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Thread: T in Lazaridis et al First Farmers

  1. #1
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    T in Lazaridis et al First Farmers

    Among the Supplementary information is a table of YDNA haplogroups http://www.anthrogenica.com/attachme...achmentid=9822 including an early T
    Lazaridis et al (original preprint paper and Supplementary) http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2016/06/16/059311 include one instance in the Levant - specifically Ain Ghazal (Jordan).
    Sample AG83_5 (I1707) is dated to the late middle prepottery Neolithic B (late MPPN or around 7700-7500 BCE.
    Sample was given Haplogroup T, but before T1a1 and T1a2a.

    More at discussion located in Ancient at thread Lazaridis et al http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...-print)/page19 and following pages.
    Last edited by Saetro; 06-18-2016 at 12:33 AM.

  2. #2
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    Greece
    T1a has been found in Europe along with G2a2 in Linear Pottery Culture. G2a2 came there from Starcevo (?).

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     Saetro (06-18-2016)

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    The negative result for this T ( i1707 ) in the levant means that the 2 x T in Karlsdorf Germany are not related in regards to migration ................these came from elsewhere


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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    Haplogroup T is found among the Late MPPNB inhabitants from 'Ain Ghazal but was not found among the early and middle MPPNB populations. Is thought that the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B poplutation is mostly composed of two different populations, the Natufians which trace their origins to the Earlier Natufian and a second population coming through a northerly influx from the region of northeastern Anatolia. Natufians have been found to belong mostly to the E1b1b1b2 lineage, which is found among 60% of the whole PPNB population and 75% of the 'Ain Ghazal population, being present in all three MPPNB stages. The complete abscence of T-PF7466 among Natufians and the earlier MPPNB stages could mean that haplogroup T arrived later with the northerly influx.

    As previously found in the early Neolithic settlement from Karsdorf, a mtDNA R0 descendant have been found together with Y-DNA T.

    Ain Ghazal T Ghazal-I
    ID I1707 AG83_5 Poz-81097
    Y DNA T-PF7466 (xT1a1-FGC3945.2, T1a2a1-P322)
    mtDNA R0a


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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     Saetro (06-22-2016)

  7. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by vettor View Post
    Haplogroup T is found among the Late MPPNB inhabitants from 'Ain Ghazal but was not found among the early and middle MPPNB populations. Is thought that the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B poplutation is mostly composed of two different populations, the Natufians which trace their origins to the Earlier Natufian and a second population coming through a northerly influx from the region of northeastern Anatolia. Natufians have been found to belong mostly to the E1b1b1b2 lineage, which is found among 60% of the whole PPNB population and 75% of the 'Ain Ghazal population, being present in all three MPPNB stages. The complete abscence of T-PF7466 among Natufians and the earlier MPPNB stages could mean that haplogroup T arrived later with the northerly influx.

    As previously found in the early Neolithic settlement from Karsdorf, a mtDNA R0 descendant have been found together with Y-DNA T.

    Ain Ghazal T Ghazal-I
    ID I1707 AG83_5 Poz-81097
    Y DNA T-PF7466 (xT1a1-FGC3945.2, T1a2a1-P322)
    mtDNA R0a

    MC1R, rs1805009, red hair, fair skin
    Levant Neolithic I1707 GG

    OCA2, rs1800407, green or hazel eyes
    Levant Neolithic I1707 CC

    SLC24A5, rs1426654, Caucasoid light skin
    Levant Neolithic I1707 GG

    SLC45A2, rs16891982, Caucasoid light skin
    Levant Neolithic I1707 GG

    TYR, rs1042602, light skin, absence of freckles
    Levant Neolithic I1707 CC



    This looks like a description of What ancient Greeks referred to as a Thracian


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

  8. #6
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    the most valuable information for ydna T and others from the Laz paper would be

    http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v...g2011192a.html

    check the supp list .....for more information


    BTW...........none of the 35 x T samples in regards to the STR come close to me


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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     Saetro (07-16-2016)

  10. #7
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    I ran my gedmatch number with the ancient T from the levant gedmatch ( M897077)

    and got a hit only on chromosome #23


    Chr 23
    Match ID Type Name Matching segments on Chromosome 23 Overlap with previous match
    1 V3 I0707 Anatolian EF
    (M897077) 2321 - 154886292 (196.065 cM) New Root


    I really do not know how good Gedmatch is

    and ran it also through.......
    MDLP K23b Oracle Rev 2014 Sep 16

    Kit M897077

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 European_Early_Farmers 43.76
    2 Caucasian 36.7
    3 Near_East 11.36
    4 North_African 7.94
    5 Khoisan 0.13
    6 Paleo_Siberian 0.09
    7 Archaic_Human 0.02

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Italian_Piedmont ( ) 15.14
    2 Italian_Tuscan ( ) 15.62
    3 Italian_Abruzzo ( ) 16.48
    4 Italian_Bergamo ( ) 17.83


    and mine below
    MDLP K23b Oracle Rev 2014 Sep 16


    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 European_Early_Farmers 28.49
    2 Caucasian 28.43
    3 European_Hunters_Gatherers 25.13
    4 South_Central_Asian 5.25
    5 Near_East 4.36
    6 North_African 4.33
    7 Ancestral_Altaic 3.04
    8 Melano_Polynesian 0.98

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Italian_North ( ) 1.32
    2 German-Volga ( ) 8.12
    3 South_German ( ) 8.83
    4 Italian_Piedmont ( ) 9.21
    5 Italian_Tuscan ( ) 9.73
    6 Austrian ( ) 9.86
    7 Italian_Bergamo ( ) 10.48
    Last edited by vettor; 10-27-2016 at 05:46 PM.


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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     Saetro (11-03-2016)

  12. #8
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    I have made a bar chart showing the mtDNA H frequency among all tested Early Neolithic populations. I have excluded H5 results because this is found in Anatolia and is not found in Karsdorf.

    Interesting findings is that Karsdorf match pretty well with Eastern Balkans while starcevo-koros and LBK from southwestern Germany match with Anatolia.

    I have not included any unreliable sample and I decided count as H5 an ambiguous H vs H5 sample from Barcin. I have not included two samples from Portugal.

    mtDNA haplogroup H (xH5) Early Neolithic.jpg
    mtDNA haplogroup HV (xH5, HV0) Early Neolithic.jpg

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    Originally known from haak paper ( KAR6 ) as T-CTS880 , now

    https://genetiker.wordpress.com/y-snp-calls-for-i0795/

    I cannot find PF5676
    Last edited by vettor; 11-19-2017 at 05:30 PM.


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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     Principe (01-05-2018)

  16. #10
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    Below are all the ancient T ydna found so far at end of 2017



    scholars state that the Bulgarian samples have 35% WHG


    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, BY143483+ )


    Grandfather via paternal grandmother = I1-Y33791 ydna
    Great grandmother paternal side = T1a1e mtdna

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