?

    LOL

    And has he ever heard of the R from Upper Paleolithic Siberia? Doesn't sound like it.
    "This is a major revisionist paper putting up an alternative point of view to the dominant "Steppe hypothesis" for the Eneolithic resettlement of Europe. I expect it to be controversial.

    - R1a was a small element within R1 tribespeople that entered Europe at the beginning of the Holocene, mostly through the Balkans.. They passed up into the steppe by 6000 BC.

    - around 3000 BC an Event occurred that demolished the nearby Neolithic settlements containing millions of people and left only a few survivors. Two of the lucky men were R1a-Z283 and R1a-Z93, whose descendants expanded almost into unoccupied space.

    - these survivors had picked up Bronze technology from their neighbours. They used it to control key resources - malachite, amber and other minerals - which were required by the new Bronze Age civilizations to the south. The trade enabled their population to keep expanding the whole way through the Bronze Age.

    - about 2200 BC a major drying event sent the tribes spilling into North India, Iran and beyond, where they formed the late Harappan culture and founded Hinduism and Zoroastrianism.

    - later there were other R1a expansions, particularly the Slav/Ashkenazi expansion in Greater Poland in the post-Roman period

    The main points of departure from the canon are:
    - no horses. the cow did it.
    - trade and settlement of vacant lands, not invasion
    - provides mild support for both the ''Anatolian hypothesis' and ''steppe hypothesis' - at different times."

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  10. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmaduke View Post
    If I'm not mistaken, there is an error. The PDF text reads: "Another small branch FGC9998 (R1a1a1a2, parallel to L664) has been found only in England, and as it has TMRCA 1200 AD, it probably came with L664 from Norway during the Viking intrusions."

    I believe it the text instead *should* read: FGC9988.
    You are correct. Someone has pointed that out to the author on the Facebook YFull group.

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  12. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by J1 DYS388=13 View Post
    You are correct. Someone has pointed that out to the author on the Facebook YFull group.
    In Yfull, FGC9998 and FGC9988 are on the same node named R1a-FGC9988.

  13. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by parasar View Post
    "This is a major revisionist paper putting up an alternative point of view to the dominant "Steppe hypothesis" for the Eneolithic resettlement of Europe. I expect it to be controversial.

    - R1a was a small element within R1 tribespeople that entered Europe at the beginning of the Holocene, mostly through the Balkans.. They passed up into the steppe by 6000 BC.

    - around 3000 BC an Event occurred that demolished the nearby Neolithic settlements containing millions of people and left only a few survivors. Two of the lucky men were R1a-Z283 and R1a-Z93, whose descendants expanded almost into unoccupied space.

    - these survivors had picked up Bronze technology from their neighbours. They used it to control key resources - malachite, amber and other minerals - which were required by the new Bronze Age civilizations to the south. The trade enabled their population to keep expanding the whole way through the Bronze Age.

    - about 2200 BC a major drying event sent the tribes spilling into North India, Iran and beyond, where they formed the late Harappan culture and founded Hinduism and Zoroastrianism.

    - later there were other R1a expansions, particularly the Slav/Ashkenazi expansion in Greater Poland in the post-Roman period

    The main points of departure from the canon are:
    - no horses. the cow did it.
    - trade and settlement of vacant lands, not invasion
    - provides mild support for both the ''Anatolian hypothesis' and ''steppe hypothesis' - at different times."
    Parasar, I give thanks for your summary , no thank for the amateur author of the paper.

  14. #139
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    I read the entire paper, and I will at least give him this-he does not have the R1a tribes speaking Uralic. Or being Mongoloid and speaking some kind of Yukaghir or Paleosiberian language. Carlos, what do you have against my haplogroup? Did Razib Khan or my dad throw you into a garbage can when you were a teenager?

  15. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeyP37 View Post
    I read the entire paper, and I will at least give him this-he does not have the R1a tribes speaking Uralic. Or being Mongoloid and speaking some kind of Yukaghir or Paleosiberian language. Carlos, what do you have against my haplogroup? Did Razib Khan or my dad throw you into a garbage can when you were a teenager?
    It is simply too far back to know what the progenitor of all R1a-M417 spoke. However, the Proto-Indo-European/Indo-European/Steppe hypothesis makes the most sense. Yet, nothing is set in stone. New findings could turn things on their head.
    Known Ancestry: Albanian
    23andme results: 94% Balkan, 0.9% Italian, 0.8% Middle Eastern, 2.2% broadly southern European, 0.3 British & Irish, 0.3% Japanese, 0.5% unassigned
    MyOrigins2.0: 100% Southeast European
    MyAncientOrigins: 62% Farmer, 24% Hunter Gatherer, 14% Metal Age Invader
    MyHeritage: 76% Greek, 16% Balkan, 8% Italian
    WeGene: 99.5% Balkan, 0.5% unassigned
    GenePlaza: 92.7% East Mediterranean, 5.2% Southwestern European, 1.5% Ambiguous
    DNA.LAND: 95% Balkan, 5% Sardinian

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