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Thread: CTS2457 (L21>DF13>CTS2457)

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    CTS2457 (L21>DF13>CTS2457)

    I inserted CTS2457 into a box under DF13 as appears quite probably to be another DF13 subclade, which is what David R has pointed out.
    http://tinyurl.com/R1b-L21-Tree

    I can find three CTS2457+ people based on David's chart. Let me know if I'm missing anybody. The two Lunney's are a GD=6 at 67, but we don't have an STR haplotype on Lane.

    f159823 Lunney - Ireland, Ulster, Co. Fermanagh, Kinawley Parish
    f159824 Lunney - Ireland, Ulster, Co. Fermanagh
    fN112842 Lane(McLane) - Ireland, Connacht, Co. Roscommon, Athleague

    Here are the suspects in the variety z6171314:

    f108630 Collins DF13+ L513- L96- L144- z6171314 Ireland, Ulster

    f96153 McDonnell DF13+ L513- DF21- DF49- Z255- DF41- L96- L144- L195- L130- L69-
    3c1g z6171314 Ireland, Leinster, Co. Dublin

    fN78670 Cunningham L21+ z6171314 Ireland, Ulster

    CTTS2457 could be considered for broader exploratory testing within DF13* folks,
    but I think the above suspects are critical people to test, especially Collins.
    Of course, we also would like to see Lane(McLane) add Y STRs, the more, there
    merrier.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Reynolds
    Joe Carroll pointed out there was another CTS2457 result, which puts this SNP
    well on its way towards being the 14th clade under R-DF13. I have put the
    CTS2457+ results in their own section at the right edge of the summary table:
    http://daver.info/geno/results/R-L21.pdf

    The CTS2457+ results are in Mike's variety currently named z6171314.

    CTS2457 is available for order from FTDNA.

    http://daver.info/geno/results/OrderSNP.htm
    http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/R.../message/15977
    Last edited by TigerMW; 06-13-2013 at 03:47 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikewww View Post
    I can find three CTS2457+ people based on David's chart. Let me know if I'm missing anybody. The two Lunney's are a GD=6 at 67, but we don't have an STR haplotype on Lane.

    f159823 Lunney - Ireland, Ulster, Co. Fermanagh, Kinawley Parish
    f159824 Lunney - Ireland, Ulster, Co. Fermanagh
    fN112842 Lane(McLane) - Ireland, Connacht, Co. Roscommon, Athleague

    Here are the suspects in the variety z6171314:

    f108630 Collins DF13+ L513- L96- L144- z6171314 Ireland, Ulster

    f96153 McDonnell DF13+ L513- DF21- DF49- Z255- DF41- L96- L144- L195- L130- L69-
    3c1g z6171314 Ireland, Leinster, Co. Dublin

    fN78670 Cunningham L21+ z6171314 Ireland, Ulster

    CTTS2457 could be considered for broader exploratory testing within DF13* folks,
    but I think the above suspects are critical people to test, especially Collins.
    Of course, we also would like to see Lane(McLane) add Y STRs, the more, there
    merrier.

    http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/R.../message/15977
    In addition to further CTS2457 testing, further results for the paternity of this new offspring are required in order to determine if it in fact sits under one of the bigger DF13 sub-clades. McDonnell & Collins SNP tests are a start, but incomplete.
    33809 Caine has several of the above suspects plus Lunney CTS2457+ amongst his STR matches. Origins unknown, but STR matches point towards Co Fermanagh. 33809 Caine has tested L21+ Z2534-.

    Rory

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rory Cain View Post
    In addition to further CTS2457 testing, further results for the paternity of this new offspring are required in order to determine if it in fact sits under one of the bigger DF13 sub-clades. McDonnell & Collins SNP tests are a start, but incomplete.
    33809 Caine has several of the above suspects plus Lunney CTS2457+ amongst his STR matches. Origins unknown, but STR matches point towards Co Fermanagh. 33809 Caine has tested L21+ Z2534-.

    Rory
    Any new news on CTS2457? I think it is worth pursuing but so are a lot of other things.

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    96153 McDonnell came back as CTS2457+ in this morning results. He's fairly heavily tested we can at least tell from his testing that CTS2457 isn't a subclade of:
    L513, DF41, Z255, DF21, DF49, L144 and L96.

    What sort of Genetic distance are we looking at between the CTS2457+ men? Do they meet the requirements for ISOGG diversity. If so then it's a matter of verifing it's position regarding current isogg snp's.

    -Paul
    (DF41+)

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    So which tests narrow the search?

    The McDonnell


    96153 McDonnell came back as CTS2457+ in this morning results. He's fairly heavily tested we can at least tell from his testing that CTS2457 isn't a subclade of:
    L513, DF41, Z255, DF21, DF49, L144 and L96.

    What sort of Genetic distance are we looking at between the CTS2457+ men? Do they meet the requirements for ISOGG diversity. If so then it's a matter of verifing it's position regarding current isogg snp's.

    -Paul
    (DF41+)

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    Quote Originally Posted by MhcDhomhnuill View Post
    So which tests narrow the search?

    The McDonnell

    . . .
    Well, DF21, DF49, L96, L144, L513, and Z255 have been eliminated as upstream of CTS2457.

    That leaves CTS4466, DF41, L1335, Z251, and Z253 yet to be eliminated.

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    Is CTS2457 on the Geno 2.0 list of SNP's? If it then you could use know Geno 2.0 results to determine status with regards to the other SNP's.

    -Paul
    (DF41+)

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    Quote Originally Posted by MhcDhomhnuill View Post
    So which tests narrow the search?

    The McDonnell
    On the R1b-L21 yahoo list the following has been posted:

    ---------- Forwarded message ----------
    From: David Reynolds <[email protected]>
    Date: Thu, Jul 4, 2013 at 10:05 PM
    Subject: [R1b-L21-Project] Re: CTS2457 ready for ISOGG Tree?
    To: [email protected]



    Thanks, Joe.

    In reviewing the results to date, I see two further SNP tests that are needed before we can put CTS2457 on the tree, namely a CTS2457+ person needs to test L1335 and Z251.

    With the addition of a CTS2457+ result for kit 96153 (McDonnell), the diversity requirement is met with a GD of 7/67 for kits 96153 and 159824 (Lunney).

    Also, with the CTS2457+ result for McDonnell, I would say the odds are extremely high that everyone in the current z6171314 variety will test CTS2457+.

    Regards,
    david



    --- In [email protected], "karjoe58" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > All 12 existing SNPs below DF13 are negative for CTS2457 because all have done Gen2 (assuming that there are no no-calls):
    > (L679 is not currently on the ISOGG tree and thus a negative is not needed.)
    >
    > 17624 Megonnigil DF49
    > 130361 Elliott L513
    > 176268 Gontaut L96
    > 130084 Kendall L144
    > N84982 Turner L371
    > N38274 Gaston Z255
    > N16295 Ramsey Z253
    > N57121 Compton DF21
    > 57001 McConnell DF41
    > N59178 Carroll CTS4466
    > 107327 Iles L1335
    > 139697 Godwin Z251
    >
    > Do I have this right? Any comments?
    >
    > ----------- Joe
    >
    To get CTS2457 on the ISOGG tree you will need to test for Z251 and L1335. It appears that all of the existing ISOGG snp's are negative for CTS2457 due to it been on Geno 2.0 chip and members of these clades having tested Geno 2.0.

    -Paul
    (DF41+)

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    L1335 and Z251 ordered
    McDonnell

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikewww View Post
    Any new news on CTS2457? I think it is worth pursuing but so are a lot of other things.
    Mike, I put up the funding for 33809 Cain's CYS3655 test and I see from Cain Project General Funds that Joe Carroll has kindly refunded me. Now waiting for results.

    Rory

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