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Thread: Are the Bretons closer to Welsh and Cornish people or to other French people?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by avalon View Post
    Within a British Isles context, yes the Welsh (particularly North Welsh) do show a noticeable level of genetic separation from the English. Of all the UK clusters, only Orkney appears to be more separated than the North Welsh.

    The other thing the PoBI project showed was that the Welsh had the highest levels of the NW France component seen here as FRA14 so I think there is a good case for genetic affinity between modern Welsh and modern Bretons, assuming that researchers sample the right people in Wales.

    Attachment 12066

    Attachment 12067
    Without forgetting that the Armoricans were, genetically, probably very close to their British neighbours before the Breton immigration.
    My results from David Wesolowski's Ancestry Detective Service:

    West British (Britonic?) 42.3%
    Continental Northern and Eastern European 36.6%
    Central French 21.1%

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Helgenes50 View Post
    Without forgetting that the Armoricans were, genetically, probably very close to their British neighbours before the Breton immigration.
    Absolutely. Although from a modern DNA study it is probably difficult to tell how much of the Welsh-Breton affinity dates from historic Breton migration and how much from earlier times.

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  5. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by avalon View Post
    Absolutely. Although from a modern DNA study it is probably difficult to tell how much of the Welsh-Breton affinity dates from historic Breton migration and how much from earlier times.
    I suppose it's not really surprising over a long period, given the relative proximity of South Wales and the South West to Brittany.

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  7. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    I used to run the Bretagne DNA Project before turning it over to the current admin. I can tell you that in terms of y-dna, Bretons do not have any noticeable tendency to match any British. Last I checked, most of those in the Bretagne Project and the R L21 and Subclades Project are short of matches of any kind.
    are Bretons numerous to take part in these projects?
    all the way, the similarities between Bretons and Western British people (not identity) are for a part very old, fed by two directions genes flow since maybe Late Mesolithic, at these high dates rather from N-W France towards the Isles than the contrary, I think.

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  9. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    I used to run the Bretagne DNA Project before turning it over to the current admin. I can tell you that in terms of y-dna, Bretons do not have any noticeable tendency to match any British. Last I checked, most of those in the Bretagne Project and the R L21 and Subclades Project are short of matches of any kind.
    Hi!

    I noticed you were active on Breton DNA sites and stuff. I was wondering if you could help

    I think my father was Breton, but he died in the Indochina war in the 50s. Mom is Asian.
    I believe he was in the 6th colonial paratroopers, which my friend said was a unit based in Breton.

    I took a DNA test and got several interesting results

    23andme said Likely France (but no specific region) and NW European (no specific). and like 10% Italian and Southern European

    MyHeritage said like 40% Britissh (Irish, Scottish, Wales only, no English), and 10% Iberian

    Eurogenes, various calculators came up with a bunch of estimates..usually SE English, SW English, but other calculators put French or Dutch.
    when I plotted K36 into one of those map generators.. the highest numbers were centered around the Breton area, Southern UK, Belgium, and the northern part of Germany. the next highest numbers put the rest of the UK, and Denmark.

    Tolan calculators put Amorica and Orkadian

    One of the ancient calculators said something like Hinxton 5

    my paternal Haplogroup is R-L2

    do these results match those of Breton or other Celtic people in your opinion?

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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerseilannister View Post
    Hi!

    I noticed you were active on Breton DNA sites and stuff. I was wondering if you could help

    I think my father was Breton, but he died in the Indochina war in the 50s. Mom is Asian.
    I believe he was in the 6th colonial paratroopers, which my friend said was a unit based in Breton.

    I took a DNA test and got several interesting results

    23andme said Likely France (but no specific region) and NW European (no specific). and like 10% Italian and Southern European

    MyHeritage said like 40% Britissh (Irish, Scottish, Wales only, no English), and 10% Iberian

    Eurogenes, various calculators came up with a bunch of estimates..usually SE English, SW English, but other calculators put French or Dutch.
    when I plotted K36 into one of those map generators.. the highest numbers were centered around the Breton area, Southern UK, Belgium, and the northern part of Germany. the next highest numbers put the rest of the UK, and Denmark.

    Tolan calculators put Amorica and Orkadian

    One of the ancient calculators said something like Hinxton 5

    my paternal Haplogroup is R-L2

    do these results match those of Breton or other Celtic people in your opinion?
    Could be right, and R1b-L2 is definitely found in Bretagne, though R1b-L21 is more common.

    FTDNA has a Bretagne DNA Project you can join. I used to be the admin of it, but now it's run by a couple of actual Bretons.
     


    Hidden Content


    Y-DNA: R1b-FGC36981 (L21> DF13> Z39589> CTS2501> Z43690> Y8426> BY160> FGC36974>FGC36982 >FGC36981)

    Additional Data:
    Lactase Persistent:
    rs4988235 AA (13910 TT)
    rs182549 TT (22018 AA)

    Red Hair Carrier:
    Arg160Trp+ (rs1805008 T) aka R160W

    Dad's mtDNA: K1a1

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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by cerseilannister View Post

    Tolan calculators put Amorica and Orkadian

    One of the ancient calculators said something like Hinxton 5

    my paternal Haplogroup is R-L2

    do these results match those of Breton or other Celtic people in your opinion?
    I invite you to join the French subforum. A lot of us are Breton and will be happy to help you.

    https://anthrogenica.com/showthread....-Breizh/page63
    My results from David Wesolowski's Ancestry Detective Service:

    West British (Britonic?) 42.3%
    Continental Northern and Eastern European 36.6%
    Central French 21.1%

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  15. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    Could be right, and R1b-L2 is definitely found in Bretagne, though R1b-L21 is more common.

    FTDNA has a Bretagne DNA Project you can join. I used to be the admin of it, but now it's run by a couple of actual Bretons.
    I am U106 not L21 and yet entirely breton.

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  17. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trelvern View Post
    I am U106 not L21 and yet entirely breton.
    Good for you.

    I never said there was no U106 in Bretagne, just that L21 is more common there than L2 (which is downstream of U152).

    At least L21 was the most common y haplogroup when I was running the Bretagne Project. Maybe that has changed.

    I believe the Saxons raided and settled in NW France.
     


    Hidden Content


    Y-DNA: R1b-FGC36981 (L21> DF13> Z39589> CTS2501> Z43690> Y8426> BY160> FGC36974>FGC36982 >FGC36981)

    Additional Data:
    Lactase Persistent:
    rs4988235 AA (13910 TT)
    rs182549 TT (22018 AA)

    Red Hair Carrier:
    Arg160Trp+ (rs1805008 T) aka R160W

    Dad's mtDNA: K1a1

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  19. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    I believe the Saxons raided and settled in NW France.
    I believe they were primarily located in the area around Bayeux in Normandy, where they were known as the Saxones Baiocassensis. Some could have settled in Brittany as well.
    Last edited by GoldenHind; 08-07-2019 at 12:03 AM.

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