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Thread: Map of Slavic y-dna in Greece, compiled by user Passa

  1. #31
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    So this map from the OP is showing combined frequency of R-M17 + I-M423.

    Passa told me.

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    If the northern Greek sample here does include people of Anatolian refugee status, then this means more than half of northern Greeks have a direct Slavic line.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    If the northern Greek sample here does include people of Anatolian refugee status, then this means more than half of northern Greeks have a direct Slavic line.
    I'm pretty sure they didn't simply choose northern Greeks with Slavic heritage, as we know that's quite an unlikely strategy, and given that many ? most people of Slavic descent in Greece by now are thoroughly Greek and would probably not even know that 1500 years ago their patriline spoke Slavic
    The studies (Semino, Pericic, Grugni, etc) used random chosen group, most likely from Thessaloniki . All samples selection data is available in the studies, which are all well known

    As for the number it's hard to say; R1a is likely all/ most from Slavs. I2a is probably more complex
    Last edited by Gravetto-Danubian; 07-24-2016 at 10:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravetto-Danubian View Post
    Why wouldn't it ?
    The studies (Semino, Pericic, Grugni, etc) used random chosen group, most likely from Thessaloniki . All samples selection data is available in the studies, which are all well known

    As for the number it's hard to say; R1a is likely all/ most from Slavs. I2a is probably more complex
    Historically it makes sense. The Greek ethnicity was created through assimilation of other groups, on top of the native Greeks.. this is how the Aegean islands became Greek, how Cyprus became Greek, how Sicily was once Greek. Obviously in mainland Greece, many Slavs became Greek.

    I hate to bring in phenotypes, but many Greeks show the Slavic influence phenotypically, too.

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    It would be nice to see what subclades of R1a do Greeks actually have.

    Because the FTDNA "Greek Project" has scarcely any info on subclades.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sciencediver View Post
    South Slavic admixture in Greece was already estimated by Hellenthal et al, at 37%.

    http://admixturemap.paintmychromosomes.com/
    What about Greek admixture in South Slavs? For example it is obvious even just from looking at Y-DNA frequencies, that South-East Slavs (Bulgarians and Macedonians) are genetically mostly Non-Slavic. Also autosomal data (genetic distances from other Balto-Slavs) shows that they are largely Non-Slavic. Some of the most common Y-DNA haplogroups among modern Bulgarians are E1b and J2, both of which have been identified in ancient DNA samples from Thracian burials. Thracian aristocrat - sample K8 - belonged to J2a1a1b2 (clade PF5197); whereas Thracian commoner - sample P192-1 - belonged to E1b1b1a1b (clade Z1919). Another Thracian aristocrat - sample T2G2 - belonged to an unknown haplogroup, but neither E, J, I nor G.
    Last edited by Tomenable; 07-25-2016 at 06:00 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    and given permission to me to post.

    These are the subclades of R1a and I2b that are pertinent to Slavic migration, meaning almost half of northern Greeks have a y-dna that can be traced back to Slavs, down to 10% on the islands.

    No part of Greece has been untouched.

    Are you mixing up slavic with ancient thracians ,?

    Father's Mtdna .........T2b17
    Grandfather's Mtdna .......T1a1e
    Sons Mtdna .......K1a4o
    Maternal Grandfather paternal......I1d1-P109
    Maternal side Grandfather .......R1b-S8172
    Wife's Ydna .....R1a-Z282

    My Path = ( K-M9+, TL-P326+, T-M184+, L490+, M70+, PF5664+, L131+, L446+, CTS933+, CTS3767+, CTS8862+, Z19945+, Y70078+ )

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    It would be nice to see what subclades of R1a do Greeks actually have.

    Because the FTDNA "Greek Project" has scarcely any info on subclades.
    Your best bet is to look here. https://www.familytreedna.com/public...frame=yresults
    I have to admit it's late for me and I only got to page 4. So far not many Greek results. Again I didn't go through them all though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    What about Greek admixture in South Slavs? For example it is obvious even just from looking at Y-DNA frequencies, that South-East Slavs (Bulgarians and Macedonians) are genetically mostly Non-Slavic. Also autosomal data (genetic distances from other Balto-Slavs) shows that they are largely Non-Slavic. Some of the most common Y-DNA haplogroups among modern Bulgarians are E1b and J2, both of which have been identified in ancient DNA samples from Thracian burials. Thracian aristocrat - sample K8 - belonged to J2a1a1b2 (clade PF5197); whereas Thracian commoner - sample P192-1 - belonged to E1b1b1a1b (clade Z1919). Another Thracian aristocrat - sample T2G2 - belonged to an unknown haplogroup, but neither E, J, I nor G.
    Sure , but are any of these clades exclusive to Greeks ? The majority of ancient Balkanites were most likely E-V13, J2a, J2b, R1b-L23 , G and the ones in the North could have had some I2 as well, who knows. But can we associate any of these clades with specific ethnic groups without more information and further analysis?

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    There is not enough of ancient DNA from the Balkans to say what the majority of them were.

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