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Thread: North West Asian "Stan" People.

  1. #1
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    North West Asian "Stan" People.

    There are a number of countries and ethnic groups in the north west Asian region which share the suffix "stan" as part of their name. I understand "stan" means "people". For example, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and so on. Some of the languages are very similar.

    Are these people ethnically/genetically related? Are they tribes of one original culture? Are they part of the Indian genetic tree?

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    Actually, "istan" means roughly "place of the." Think of it as the "-ia"/"y" ending in many European countries and regions (e.g. Bulgaria, Romania, Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia, Albania, etc.; Italy, Hungary, Burgundy, Normandy, Saxony, etc.).

    As with the European examples, the Asian nations are not necessarily genetically and culturally and ethnically and religiously uniform. Some ethnic groups in the nations you mention are linguistically related, others not, and a mixture of cultures went into founding each of these populations. There are similar peoples, for example, living in areas of Afghanistan and Pakistan; but there is also an area of Iran called Luristan, where most people by and large have less in common historically, genetically, or linguistically with most people in Kyrgyzstan.

    Again, this is comparable to Europe: people in Slovenia and Croatia have many similarities, but those in Austria and Russia have rather less in common.
     

    Other ancestral Y lines:

    E1b-M81 Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    E1b-V13 England
    I1-M253 Ireland
    I2-M423 Ukraine
    R1a-L176.1 Scotland
    R1b-L584 Syria/Turkey (Sephardi)
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    R1b-L21 (1)England; (2)Wales?>Connecticut
    R1b-L48 England
    R1b-P312 Scotland
    R1b-FGC32576 Ireland

    Other ancestral mtDNA lines:

    H1b2a Ukraine (Ashkenazi)
    H6a1a3 Ukraine
    K1a9 Belarus (Ashkenazi)
    K1c2 Ireland
    V7a Ukraine

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     Ian B (05-11-2013)

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    From a linguistics paper:

    ...the proliferation of the toponymic suffix -stan in Central Asia. While this morpheme ultimately goes back to Ir[anian] *stāna- ‘place’, only two country names endowed with this suffix, Afghanistan and Tajikistan, have a predominantly Iranian population, and only the former of the two probably has an Iranian root etymology. By contrast, four country names formed according to the same model, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, and Uzbekistan are mostly populated by the Turks, and their designations are based on Turkic ethnic names.

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     Ian B (05-13-2013)

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    Pakistan also has the stan ending. The rest of the world comes from its provinces. I believe P for Punjab, A for Afghania, K for Kashmir and S for Sindh. Not a predominantly Iranian country but significantly Iranian and Indo-Iranian as a whole (the most diverse place for Indo-Iranian languages with populations speaking SE, NW and SW Iranian languages, Indo-Aryan languages, Dardic languages and the Nuristani group of languages.

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    Quote Originally Posted by newtoboard View Post
    Pakistan also has the stan ending. The rest of the world comes from its provinces. I believe P for Punjab, A for Afghania, K for Kashmir and S for Sindh. Not a predominantly Iranian country but significantly Iranian and Indo-Iranian as a whole (the most diverse place for Indo-Iranian languages with populations speaking SE, NW and SW Iranian languages, Indo-Aryan languages, Dardic languages and the Nuristani group of languages.
    That's a very long bow to draw! Do you have any empirical evidence to substantiate this?

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    According to Wikipedia:

    The name Pakistan literally means "Land of the Pure" in Urdu and Persian. It was coined in 1933 as Pakstan by Choudhary Rahmat Ali, a Pakistan Movement activist, who published it in his pamphlet Now or Never, using it as an acronym ("thirty million Muslim brethren who live in PAKSTAN") referring to the names of the five northern regions of the Indian subcontinent: Punjab, North-West Frontier Province (Afghan Province), Kashmir, Sindh, and Baluchistan". The letter i was incorporated to ease pronunciation and form the linguistically correct and meaningful name.
    That of course was before the modern state of Pakistan was established on 14 August 1947 by the partition of India.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakista...odern_Pakistan
    Last edited by Jean M; 05-13-2013 at 09:46 AM.

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     Ian B (05-14-2013)

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    The people in the Stans are predominately made up of Turkic and Indo-Iranian peoples.
    Kazakhstan is mostly made up of Kazakhs with large but declining populations of Russians in the north.
    Uzbekistan has mostly ethnic Uzbeks with Karakalpaks, who are ethnically similar to Kazakhs, around the Aral Sea area and Khwarezm Turks in the west. There are large populations of Tajiks in Samarkand and Bukhara.
    Turkmenistan is predominately Turkmen.
    Tajikistan has a Tajik majority and large Uzbek minorities.
    Kyrgyzstan Is mostly Kyrgyz with large Uzbek populations in the Ferghana valley and a lot of Russian in the capital.
    Northern Afghanistan is mostly Turkmen, Uzbeks and Tajiks as well as Pashtuns placed there from the Taliban era.
    Further south from there I dont know enough to descrive the populations other than to say they are mostly indo-Iranians.

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     DMXX (05-28-2013)

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    Jean, I would never have thought that it could be so simple. Thank you.

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    It's worth pointing out the "-stan" suffix is, in modern Persian, also applied to some countries whose land was not incorporated into any Persian empires at any point. Most notable example that comes to mind is England (Engelestan). You also have places in Asia which didn't have any sustained contact with Persians, but took it up the same way as the Uzbeks and Afghans (i.e. Tatarstan in Russia).

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian B View Post
    That's a very long bow to draw! Do you have any empirical evidence to substantiate this?
    Which part of newtoboard's post do you not agree with?

    I noticed some time ago that the Indus river has, for centuries, served as a natural dividing line between the Iranic (west side) and Indo-Aryan (east side) languages. To this day, the ethnic groups which predominate to the west are Balochi, Hazarangi and Pashtun speaking whereas the eastern side is Punjabi and Sindhi.

    newtoboard is also correct concerning modern Indo-Iranian linguistic diversity being highest in Pakistan. Nowhere else in the region will one find various Indo-Aryan languages, Iranic languages (both east and west) as well as Dardic-Nuristani but there.

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    Although I've read a bit about the region, I'd never heard that the name Pakistan originated as an acronym. I withdraw my comment and accept that the information provided was accurate.

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