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Thread: mtDNA haplogroup C1b (= Native American)?? But they're all from Europe!

  1. #21
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    My autosomal shows no indication of Native American.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by PMCGUN04 View Post
    My autosomal shows no indication of Native American.
    Which means that it was diluted from whatever Celeste de Aldrey had which is probably about 8% or less but somewhere far back she had 100% Native American ancestor. If the only autosomal DNA test you have had is myOrigins then 23andme or AncestryDNA might actually find that you have 1% or more.

  3. #23
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    Is there any chance at all that you great-grandmother was really from Puerto Rico? Puerto Rico, Mexico, and Peru are the 3 main hotspots for C1b. Check "Alberto Gómez-Carballa et al. The complete mitogenome of a 500-year-old Inca child mummy. Scientific Reports 5, Article number: 16462 (2015) doi:10.1038/srep16462".

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanTheMutt View Post
    Is there any chance at all that you great-grandmother was really from Puerto Rico? Puerto Rico, Mexico, and Peru are the 3 main hotspots for C1b. Check "Alberto Gómez-Carballa et al. The complete mitogenome of a 500-year-old Inca child mummy. Scientific Reports 5, Article number: 16462 (2015) doi:10.1038/srep16462".
    His great grandmother was born in Venezuela (see here) and C1b exists in Venezuela. It doesn't matter where a hot spot is. What matters is that it exists, even if at a low frequency, in the country of origin.

    You can see that Venezuelans have C1b in the Supporting Information of the following study

    A melting pot of multicontinental mtDNA lineages in admixed Venezuelans
    Alberto Gómez‐Carballa et al.
    First published: 25 November 2011
    https://doi.org/10.1002/ajpa.21629

    Nearby Colombia also has a lot of C1b. See http://www.ianlogan.co.uk/sequences_..._sequences.htm

    Those C1b from Colombia are from the following study:

    High‐resolution mitochondrial DNA analysis sheds light on human diversity, cultural interactions, and population mobility in Northwestern Amazonia
    Leonardo Arias et al.
    First published: 27 October 2017
    https://doi.org/10.1002/ajpa.23345


    You should also read the following which mentions C1b in Venezuela

    DÍAZ-MATALLANA, Marcela et al. El análisis genético de paleo-colombianos de Nemocón, Cundinamarca proporciona revelaciones sobre el poblamiento temprano del Noroeste de Suramérica. Revista de la Academia Colombiana de Ciencias Exactas, Físicas y Naturales, [S.l.], v. 40, n. 156, p. 461-483, oct. 2016. ISSN 2382-4980. Disponible en: https://www.raccefyn.co/index.php/ra...e/view/328/227
    Last edited by ArmandoR1b; 05-18-2018 at 01:36 PM.

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  6. #25
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    ArmandoR1b - My apologies, my question was intended for the person who started the thread (PMCGUN04). I do not doubt that C1b has long been in Venezuela.

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanTheMutt View Post
    ArmandoR1b - My apologies, my question was intended for the person who started the thread (PMCGUN04). I do not doubt that C1b has long been in Venezuela.
    I understood that your question was for him but there is no reason to think that his great-grandmother was really from Puerto Rico when his great-grandmother was born in Venezuela.
    Last edited by ArmandoR1b; 05-19-2018 at 05:03 PM.

  8. #27
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    Never mind, I don't know how forums work.
    Last edited by LostSlough; 05-27-2018 at 08:30 PM. Reason: missed two pages of conversation

  9. #28
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    Just for the record, I am Cuban. Both parents and myself from the Eastern central part of the island. My parents both have Native American maternal haplogroups. Mine is A2 and my dad's is C1b. He only carries 5% NA, I carry 9% and my mom 12%.

    I have many cousins with lower NA (one with less than 1%) and the most frequently occurring haplogroups are A, B, and C for maternal.

    I think there is something you are missing. Given the fact that it does not show up in your autosomal dna means it's far back enough to where it has been easily overlooked.

  10. #29
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    I don't have Native American mtDNA. My mtDNA traces back to a woman born French Louisiana in 1726. However, I do have some Native American segments from a descendant of hers who inherited that ancestry on a different line.

    In fact, both of my maternal grandmother's maternal grandparents were descended from this ancestor. So in a way I had two chances to inherit a Native American mtDNA haplogroup. Here's why I didn't.

    Obviously, my grandmother's grandfather couldn't pass on his mtDNA, even though he does descend from the Native American ancestor in his mtDNA line

    My grandmother's grandmother -- who also happened to be her husband's second cousin -- was likewise descended from the Native in an all-female line ... until her father, that is. Since she inherited her mtDNA from her mother rather than her father, that's what got passed on to me. So my mtDNA is H1bg.

    However, I have some cousins who are descended from the same Native American ancestor in an all-female line. Their mtDNA haplogroup is C1b.
    Last edited by geebee; 10-01-2018 at 08:25 PM.
    Besides British-German-Catalan, ancestry includes smaller amounts of French, Irish, Swiss, Choctaw & another NA tribe, possibly Catawba. Avatar picture is: my father, his father, & his father's father; baby is my eldest brother.

    GB

  11. #30
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    The thing to keep in mind about the difference between inheritance of Native American segments versus a Native American mtDNA haplogroup is that the former is mainly a function of distance and luck. The latter is a matter of having exactly the right line from a Native American ancestor.

    When I talk about distance and luck, obviously the more generations between an individual and a Native American ancestor, the lower the odds of inheriting DNA from that ancestor. But just because the odds may be against having a detectable segment from an ancestor in a given generation -- say, a 7th great grandparent -- that doesn't mean you won't have any DNA from a group of your 7th great grandparents.

    In fact, 100% of your DNA must have come from some combination of your 7th great grandparents. And from your 10th great grandparents, for that matter. The "luck" part is simply which 7th great grandparents happen to be included in the group.

    In my case, I also have two paths back to the same Native American ancestor. So she had an extra chance to be part of the "group" for me. But just how many "chances" she had are now irrelevant -- she is among my genetic ancestors, not just my genealogical ancestors.

    Of course, for an mtDNA line, distance doesn't matter. MtDNA changes very, very slowly. So if someone is descended via an all-female line from a female Native American ancestor, then that person will have Native American DNA regardless of whether they also inherited an autosomal DNA from that ancestor.

    Even a new defining SNP would only make the haplogroup a subgroup of the Native American ancestor's mtDNA haplogroup -- so it would still be traceable to Native American ancestry. This will be true even in another 10 generations, as long the intervening descendants are all female. (The last descendant in the line can be male, but he won't pass on the mtDNA.)
    Last edited by geebee; 10-01-2018 at 08:51 PM.
    Besides British-German-Catalan, ancestry includes smaller amounts of French, Irish, Swiss, Choctaw & another NA tribe, possibly Catawba. Avatar picture is: my father, his father, & his father's father; baby is my eldest brother.

    GB

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